i would love if you just gave us a blank automated sheet to fill out. Blank sheet with pull downs and automation. The walk you though process is so tedious.
"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
They are talking about the step by step nature of the walkthrough, not just the annoying help text that you can disable if you want.
The builder itself is pretty clunky right now. I expect the much hyped update will make it better, but there's no hard date on that yet and I have little guarantee that the flow of this builder will be changed too much.
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Considering there are plenty of form-fillable and automated character sheets out there, I think a more useful comment/thread might be actual suggestions on how to make the character creation process better for your needs.
Just telling them to get rid of all the hours of work they have put and are still putting (in case you do not know, a overhaul of the whole tool is coming) into the CC and that you just want the most basic and bland possible way (imho) of creating a character, which you can already do with other resources, is really disrespectful.
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Considering there are plenty of form-fillable and automated character sheets out there, I think a more useful comment/thread might be actual suggestions on how to make the character creation process better for your needs.
Just telling them to get rid of all the hours of work they have put and are still putting (in case you do not know, a overhaul of the whole tool is coming) into the CC and that you just want the most basic and bland possible way (imho) of creating a character, which you can already do with other resources, is really disrespectful.
Are there form-fillable character sheets that has access to all the books that I bought? (No, there isn't. At least not since WOTC started going after such products with a passion). If people want a simpler option for character creation with online access to all the material they purchased through DNDBeyond, what's wrong with that? There was an amazing PDF in the DMSGuild. WOTC took it down. Fine, that's their right. But taking down superior (IMHO) products in order to deliver an inferior, though much more complicated, product leaves them open to requests and criticism from paying customers who don't like the direction the product is heading.
It's not about 'getting rid of all the hours of work', it's about offering OPTIONS.
It's not about disrespect, it's about asking for formats aimed at more advanced players who don't need a step-by-step character creator, but still want the information from the books they've purchased automatically added.
I'm with you on this one, I love the form fillable character sheets, it lets my make adjustments easily instead of having to go through the whole creation process. Plus I really like the look of the classic character sheet, even a digital form similar to the PDF output would be great. Just as Dave says, having that as an option would be great, I couldn't imagine that taking much if any development time either.
Considering there are plenty of form-fillable and automated character sheets out there, I think a more useful comment/thread might be actual suggestions on how to make the character creation process better for your needs.
Just telling them to get rid of all the hours of work they have put and are still putting (in case you do not know, a overhaul of the whole tool is coming) into the CC and that you just want the most basic and bland possible way (imho) of creating a character, which you can already do with other resources, is really disrespectful.
Are there form-fillable character sheets that has access to all the books that I bought? (No, there isn't. At least not since WOTC started going after such products with a passion). If people want a simpler option for character creation with online access to all the material they purchased through DNDBeyond, what's wrong with that? There was an amazing PDF in the DMSGuild. WOTC took it down. Fine, that's their right. But taking down superior (IMHO) products in order to deliver an inferior, though much more complicated, product leaves them open to requests and criticism from paying customers who don't like the direction the product is heading.
It's not about 'getting rid of all the hours of work', it's about offering OPTIONS.
It's not about disrespect, it's about asking for formats aimed at more advanced players who don't need a step-by-step character creator, but still want the information from the books they've purchased automatically added.
Put in these terms I can get behind such a request. The OP was quite the opposite of a constructive criticism/request for ADDITIONAL options, imho.
I might have been quick to jump, but I found the tone, lack of proper explanation and general wording to be quite disrespectful of the work done by the DDB team. It translates very easily to "this is horrible, just get rid of it and give us something else" (again, I understand that might be just me).
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
@Lek: Regardless of the tone, the criticism is a fair one, and the OP is not the first to complain about the current character creation process. I really don't like having to jump back and forth, and don't understand why it doesn't start with ability scores. I also don't understand why there isn't an option to "random roll" ability scores in the creation process. As it stands now, if a player wants to use random roll method, as opposed to standard array or point buy, they have to do it with the DM present (if the DM doesn't trust players). If there was a random roll option that locked in the rolls, then let you assign to abilities, DMs could rest assured that players with random ability determined characters didn't cheat.
I for one also want a simple character sheet to fill out.
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You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
@Lek: Regardless of the tone, the criticism is a fair one, and the OP is not the first to complain about the current character creation process. I really don't like having to jump back and forth, and don't understand why it doesn't start with ability scores. I also don't understand why there isn't an option to "random roll" ability scores in the creation process. As it stands now, if a player wants to use random roll method, as opposed to standard array or point buy, they have to do it with the DM present (if the DM doesn't trust players). If there was a random roll option that locked in the rolls, then let you assign to abilities, DMs could rest assured that players with random ability determined characters didn't cheat.
