Agreed. Gameplay was smoother and faster. No "What do I add to this roll?" or flipping through the book for the right page. I kept a paper copy for notes but DDB made session zero and character creation easier. And you could look ahead to plan leveling up and multi classing.
In the middle of a long term campaign, changing everything will bog down gameplay. You either have to spend the time to homebrew the spells you've been using for the past 9-12 months or learn the new ones. While the latter is less time consuming, it still takes away from the gameplay IMO.
We've provided some clarifications to the changelog! They can be viewed at this link. Also have edited the original post to include the link.
you still advertise buying the 2014 PHB with a description of "Purchasing a digital copy of this book unlocks it for use in the D&D BEYOND compendium and toolset." character builder and thus the character sheet are part of that toolset. using 2014 rules/spells/items needs to be a toggle just like other content. you're completely changing what you're selling the products as
And the books are nice. HOWEVER, I, like many folks here use DDB to manage characters easily especially leveling and multi classing. And now, in the middle of a long term campaign I'm told everything changes unless I want to homebrew it in to my character sheet?!?! We should all get refunded the difference between compendium only and what we bought.
Those clarifications are a piss poor response to people's complaints, and if that's the best WotC can come up with after two days & 500 posts in this thread it's insulting.
It doesn't answer any of our concerns about 2014 rules being removed, or why were only just finding out now, 2 weeks before switchover, after months of being told that this wasn't a new version or errata, and 2014 rules could still be used.
Someone, whether the community team or higher up, need to be communicating with us and answering our questions.
We've provided some clarifications to the changelog! They can be viewed at this link. Also have edited the original post to include the link.
Yeah, no, that doesn't help. We get that we can still access the 2014 content in the compendium. It's the fact that you're forcing us to use the 2024 rules via the tooltips and such in the character sheet that we don't like! Do you not remember the time Apple forced everyone to download a U2 album even if they didn't want it? This is very much in the same boat!
I've had gaming groups fall apart because the GM has insisted on changing the rules mid-campaign. Nobody likes doing that. But you guys are forcing it on all of us who want to keep using the D&D Beyond tools (not just the compendium) for the convenience they provided! Not at all cool.
What we want is what Roll20 is offering - the option to use either the full 2014 ruleset with the tools OR the full 2024 ruleset. We DON'T want this weird hybrid of 2014 and 2024!
Nice update. Too bad you are still forcing your users to use your janky homebrew creation system to keep a decade's worth of magic items for their players. It took me over half an hour of researching years old forum posts just to figure out how to create a homebrew feat for a feature in Mythical Odysseys of Theros because this website already doesn't fully support its own content, and now you are forcing everyone to have to go through the same struggle for content that they have digitally purchased over the past SEVEN YEARS because you want to shove the latest money grabber books down all of our throats.
This website is meant to be an ease of access to tools, materials, and information that most people already have physically on hand. Having to pay 60% extra to have online access to a book you already own is bad enough, but now WotC is taking money spent on digital materials and subscriptions to DDB and telling everyone to deal with it. You wouldn't listen to your audience when it came to playtesting the 2024 system, rushed it like crazy just to make a quick buck, created a substantially mediocre product because of that hastiness, and are now forcing people to throw away hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars collectively spent on this site, and (extremely poorly) disguising it as an "update". No one is buying into your fake face.
NEWSFLASH TO WIZARDS OF THE COAST AND HASBRO: Dungeons & Dragons was popularized decades before you got a hold of it. Despite your insistence on forcing everyone to play your latest cash grab variation of a game that has existed for 50 years, many people around the world continue to play their favorite editions of Dungeons & Dragons as it was originally created: An in-person table top roleplaying game. The blatant and shameless greed you have been exposing to this 50 year old community in the last few years alone will continue to lose you supporters and, most importantly to you, money. You are not the Alpha and Omega of Dungeons & Dragons. You never have been, and you never will be.
Well, I just canceled my Master tier subscription. Hasbro and WotC need to realize that this website is a luxury item and NOT a necessity to play D&D. I own physical copies of the 2014 books and I will continue to use them. The suits need to realize that this is not a video game and start respecting the spirit of D&D.
