I saw the psionics feats and characters in TCoE and that me wonder: has anyone heard anything about wOtC bring back psionics as a full fledged “thing”? I enjoyed it back in 1-3.5e and would be interested in seeing a full fledged version of it for 5e.
Short answer: no. Wizards has no intention of implementing "psionics" in 5e beyond what we got in Tasha's Cauldron.
Long answer: you have opened up a sore spot for a few very vocal members of the community and can expect this thread to become very heated indeed. Get your flame-proof undies and may your deity of choice have mercy on your buttcheeks.
"Psionic creatures and abilities have been in the current edition since its launch in 2014. Monsters and NPCs with psionic powers appear in a number of 5th-edition books, including the Monster Manual, Volo’s Guide to Monsters, Mordenkainen’s Tome of Foes, Out of the Abyss, Guildmasters’ Guide to Ravnica, Acquisitions Incorporated, and Eberron: Rising from the Last War.
In 2017, we experimented with an unofficial character class—the mystic—focused on psionic powers. Through its features and subclasses, the mystic allowed you to create a character who echoed the abilities of other classes in the game but with a psionic twist. As much as many playtesters enjoyed the psionic themes in the mystic, feedback was also clear that the class encroached on other classes’ territory and that it was often too complex, too powerful, or both. Following that feedback, we’ve decided to say farewell to the mystic and explore other ways of giving players psi-themed powers, as we did with the features of the Great Old One warlock in the Player’s Handbook.
In 2019 and now in 2020, we’re enjoying that exploration, looking into providing options (subclasses, spells, and feats) that allow different types of characters to manifest psionic power.
The philosophy of this approach is most akin to the one taken in the 1st edition of D&D, where psionic powers weren’t the domain of any particular class but were available for characters of different types to experience. We’ve crafted the new options in this article to work seamlessly with the D&D you’re already playing. And hearing your desire for psionic options to feel like one another in some way, we’ve woven a common thread through the psionic subclasses and feats: the Psionic Talent die. We invite you to try out these new options the same way you try out any other subclass, spell, or feat. And as always, we look forward to hearing what you think!"
I saw the psionics feats and characters in TCoE and that me wonder: has anyone heard anything about wOtC bring back psionics as a full fledged “thing”? I enjoyed it back in 1-3.5e and would be interested in seeing a full fledged version of it for 5e.
The closest we're going to get we mostly already have: Sorcerers who take Subtle Spell. What we really need is something akin to what Artificers get - a non-homebrew mechanism by which a Sorcerer can effectively use themselves as their focus - and that'll be the final step; all 5E psionics are, on a core level, are componentless spells, sometimes (as with Mage Hand) with the spell modified to also give off fewer sensory cues as to its functioning.
Ok let me ask this since I seem to be blind reading thru spell caster info. What real benefit does a caster get for using a focus?
They can use it instead of material components in any spell that they cast.
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All stars fade. Some stars forever fall. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Homebrew:Magic Items,Monsters,Spells,Subclasses ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If there was no light, people wouldn't fear the dark.
If you want to see what psionics really looked like you’ll have to go back to the 1&2e psionics handbooks - a full system of psionics that could actually really be translated almost whole into 5e. There were a couple of things wrong back then - mostly the speed which was 10x faster than spell casting. In the old days everyone just slowed it down to standard times. It was a point based system with points based on level and I+W+Ch bonuses and with abilities ranked much like spells and spell levels. Think of it as a sorceror with lots more points but no spell slots converting those points into slots and metamagic options.
I'd wondered, having not really looked into the specific of the Mystic class, why they abandoned it instead of just tweaking it to be less complicated or OP. But if there was also the concern that it fundamentally stepped on the toes of other classes, that makes more sense to me.
I'd like to see a couple more subclasses, like a psionic wizard, but I think the subclasses are generally a good way to go about it. Wizard is the only one where the absence feels weird to me, but I certainly wouldn't mind other classes getting one too.
It's unofficial content, but if anyone wants to play a psionic monk, the Grim Hollow Player's Guide has a Way of the Leaden Crown monk subclass with a psionic theme to it if your DM is open to third party books/homebrew.
I’m not really surprised, psion were much closer to sorcerors - innate casters. They had a subclasses based on the types of mental abilities they had but could draw to a limited extent from all areas. They had 3 basic types - psion (wizard), psywarrior (soulknife), wilding (limited abilities).
The psion is basically mental sorceror with it the major limits on number of spells- you typically got 2-3 abilities each level. So it was a major step on the wizards powers. I suspect that is why we don’t see it in 5e .
This is more a "Am I remembering this right?" post.
