You do realize that nothing released in the manuals does any form of retconning on the other media, and that- given that Tannis is an NPC- having a player facing race/species option is meaningless with regard to whether or not they could design a statblock for him going forward, right?
Being someone who identifies as Mexican American, I appreciated the half-species. I was able to relate with part of two different ethnicities or in DnD two different species. I did not consider either species as “better” than another. It spiced up my games with a mixture of flavors that in the PH24 is now missing. I no longer “see” where I fit in this brave new world.
So Tanis Half-Elven is going to be retconned to be human? WTH is wrong with WOTC? Half-elves and Half-orcs have been here since I started plating in the 1st Edition days. Some things just need to be left alone. Like trying to change drow to be light-purple skinned and not the jet-black, eboned skinned elves that they are.
No, Tanis Half-Elven is still going to be a half-elf, it's just that during character creation the player picks "human" or "elf".
The rote offical answer is "play the 2014 versions." Which just does NOT work for half-elves, as you're playing an elf that gives up three spells, the ability to Trance, and another bonus in exchange for one extra skill.
The game is ours. We can have whatever we want in the game subject to DM approval. The only time it would affect a DM or a player is if they are participating in organized play.
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Rule Zero: Make the game your own
Online Resources This is a small list of things that can be helpful to a DM be they new or experienced Covering everything from cartography, campaign management and virtual Tabletop environments.
the suggestion in the playtest was pick the race you want, say elf or human, and fluff it as half elf. Half races are gone because they are politically divisive. They're not going to return. I don't like it, and I don't have to. I just have to accept the new reality, and so does everyone else.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
the suggestion in the playtest was pick the race you want, say elf or human, and fluff it as half elf. Half races are gone because they are politically divisive. They're not going to return. I don't like it, and I don't have to. I just have to accept the new reality, and so does everyone else.
They're not politically divisive - please point me to the people complaining about Half Elves or Half Orcs existing in BG3? It's a phantom cause. It's made up, and removing them is actually -way- more divisive because there are lots of people who call themselves half-something, me included.
Mixed race people exist and the idea that they don't is outrageous. I didn't notice WoTC or Larian suffering any problems because of Shadowheart in BG3. In fact, I think this very website decided to give us her character sheet with the words 'Half-Elf' plastered on it quite recently. Nevermind that particular character being central to so much marketing.
I do not have to accept 'that new reality.' I will be quite happy to point out how offensive it is that they have been removed, both in terms of erasing iconic mixed race characters from their game and in removing something that has been in DND since near its origins. I am hoping they change their minds because it is genuinely baffling.
If they REALLY don't want to use the term then at least copy Paizo and give us new words for elf-blooded and orc-blooded humans and do it that way. OR give us rules for mixed heritage and use them as examples given they're so iconic.
This was gone over ad nauseum during the play test process. There were a lot of people who didn’t like it, myself included. It is what it is.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
The problem seemed to be that whatever they had, or came up with, there were people of mixed ethnicities that complained.
Before: "why do only humans get to be half-anything, and why only elves and orcs?"
UA: "why do I have to choose one and just flavor the other?"
Now: "why are mixed-species erased?" (I don't think this has actually happened in terms of reconning lore or anything like that)
I said it before, but my feeling is that WotC just didn't see a satisfactory way of doing it, so they left it out completely. Now, I don't have access to the 5.24 DMG yet, but if there's anything in there about customizing species or creating new ones, then that's all you need. Great? No. But I figure they decided that if they were going to make a segment of the population angry with mixed-species rules no matter what, they might as well not waste the money and print space in the books...
*Note that if they were going to address the first problem (only humans and only those two non-human species), then they'd need rules for 45 different "half-species". I don't think that's feasible and the "short and sweet" version of the rules were definitely divisive.
Haven’t done a cover to cover read, but nothing jumps out for guidelines on homebrewing species. Honestly, the UA concept is probably out there in the community enough that it’ll remain as an unofficial option, and it’s not like it actually requires anymore bookkeeping than averaging the lifespans, which Beyond has never tracked as a trait.
So here's something that happens when you're an under represented minority. Sometimes bad representation is better than no representation, or at least it feels that way. I honestly think the way Half Elves and Half Orcs were represented was terrible and bigoted. But if you are someone who is desperately yearning for representation in media, and I've been there, it feels terrible when some of the few examples you know of are taken away. I get it. They were still terrible, though.
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Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
the taldorei book has great guidance on how to handle this. maybe they couldnt use it for IP reasons... but it is there if you want to include it or ask your DM about it
The 2024 PHM details how to bring species over from the old book. You just ignore the ASI from those species, and use the Origin Feats in the new PHB instead. Eazy Peazy.
As a person of mixed heritage, this subject has me very annoyed. Because I'm basically a Half Elf IRL due to my mom being of one minority ancestry and my dad being from Northern European Ancestry I have gotten bigotry because of my moms ancestry, and even my father was bigoted to my moms ancestry... never knew why she stayed with him.
So for me Half-Elves felt like me. I had a strong connection to them as they felt like me.