My group has been playing since 2018. Like many folks, I've spent hundreds of dollars on D&D Beyond.
I use it because my players are not deep into the rules. We're a bunch of tired 30 and 40 year olds who get together once a week to enjoy each other's company and roll some dice. I only have one player who ever looks anything up in the PHB, otherwise they are using character sheets as their bible because they don't have time to read everything. They learned the system by doing and I keep it afloat by knowing the rules and occasionally tapping the one player at my table of 8 who is also a rules nerd. The benefit of D&D Beyond for me is ease of use for my players who don't want to memorize everything and use their character sheets strongly as a reference.
When our current campaign ended, I had planned to move us to 5.5. I was excited for 5.5, but wanted to adopt it on my own terms. I wanted to keep 5e for my current campaign to be as minimally disruptive as possible while we are near the end of it and switch when we started our next campaign. This sounds like it is no longer an option.
To keep playing our current campaign going using DnD Beyond I'm going to be forced to create each and every homebrew spells and items for my players without having to memorize a whole bunch of new rules and educate my players in changes constantly. It will create significantly more effort for me - effort I happily and literally pay DnD Beyond to reduce - and be incredibly disruptive to my players and game table.
This decision is so fundamentally out of touch with your users and lazy from a product design perspective. There are competing products with similar functions that just have a toggle on the character or campaign, for example, switching between 5e and 5.5. Heck, DnD Beyond has done similar things in the past with new noncore books and Tashas. That this decision could possibly be made by anyone with a passion for helping people play D&D is baffling to me.
I have owned consumer products before. I understand the desire to drive folks to the new shiny toy you've worked so hard on. But I was paying DnD Beyond to solve a problem for me that *you* have decided not to solve any longer. This decision has killed my enthusiasm for the game, for the platform, and desire to continue my subscription.
I can say, with confidence, that when my current campaign is over I'll simply be switching to a different system. Perhaps away from D&D completely. The last year has demonstrated how out of touch some key decision makers have become with your customers and consumers.
I'm wondering what the reaction is going to be from the tables that aren't online much, and don't know anything's been changed until they sit down one day in early September to play their next session...
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Active characters:
Green Hill Sunrise, jaded tabaxi mercenary trapped in the Dark Domains (Battle Master fighter) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
Read over the clarifications, and it says the same thing. You're removing the functionality of being able to use 2014 version of spells on character sheets and character creation, which is what people DON'T WANT. Still cancelled, y'all should really rethink or walk back this decision because I don't think you're going to see a lot of subscriptions come back from this information. Would be a real shame if Hasbro forced this on the company, because it's going to lose you money, and we know that Hasbro really really hates losing money to the tune of 1000 people laid off from WotC. (the reason those people were laid off was the loss of revenue from D&D over last year because of the OGL debacle, a problem Hasbro ultimately created for itself)
Sorry y'all may be forced to shoot yourselves in the foot over planned obsolescence and in the name of being desperate for new money from your players by big corporate daddy, but that's what's happening here, you are shooting yourselves in the foot in the form of cost cutting and hoping to make a quick buck. Hope that helps when Hasbro shuts this site down because everyone moved to your competition!
Sub still cancelled. Not spending any more money on a website that pulls the rug out from under it's customers.
My group has been playing since 2018. Like many folks, I've spent hundreds of dollars on D&D Beyond.
I use it because my players are not deep into the rules. We're a bunch of tired 30 and 40 year olds who get together once a week to enjoy each other's company and roll some dice. I only have one player who ever looks anything up in the PHB, otherwise they are using character sheets as their bible because they don't have time to read everything. They learned the system by doing and I keep it afloat by knowing the rules and occasionally tapping the one player at my table of 8 who is also a rules nerd. The benefit of D&D Beyond for me is ease of use for my players who don't want to memorize everything and use their character sheets strongly as a reference.
When our current campaign ended, I had planned to move us to 5.5. I was excited for 5.5, but wanted to adopt it on my own terms. I wanted to keep 5e for my current campaign to be as minimally disruptive as possible while we are near the end of it and switch when we started our next campaign. This sounds like it is no longer an option.