I for one also want a simple character sheet to fill out.
Again, this kind of criticism, with actual points on what is not working for you, I can understand and is something that can be world on.
Just saying I don't like it, change it, full stop is as counter-constructive as it gets.
I am not against complaints or criticisms, as long as it is constructive and articulated.
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Considering there are plenty of form-fillable and automated character sheets out there, I think a more useful comment/thread might be actual suggestions on how to make the character creation process better for your needs.
Just telling them to get rid of all the hours of work they have put and are still putting (in case you do not know, a overhaul of the whole tool is coming) into the CC and that you just want the most basic and bland possible way (imho) of creating a character, which you can already do with other resources, is really disrespectful.
Are there form-fillable character sheets that has access to all the books that I bought? (No, there isn't. At least not since WOTC started going after such products with a passion). If people want a simpler option for character creation with online access to all the material they purchased through DNDBeyond, what's wrong with that? There was an amazing PDF in the DMSGuild. WOTC took it down. Fine, that's their right. But taking down superior (IMHO) products in order to deliver an inferior, though much more complicated, product leaves them open to requests and criticism from paying customers who don't like the direction the product is heading.
It's not about 'getting rid of all the hours of work', it's about offering OPTIONS.
It's not about disrespect, it's about asking for formats aimed at more advanced players who don't need a step-by-step character creator, but still want the information from the books they've purchased automatically added.
Put in these terms I can get behind such a request. The OP was quite the opposite of a constructive criticism/request for ADDITIONAL options, imho.
I might have been quick to jump, but I found the tone, lack of proper explanation and general wording to be quite disrespectful of the work done by the DDB team. It translates very easily to "this is horrible, just get rid of it and give us something else" (again, I understand that might be just me).
I meant no disrespect. As other have said, other awesome independent sheets have been nerfed by WoTC. I am not a programmer nor a designer. I had several great sheets I was using and now they are gone. I pay for DDB, so I would hope DDB could provide something better then what many fans provided for free.
Just saying I don't like it, change it, full stop is as counter-constructive as it gets.
He/she literally said...
a blank automated sheet to fill out. Blank sheet with pull downs and automation.
That counts as constructive feedback to me.
A blank sheet.
Pull down choices.
Automation.
Then maybe we have a different concept of constructive criticism (it can happen, no harm no foul). For me constructive criticism should be aimed to improve what is already there as much as possible, not asking for something quite different. I am not a programmer myself, but I am not sure the current version of the CC could be easily transformed in "just a blank sheet with drop-down choices and automation".
But I understand it might just be me feeling it this way, and I am sorry if I offended anyone with my reply, I just think that explaining what is not working in the current system, proposing possible solution within that system (as stretched as they might get) AND then propose the alternative addition of what the OP was asking would have resulted in a more useful post.
I have nothing against @DaBot , really, I'd just like for the forum to be a place where we describe what we think it's not working and help the team find solutions within what is already here. I personally like the ideas and structure at the base of the current character creation tool. Certainly it needs work, but from there to ask to scrap it and change to something quite different (again this is the impression *I* got from the original post, I do not pretend everyone else agrees) there's a bit of a difference, and it doesn't feel really constructive.
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
@Lek, I don't think anyone is asking to scrap it. There is no reason they cannot coexist. One does not preclude the other. I would like to see both. I appreciate the effort it would likely take to create it, and for now what we have works. That said, once they have the CC finished to their (our) liking, if they could consider adding a fillable character sheet as a new project, that would be cool.
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You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
@Lek, I don't think anyone is asking to scrap it. There is no reason they cannot coexist. One does not preclude the other. I would like to see both. I appreciate the effort it would likely take to create it, and for now what we have works. That said, once they have the CC finished to their (our) liking, if they could consider adding a fillable character sheet as a new project, that would be cool.
I most certainly and wholeheartedly agree there is no reason the two things cannot coexist, as I certainly hope no one is asking DDB to get rid of what they've done :)
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Okay guys let's get along. I do agree the process should change but I don't just want a sheet. I think it should go like this:
1. Choose Race. 2. Set Ability Scores, on the same screen have a drop down for Race to quickly change Race and see the ability scores change. 3. Choose Background. 4. Choose Class.
Okay guys let's get along. I do agree the process should change but I don't just want a sheet. I think it should go like this:
But many do want just a sheet. This is a request for options. If I want to make a character quickly, I prefer to just do a sheet with drop downs. MorePurpleMoreBetter's sheet from DMSguild was amazing. I understand why WOTC took it down, but it made character building and leveling up so much easier than what we have now. Many of us used that, and want something like it through DDB, along side a more new-user friendly character builder.