The reasoning for why they removed them was stated in the least respectful way to people with my kind of heritage, in the name of trying to be sensitive, they removed the one group of people I most identified with.
I'm angry not because of the lack of inclusion, but for what they said about it. Heaven knows the lack of inclusion for my combo of minorities is big as in I can't think of one character with my background in all of fiction besides a joke character or two.
So yeah D&D had the best rep for me, and it's gone. Not in the DMG, and thanks to what little was said officially it was kind of insulting even if they didn't realize it.
As a person of mixed heritage, this subject has me very annoyed. Because I'm basically a Half Elf IRL due to my mom being of one minority ancestry and my dad being from Northern European Ancestry I have gotten bigotry because of my moms ancestry, and even my father was bigoted to my moms ancestry... never knew why she stayed with him.
So for me Half-Elves felt like me. I had a strong connection to them as they felt like me.
The reasoning for why they removed them was stated in the least respectful way to people with my kind of heritage, in the name of trying to be sensitive, they removed the one group of people I most identified with.
I'm angry not because of the lack of inclusion, but for what they said about it. Heaven knows the lack of inclusion for my combo of minorities is big as in I can't think of one character with my background in all of fiction besides a joke character or two.
So yeah D&D had the best rep for me, and it's gone. Not in the DMG, and thanks to what little was said officially it was kind of insulting even if they didn't realize it.
I don't think there's really a way that they can make everyone happy, neighbor. I have my issues with WOTC, but no matter what they choose in this case, they're going to be attacked for it. In that regard, eventually, people will get used to the "new normal" whereas with the old way, people who were opposed will just keep attacking them. They took the easy way out and in doing so, alienated some folks like yourself.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
I don't think there's really a way that they can make everyone happy, neighbor. I have my issues with WOTC, but no matter what they choose in this case, they're going to be attacked for it. In that regard, eventually, people will get used to the "new normal" whereas with the old way, people who were opposed will just keep attacking them. They took the easy way out and in doing so, alienated some folks like yourself.
It's always easier to appease the Majority at the sacrifice of the minority. I just want you to think about that. Because that is the justification for some of the worst tragedies in human history. It's something that is looming over Western Civilization right now, and I see no good coming of it.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
The problem seemed to be that whatever they had, or came up with, there were people of mixed ethnicities that complained.
Before: "why do only humans get to be half-anything, and why only elves and orcs?"
UA: "why do I have to choose one and just flavor the other?"
Now: "why are mixed-species erased?" (I don't think this has actually happened in terms of reconning lore or anything like that)
I said it before, but my feeling is that WotC just didn't see a satisfactory way of doing it, so they left it out completely. Now, I don't have access to the 5.24 DMG yet, but if there's anything in there about customizing species or creating new ones, then that's all you need. Great? No. But I figure they decided that if they were going to make a segment of the population angry with mixed-species rules no matter what, they might as well not waste the money and print space in the books...
*Note that if they were going to address the first problem (only humans and only those two non-human species), then they'd need rules for 45 different "half-species". I don't think that's feasible and the "short and sweet" version of the rules were definitely divisive.
With respect, problem 1 is minor. It worked. The problem of “we can’t do infinite mixed races” is not a reason to remove the two iconic varieties we’ve benefited from and enjoyed for editions.
Erasing them entirely does not help anyone, and I hope they are attacked over it to the point that they go back.
This topic is confusing... What makes being half-whatever species different then being any other species? Is this just people wanting to hear that it's alright to write 'half' infront of their species?? Also does it impact or change anything game-wise being half-whatever species??
Wouldn't half-whatever species only last for one generation or are people looking to make species that are 1/16th whatever species?? Does an ingame characters genetic history even matter??
Sorry if coming across as insensitive but me just don't understand
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You do realize that nothing released in the manuals does any form of retconning on the other media, and that- given that Tannis is an NPC- having a player facing race/species option is meaningless with regard to whether or not they could design a statblock for him going forward, right?
Being someone who identifies as Mexican American, I appreciated the half-species. I was able to relate with part of two different ethnicities or in DnD two different species. I did not consider either species as “better” than another. It spiced up my games with a mixture of flavors that in the PH24 is now missing. I no longer “see” where I fit in this brave new world.
No, Tanis Half-Elven is still going to be a half-elf, it's just that during character creation the player picks "human" or "elf".
The rote offical answer is "play the 2014 versions."
Which just does NOT work for half-elves, as you're playing an elf that gives up three spells, the ability to Trance, and another bonus in exchange for one extra skill.
I didn't like this answer, and LOVE half-elves (they've been my favourite since I read Dragonlance in junior hight). So I just wrote my own version of "half" species: https://www.dmsguild.com/product/496260/People-of-Destiny
Not in the DMG. This sucks.
The game is ours. We can have whatever we want in the game subject to DM approval. The only time it would affect a DM or a player is if they are participating in organized play.