To keep playing our current campaign going using DnD Beyond I'm going to be forced to create each and every homebrew spells and items for my players without having to memorize a whole bunch of new rules and educate my players in changes constantly. It will create significantly more effort for me - effort I happily and literally pay DnD Beyond to reduce - and be incredibly disruptive to my players and game table.
This decision is so fundamentally out of touch with your users and lazy from a product design perspective. There are competing products with similar functions that just have a toggle on the character or campaign, for example, switching between 5e and 5.5. Heck, DnD Beyond has done similar things in the past with new noncore books and Tashas. That this decision could possibly be made by anyone with a passion for helping people play D&D is baffling to me.
I have owned consumer products before. I understand the desire to drive folks to the new shiny toy you've worked so hard on. But I was paying DnD Beyond to solve a problem for me that *you* have decided not to solve any longer. This decision has killed my enthusiasm for the game, for the platform, and desire to continue my subscription.
I can say, with confidence, that when my current campaign is over I'll simply be switching to a different system. Perhaps away from D&D completely. The last year has demonstrated how out of touch some key decision makers have become with your customers and consumers.
I'm wondering what the reaction is going to be from the tables that aren't online much, and don't know anything's been changed until they sit down one day in early September to play their next session...
First a wave of confused people.
Then a wave of angry people.
And then it joins with the current wave of angry people to form a tidal wave.
Then WotC does nothing and when online discussions of DDB come up it's no longer "This is a useful too." but rather "This tool will take away the content you paid for and give what you don't want."
Before I used to be an advocate for DDB due to its ease of use. I would no longer recommend it for new users. And I'll be looking at other options for me.
Absolutely terrible idea, especially as there is no way to opt out. Some of us like the current set up, some of us would like the option to have 2014 instead of this. Some of us would like to make sure that the money we give you as subscribers is used in a way that doesn't screw us over. This entire update decision has made a good chunk of your platform inaccessible and obsolete.
this is just about the worst way of going about this imagineable, as many others have said, it would be so much easier to give the 2014 stuff a legacy tag and just add in the new stuff. i'm going to have to transfer 100+ character sheets over to roll20 to save them from getting completely messed up, and at that point i'm better off just cancelling my dnd beyond subscription and only using roll20 because they won't nuke all my hard work and precious memories for nothing other than greed.
There has to be a better way to implement these changes, right? The only thing is update is accomplishing so far is driving people off the site. Please rethink this.
When I paid for the content, it was under the notion that it was permanent. If I cannot access PAID content on CHARACTER SHEETS, which are kinda the basis for the game and all, then I would like to be reimbursed for being lied to. What are WotC's plans for this? (I'm being facetious. I KNOW their plans are to f*ck their customers right back to Pathfinder.)
When I paid for the content, it was under the notion that it was permanent.
This is NOTa defense of Wizbro but as has been pointed out, the fine print of the agreement between consumer and DDB explicitly says they can, essentially pull content at any time. We all had the opportunity to read and either agree or not. (I didn't take the time but also sort of assumed that kind of disclaimer was part of the agreement, as it's typical language for content providers.)
It's probably a good idea to assume no digital purchases are "permanent" - Amazon (again, not using them as the paragon of good business practices) has legalese that tells consumers that purchased digital content - books, movies, music - can be pulled at any time and is not actually "owned" by the consumer.
It sucks, and it's frustrating, but it's not something new or altogether surprising.
When I paid for the content, it was under the notion that it was permanent.
This is NOTa defense of Wizbro but as has been pointed out, the fine print of the agreement between consumer and DDB explicitly says they can, essentially pull content at any time. We all had the opportunity to read and either agree or not. (I didn't take the time but also sort of assumed that kind of disclaimer was part of the agreement, as it's typical language for content providers.)
It's probably a good idea to assume no digital purchases are "permanent" - Amazon (again, not using them as the paragon of good business practices) has legalese that tells consumers that purchased digital content - books, movies, music - can be pulled at any time and is not actually "owned" by the consumer.