I remember Psionic manuals or splatbooks or what have you in 2e, since psionics weren't part of the initial core books in 2e. I don't remember psionics getting a dedicated publication in AD&D though. I thought psionics were relegated to an optional appendix I think in the DMG. (sorta like Bards, which might have been an appendix to PHB, not sure), where psionics weren't just aberrations in the game world, but also mechanical flukes, you had to have certain stats and roll a certain statistically unlikely percentile to have a psionic character in (appendix) RAW. The psionic powers made available to you were a considerable boost to a 1st level character of any class that could land them and definitely made them "special" in any party. I sorta figured they were out of 2e until some mechanics were figured out how to make it more balanced, and they opted to do so by making Psi's a class, but maybe something other characters could gain access to a la Dark Sun?
It wasn’t 1e, I just checked my old manuals. 2e Had the AD&D PHB rules supplement: the complete psionics handbook. then 3e had the D&D Expanded Psionics Handbook
the mechanics are somewhat different in each but easy enough to adapt to 5e in both cases. 2e just had psion sand wild talents. 3e had a number of races including the three-Kleenex and 4 classes: psion, psychic warrior, soul knife (rogue) and Wilder.
Yes and AD&D had the statistical fluke, 1-10% chance (dependent on INT/WIS/CHR) system of assigning psionic powers in game. The AD&D system made psionic gifts a statistical fluke as opposed to something you could design. My curiosity since I remember them found a pretty good historic overview. I remember thinking the rules were neat, and this was a time where more folks did believe in the luck of the dice in character creation and determining what sort. of character you _could_ play based on what you rolled rather strictly what you wanted to play (and that's a perjorative to neither method/philosophy, I still enjoy both styles of character creation over a number of systems). Anyway, I like this person's overall history of psionics in. D&D project, it's a pretty fun read:
I played some D&D many years ago and loved the psionic class. Getting back into it now in order to get something similar I am playing an Aberrant Mind sorcerer and besides choosing many of the psychic/controller spells I am simply flavoring his abilities as being telepathic or telekinetic rather than affecting the weave. For example in one of the second generation Xmen movies Jean Grey makes her and her companions invisible by influencing the minds of those who may look in their direction rather than actually becoming invisible.
You might also be able to convince your DM to allow the optional spell points rules which is similar to the old psionic point system.
I saw the psionics feats and characters in TCoE and that me wonder: has anyone heard anything about wOtC bring back psionics as a full fledged “thing”? I enjoyed it back in 1-3.5e and would be interested in seeing a full fledged version of it for 5e.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Short answer: no. Wizards has no intention of implementing "psionics" in 5e beyond what we got in Tasha's Cauldron.
Long answer: you have opened up a sore spot for a few very vocal members of the community and can expect this thread to become very heated indeed. Get your flame-proof undies and may your deity of choice have mercy on your buttcheeks.
Please do not contact or message me.
"Psionic creatures and abilities have been in the current edition since its launch in 2014. Monsters and NPCs with psionic powers appear in a number of 5th-edition books, including the Monster Manual, Volo’s Guide to Monsters, Mordenkainen’s Tome of Foes, Out of the Abyss, Guildmasters’ Guide to Ravnica, Acquisitions Incorporated, and Eberron: Rising from the Last War.
In 2017, we experimented with an unofficial character class—the mystic—focused on psionic powers. Through its features and subclasses, the mystic allowed you to create a character who echoed the abilities of other classes in the game but with a psionic twist. As much as many playtesters enjoyed the psionic themes in the mystic, feedback was also clear that the class encroached on other classes’ territory and that it was often too complex, too powerful, or both. Following that feedback, we’ve decided to say farewell to the mystic and explore other ways of giving players psi-themed powers, as we did with the features of the Great Old One warlock in the Player’s Handbook.
In 2019 and now in 2020, we’re enjoying that exploration, looking into providing options (subclasses, spells, and feats) that allow different types of characters to manifest psionic power.
The philosophy of this approach is most akin to the one taken in the 1st edition of D&D, where psionic powers weren’t the domain of any particular class but were available for characters of different types to experience. We’ve crafted the new options in this article to work seamlessly with the D&D you’re already playing. And hearing your desire for psionic options to feel like one another in some way, we’ve woven a common thread through the psionic subclasses and feats: the Psionic Talent die. We invite you to try out these new options the same way you try out any other subclass, spell, or feat. And as always, we look forward to hearing what you think!"
Source: UA2020_PsionicOptions.pdf (wizards.com)
WotC is specifically focusing on subclasses, spells and feats to get the Psionic feel. They will likely not have a stand alone class for it.
The closest we're going to get we mostly already have: Sorcerers who take Subtle Spell. What we really need is something akin to what Artificers get - a non-homebrew mechanism by which a Sorcerer can effectively use themselves as their focus - and that'll be the final step; all 5E psionics are, on a core level, are componentless spells, sometimes (as with Mage Hand) with the spell modified to also give off fewer sensory cues as to its functioning.