Rule Zero: Make the game your own
Online Resources This is a small list of things that can be helpful to a DM be they new or experienced Covering everything from cartography, campaign management and virtual Tabletop environments.
the suggestion in the playtest was pick the race you want, say elf or human, and fluff it as half elf. Half races are gone because they are politically divisive. They're not going to return. I don't like it, and I don't have to. I just have to accept the new reality, and so does everyone else.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
They're not politically divisive - please point me to the people complaining about Half Elves or Half Orcs existing in BG3? It's a phantom cause. It's made up, and removing them is actually -way- more divisive because there are lots of people who call themselves half-something, me included.
Mixed race people exist and the idea that they don't is outrageous. I didn't notice WoTC or Larian suffering any problems because of Shadowheart in BG3. In fact, I think this very website decided to give us her character sheet with the words 'Half-Elf' plastered on it quite recently. Nevermind that particular character being central to so much marketing.
I do not have to accept 'that new reality.' I will be quite happy to point out how offensive it is that they have been removed, both in terms of erasing iconic mixed race characters from their game and in removing something that has been in DND since near its origins. I am hoping they change their minds because it is genuinely baffling.
If they REALLY don't want to use the term then at least copy Paizo and give us new words for elf-blooded and orc-blooded humans and do it that way. OR give us rules for mixed heritage and use them as examples given they're so iconic.
This was gone over ad nauseum during the play test process. There were a lot of people who didn’t like it, myself included. It is what it is.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
The problem seemed to be that whatever they had, or came up with, there were people of mixed ethnicities that complained.
Before: "why do only humans get to be half-anything, and why only elves and orcs?"
UA: "why do I have to choose one and just flavor the other?"
Now: "why are mixed-species erased?" (I don't think this has actually happened in terms of reconning lore or anything like that)
I said it before, but my feeling is that WotC just didn't see a satisfactory way of doing it, so they left it out completely. Now, I don't have access to the 5.24 DMG yet, but if there's anything in there about customizing species or creating new ones, then that's all you need. Great? No. But I figure they decided that if they were going to make a segment of the population angry with mixed-species rules no matter what, they might as well not waste the money and print space in the books...
*Note that if they were going to address the first problem (only humans and only those two non-human species), then they'd need rules for 45 different "half-species". I don't think that's feasible and the "short and sweet" version of the rules were definitely divisive.
Haven’t done a cover to cover read, but nothing jumps out for guidelines on homebrewing species. Honestly, the UA concept is probably out there in the community enough that it’ll remain as an unofficial option, and it’s not like it actually requires anymore bookkeeping than averaging the lifespans, which Beyond has never tracked as a trait.
So here's something that happens when you're an under represented minority. Sometimes bad representation is better than no representation, or at least it feels that way. I honestly think the way Half Elves and Half Orcs were represented was terrible and bigoted. But if you are someone who is desperately yearning for representation in media, and I've been there, it feels terrible when some of the few examples you know of are taken away. I get it. They were still terrible, though.
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
the taldorei book has great guidance on how to handle this. maybe they couldnt use it for IP reasons... but it is there if you want to include it or ask your DM about it
@itscolbyjack
The 2024 PHM details how to bring species over from the old book. You just ignore the ASI from those species, and use the Origin Feats in the new PHB instead. Eazy Peazy.
As a person of mixed heritage, this subject has me very annoyed. Because I'm basically a Half Elf IRL due to my mom being of one minority ancestry and my dad being from Northern European Ancestry I have gotten bigotry because of my moms ancestry, and even my father was bigoted to my moms ancestry... never knew why she stayed with him.
So for me Half-Elves felt like me. I had a strong connection to them as they felt like me.
The reasoning for why they removed them was stated in the least respectful way to people with my kind of heritage, in the name of trying to be sensitive, they removed the one group of people I most identified with.
I'm angry not because of the lack of inclusion, but for what they said about it. Heaven knows the lack of inclusion for my combo of minorities is big as in I can't think of one character with my background in all of fiction besides a joke character or two.
So yeah D&D had the best rep for me, and it's gone. Not in the DMG, and thanks to what little was said officially it was kind of insulting even if they didn't realize it.
I don't think there's really a way that they can make everyone happy, neighbor. I have my issues with WOTC, but no matter what they choose in this case, they're going to be attacked for it. In that regard, eventually, people will get used to the "new normal" whereas with the old way, people who were opposed will just keep attacking them. They took the easy way out and in doing so, alienated some folks like yourself.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
It's always easier to appease the Majority at the sacrifice of the minority. I just want you to think about that. Because that is the justification for some of the worst tragedies in human history. It's something that is looming over Western Civilization right now, and I see no good coming of it.
You're not wrong.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
With respect, problem 1 is minor. It worked. The problem of “we can’t do infinite mixed races” is not a reason to remove the two iconic varieties we’ve benefited from and enjoyed for editions.
Erasing them entirely does not help anyone, and I hope they are attacked over it to the point that they go back.
This topic is confusing... What makes being half-whatever species different then being any other species? Is this just people wanting to hear that it's alright to write 'half' infront of their species?? Also does it impact or change anything game-wise being half-whatever species??
Wouldn't half-whatever species only last for one generation or are people looking to make species that are 1/16th whatever species?? Does an ingame characters genetic history even matter??
Sorry if coming across as insensitive but me just don't understand