It sucks, and it's frustrating, but it's not something new or altogether surprising.
Yeah yeah yeah same goes when people talk about video games. "Buying a revocable license not the game itself" blah blah blah. You keep customers by providing a good service. This is not running a good service. Is it legal? Yeah, probably when all of the fine print is said and done. Is it moral and right to the customers? No.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
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Agreed. Gameplay was smoother and faster. No "What do I add to this roll?" or flipping through the book for the right page. I kept a paper copy for notes but DDB made session zero and character creation easier. And you could look ahead to plan leveling up and multi classing.
Character Sheet? WHAT ABOUT CHARACTER SHEETS? Thats the problem - we lose access to use 2014 stuff IN THE CHARACTER SHEETS!
In the middle of a long term campaign, changing everything will bog down gameplay. You either have to spend the time to homebrew the spells you've been using for the past 9-12 months or learn the new ones. While the latter is less time consuming, it still takes away from the gameplay IMO.
you still advertise buying the 2014 PHB with a description of "Purchasing a digital copy of this book unlocks it for use in the D&D BEYOND compendium and toolset." character builder and thus the character sheet are part of that toolset. using 2014 rules/spells/items needs to be a toggle just like other content. you're completely changing what you're selling the products as
And the books are nice. HOWEVER, I, like many folks here use DDB to manage characters easily especially leveling and multi classing. And now, in the middle of a long term campaign I'm told everything changes unless I want to homebrew it in to my character sheet?!?! We should all get refunded the difference between compendium only and what we bought.
Those clarifications are a piss poor response to people's complaints, and if that's the best WotC can come up with after two days & 500 posts in this thread it's insulting.
It doesn't answer any of our concerns about 2014 rules being removed, or why were only just finding out now, 2 weeks before switchover, after months of being told that this wasn't a new version or errata, and 2014 rules could still be used.
Someone, whether the community team or higher up, need to be communicating with us and answering our questions.
Yeah, no, that doesn't help. We get that we can still access the 2014 content in the compendium. It's the fact that you're forcing us to use the 2024 rules via the tooltips and such in the character sheet that we don't like! Do you not remember the time Apple forced everyone to download a U2 album even if they didn't want it? This is very much in the same boat!
I've had gaming groups fall apart because the GM has insisted on changing the rules mid-campaign. Nobody likes doing that. But you guys are forcing it on all of us who want to keep using the D&D Beyond tools (not just the compendium) for the convenience they provided! Not at all cool.
What we want is what Roll20 is offering - the option to use either the full 2014 ruleset with the tools OR the full 2024 ruleset. We DON'T want this weird hybrid of 2014 and 2024!
Nice update. Too bad you are still forcing your users to use your janky homebrew creation system to keep a decade's worth of magic items for their players. It took me over half an hour of researching years old forum posts just to figure out how to create a homebrew feat for a feature in Mythical Odysseys of Theros because this website already doesn't fully support its own content, and now you are forcing everyone to have to go through the same struggle for content that they have digitally purchased over the past SEVEN YEARS because you want to shove the latest money grabber books down all of our throats.
This website is meant to be an ease of access to tools, materials, and information that most people already have physically on hand. Having to pay 60% extra to have online access to a book you already own is bad enough, but now WotC is taking money spent on digital materials and subscriptions to DDB and telling everyone to deal with it. You wouldn't listen to your audience when it came to playtesting the 2024 system, rushed it like crazy just to make a quick buck, created a substantially mediocre product because of that hastiness, and are now forcing people to throw away hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars collectively spent on this site, and (extremely poorly) disguising it as an "update". No one is buying into your fake face.
NEWSFLASH TO WIZARDS OF THE COAST AND HASBRO: Dungeons & Dragons was popularized decades before you got a hold of it. Despite your insistence on forcing everyone to play your latest cash grab variation of a game that has existed for 50 years, many people around the world continue to play their favorite editions of Dungeons & Dragons as it was originally created: An in-person table top roleplaying game. The blatant and shameless greed you have been exposing to this 50 year old community in the last few years alone will continue to lose you supporters and, most importantly to you, money. You are not the Alpha and Omega of Dungeons & Dragons. You never have been, and you never will be.