Okay guys let's get along. I do agree the process should change but I don't just want a sheet. I think it should go like this:
1. Choose Race. 2. Set Ability Scores, on the same screen have a drop down for Race to quickly change Race and see the ability scores change. 3. Choose Background. 4. Choose Class.
The D&D 5th edition Player's Handbook has a very specific order for character building, which was derived from 2 years of feedback from the play test groups.
Select Race.
Select Class.
Determine Ability Scores
Select Background
This might not be the order that everyone prefers (it's not the way I do it personally) but it is the way that works best for the majority of players.
The Curse team have replicated this for the builder experience on D&D Beyond for this reason.
Okay guys let's get along. I do agree the process should change but I don't just want a sheet. I think it should go like this:
But many do want just a sheet. This is a request for options. If I want to make a character quickly, I prefer to just do a sheet with drop downs. MorePurpleMoreBetter's sheet from DMSguild was amazing. I understand why WOTC took it down, but it made character building and leveling up so much easier than what we have now. Many of us used that, and want something like it through DDB, along side a more new-user friendly character builder.
The removal of the MPMB sheet is what prompted my OP. I actually never planned to use the DDB character sheet, just to purchase the books for easy search and access. But when MPMB was nerfed and I tried the DDB sheet, I was so disappointed.
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i would love if you just gave us a blank automated sheet to fill out. Blank sheet with pull downs and automation. The walk you though process is so tedious.
Do you have Show Help Text on? That maybe your problem as it is automatically turned on.
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"The relevant equation is: Knowledge = power = energy = matter = mass; a good bookshop is just a genteel Black Hole that knows how to read." - Terry Pratchett
They are talking about the step by step nature of the walkthrough, not just the annoying help text that you can disable if you want.
The builder itself is pretty clunky right now. I expect the much hyped update will make it better, but there's no hard date on that yet and I have little guarantee that the flow of this builder will be changed too much.
No. I have the help off. Just don’t like the step by step. It’s clunky.
How do you get a one-armed goblin out of a tree?
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Considering there are plenty of form-fillable and automated character sheets out there, I think a more useful comment/thread might be actual suggestions on how to make the character creation process better for your needs.
Just telling them to get rid of all the hours of work they have put and are still putting (in case you do not know, a overhaul of the whole tool is coming) into the CC and that you just want the most basic and bland possible way (imho) of creating a character, which you can already do with other resources, is really disrespectful.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
I'm with you on this one, I love the form fillable character sheets, it lets my make adjustments easily instead of having to go through the whole creation process. Plus I really like the look of the classic character sheet, even a digital form similar to the PDF output would be great. Just as Dave says, having that as an option would be great, I couldn't imagine that taking much if any development time either.
The OP was quite the opposite of a constructive criticism/request for ADDITIONAL options, imho.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
@Lek: Regardless of the tone, the criticism is a fair one, and the OP is not the first to complain about the current character creation process. I really don't like having to jump back and forth, and don't understand why it doesn't start with ability scores. I also don't understand why there isn't an option to "random roll" ability scores in the creation process. As it stands now, if a player wants to use random roll method, as opposed to standard array or point buy, they have to do it with the DM present (if the DM doesn't trust players). If there was a random roll option that locked in the rolls, then let you assign to abilities, DMs could rest assured that players with random ability determined characters didn't cheat.
I for one also want a simple character sheet to fill out.
You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
He/she literally said...
That counts as constructive feedback to me.
You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
I am not a programmer myself, but I am not sure the current version of the CC could be easily transformed in "just a blank sheet with drop-down choices and automation".
I personally like the ideas and structure at the base of the current character creation tool. Certainly it needs work, but from there to ask to scrap it and change to something quite different (again this is the impression *I* got from the original post, I do not pretend everyone else agrees) there's a bit of a difference, and it doesn't feel really constructive.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
@Lek, I don't think anyone is asking to scrap it. There is no reason they cannot coexist. One does not preclude the other. I would like to see both. I appreciate the effort it would likely take to create it, and for now what we have works. That said, once they have the CC finished to their (our) liking, if they could consider adding a fillable character sheet as a new project, that would be cool.
You don't OWN your books on DDB: WotC can change them any time. What do you think will happen when OneD&D comes out?
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Okay guys let's get along. I do agree the process should change but I don't just want a sheet. I think it should go like this:
1. Choose Race.
2. Set Ability Scores, on the same screen have a drop down for Race to quickly change Race and see the ability scores change.
3. Choose Background.
4. Choose Class.
This might not be the order that everyone prefers (it's not the way I do it personally) but it is the way that works best for the majority of players.
The Curse team have replicated this for the builder experience on D&D Beyond for this reason.
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