I guess I’ll have to retcon the NPC PCs from 1-3.5 back to sorcerous like they were in 4e.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Ok let me ask this since I seem to be blind reading thru spell caster info. What real benefit does a caster get for using a focus?
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
They can use it instead of material components in any spell that they cast.
All stars fade. Some stars forever fall.
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Homebrew: Magic Items, Monsters, Spells, Subclasses
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If there was no light, people wouldn't fear the dark.
Allows casting spells with M components without the material, unless the material is either expensive or consumed when casting the spell.
I backed them mainly for the Psion, also because I love their work, but mostly for the Psion.
psionic sub classes are fun, but we still need one for wizard, artificer, paladin, barbarian, and a psonic elf sub race would be amazing.
If you want to see what psionics really looked like you’ll have to go back to the 1&2e psionics handbooks - a full system of psionics that could actually really be translated almost whole into 5e. There were a couple of things wrong back then - mostly the speed which was 10x faster than spell casting. In the old days everyone just slowed it down to standard times. It was a point based system with points based on level and I+W+Ch bonuses and with abilities ranked much like spells and spell levels. Think of it as a sorceror with lots more points but no spell slots converting those points into slots and metamagic options.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
I'd wondered, having not really looked into the specific of the Mystic class, why they abandoned it instead of just tweaking it to be less complicated or OP. But if there was also the concern that it fundamentally stepped on the toes of other classes, that makes more sense to me.
I'd like to see a couple more subclasses, like a psionic wizard, but I think the subclasses are generally a good way to go about it. Wizard is the only one where the absence feels weird to me, but I certainly wouldn't mind other classes getting one too.
It's unofficial content, but if anyone wants to play a psionic monk, the Grim Hollow Player's Guide has a Way of the Leaden Crown monk subclass with a psionic theme to it if your DM is open to third party books/homebrew.
Well, there was a psionic subclass for wizards that was done in Unearthed Arcana several years ago, but it didn't make the cut to print.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I’m not really surprised, psion were much closer to sorcerors - innate casters. They had a subclasses based on the types of mental abilities they had but could draw to a limited extent from all areas. They had 3 basic types - psion (wizard), psywarrior (soulknife), wilding (limited abilities).
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
The psion is basically mental sorceror with it the major limits on number of spells- you typically got 2-3 abilities each level. So it was a major step on the wizards powers. I suspect that is why we don’t see it in 5e .
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
This is more a "Am I remembering this right?" post.
I remember Psionic manuals or splatbooks or what have you in 2e, since psionics weren't part of the initial core books in 2e. I don't remember psionics getting a dedicated publication in AD&D though. I thought psionics were relegated to an optional appendix I think in the DMG. (sorta like Bards, which might have been an appendix to PHB, not sure), where psionics weren't just aberrations in the game world, but also mechanical flukes, you had to have certain stats and roll a certain statistically unlikely percentile to have a psionic character in (appendix) RAW. The psionic powers made available to you were a considerable boost to a 1st level character of any class that could land them and definitely made them "special" in any party. I sorta figured they were out of 2e until some mechanics were figured out how to make it more balanced, and they opted to do so by making Psi's a class, but maybe something other characters could gain access to a la Dark Sun?
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
It wasn’t 1e, I just checked my old manuals. 2e Had the AD&D PHB rules supplement: the complete psionics handbook.
then 3e had the D&D Expanded Psionics Handbook
the mechanics are somewhat different in each but easy enough to adapt to 5e in both cases. 2e just had psion sand wild talents. 3e had a number of races including the three-Kleenex and 4 classes: psion, psychic warrior, soul knife (rogue) and Wilder.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Yes and AD&D had the statistical fluke, 1-10% chance (dependent on INT/WIS/CHR) system of assigning psionic powers in game. The AD&D system made psionic gifts a statistical fluke as opposed to something you could design. My curiosity since I remember them found a pretty good historic overview. I remember thinking the rules were neat, and this was a time where more folks did believe in the luck of the dice in character creation and determining what sort. of character you _could_ play based on what you rolled rather strictly what you wanted to play (and that's a perjorative to neither method/philosophy, I still enjoy both styles of character creation over a number of systems). Anyway, I like this person's overall history of psionics in. D&D project, it's a pretty fun read:
https://wastedlandsfantasy.blogspot.com/2019/01/psionics-in-dungeons-dragons-part-ii.html
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
I played some D&D many years ago and loved the psionic class. Getting back into it now in order to get something similar I am playing an Aberrant Mind sorcerer and besides choosing many of the psychic/controller spells I am simply flavoring his abilities as being telepathic or telekinetic rather than affecting the weave. For example in one of the second generation Xmen movies Jean Grey makes her and her companions invisible by influencing the minds of those who may look in their direction rather than actually becoming invisible.
You might also be able to convince your DM to allow the optional spell points rules which is similar to the old psionic point system.
Now we're just waiting for it to be shipped. This month, I'm told.