Still shocked that there is no statement from anyone official.
Well, I just canceled my Master tier subscription. Hasbro and WotC need to realize that this website is a luxury item and NOT a necessity to play D&D. I own physical copies of the 2014 books and I will continue to use them. The suits need to realize that this is not a video game and start respecting the spirit of D&D.
I'm wondering what the reaction is going to be from the tables that aren't online much, and don't know anything's been changed until they sit down one day in early September to play their next session...
Active characters:
Green Hill Sunrise, jaded tabaxi mercenary trapped in the Dark Domains (Battle Master fighter)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
Read over the clarifications, and it says the same thing. You're removing the functionality of being able to use 2014 version of spells on character sheets and character creation, which is what people DON'T WANT. Still cancelled, y'all should really rethink or walk back this decision because I don't think you're going to see a lot of subscriptions come back from this information. Would be a real shame if Hasbro forced this on the company, because it's going to lose you money, and we know that Hasbro really really hates losing money to the tune of 1000 people laid off from WotC. (the reason those people were laid off was the loss of revenue from D&D over last year because of the OGL debacle, a problem Hasbro ultimately created for itself)
Sorry y'all may be forced to shoot yourselves in the foot over planned obsolescence and in the name of being desperate for new money from your players by big corporate daddy, but that's what's happening here, you are shooting yourselves in the foot in the form of cost cutting and hoping to make a quick buck. Hope that helps when Hasbro shuts this site down because everyone moved to your competition!
Sub still cancelled. Not spending any more money on a website that pulls the rug out from under it's customers.
First a wave of confused people.
Then a wave of angry people.
And then it joins with the current wave of angry people to form a tidal wave.
Then WotC does nothing and when online discussions of DDB come up it's no longer "This is a useful too." but rather "This tool will take away the content you paid for and give what you don't want."
Before I used to be an advocate for DDB due to its ease of use. I would no longer recommend it for new users. And I'll be looking at other options for me.
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Absolutely terrible idea, especially as there is no way to opt out. Some of us like the current set up, some of us would like the option to have 2014 instead of this. Some of us would like to make sure that the money we give you as subscribers is used in a way that doesn't screw us over. This entire update decision has made a good chunk of your platform inaccessible and obsolete.
this is just about the worst way of going about this imagineable, as many others have said, it would be so much easier to give the 2014 stuff a legacy tag and just add in the new stuff. i'm going to have to transfer 100+ character sheets over to roll20 to save them from getting completely messed up, and at that point i'm better off just cancelling my dnd beyond subscription and only using roll20 because they won't nuke all my hard work and precious memories for nothing other than greed.
There has to be a better way to implement these changes, right? The only thing is update is accomplishing so far is driving people off the site. Please rethink this.
When I paid for the content, it was under the notion that it was permanent. If I cannot access PAID content on CHARACTER SHEETS, which are kinda the basis for the game and all, then I would like to be reimbursed for being lied to. What are WotC's plans for this? (I'm being facetious. I KNOW their plans are to f*ck their customers right back to Pathfinder.)
Gooood luck D&D Beyond. I am out :) This is a Blizzard level marketing and you have fun with it.
This is NOT a defense of Wizbro but as has been pointed out, the fine print of the agreement between consumer and DDB explicitly says they can, essentially pull content at any time. We all had the opportunity to read and either agree or not. (I didn't take the time but also sort of assumed that kind of disclaimer was part of the agreement, as it's typical language for content providers.)
It's probably a good idea to assume no digital purchases are "permanent" - Amazon (again, not using them as the paragon of good business practices) has legalese that tells consumers that purchased digital content - books, movies, music - can be pulled at any time and is not actually "owned" by the consumer.
It sucks, and it's frustrating, but it's not something new or altogether surprising.
Yeah yeah yeah same goes when people talk about video games. "Buying a revocable license not the game itself" blah blah blah. You keep customers by providing a good service. This is not running a good service. Is it legal? Yeah, probably when all of the fine print is said and done. Is it moral and right to the customers? No.