Hey Everyone,

So I've got an idea for a character, I'm thinking he comes from a Noble family that has the lycanthropy curse in the bloodline, which is why he can shift.

I've decided to take the fighting initiate feat to give my barbarian a much needed fighting style, but I'm stuck between two styles, unarmed fighting and two weapon fighting.

Now I love the flavor of unarmed fighting: a Noble trained in Pugilism, using his lycanthropic strength to throw jabs and hooks, using natural weapons during a rage.

But I also love the dps from two weapon fighting when not in a rage: 2d6 + 6 possible damage at level one (using a 16 str for example, standard array), easy out scales the 1d8 + 3 I'd be getting from unarmed fighting.

I guess I'm deciding between flavor and efficiency, but I wanted to know what other people would choose.

I also haven't accounted for grappling, but I don't know a bunch about the mechanic and if it would give unarmed fighting an edge.

Let me know what you think,

Thanks!

I don't think Unarmed Fighting style feature applies, as I found out the Edritch Claw Tattoo doesn't apply to POB claw attacks. It would still work when you're not raged, if you just want to walk around unarmed the whole time.

A thing to consider is a lack of magic items for unarmed fighting. So when you get up in levels and start meeting resistant creatures, you’re only doing half damage, unless your DM is willing to homebrew you something. 
And for a feat, I think you’d get more mileage out of dual weilder than two weapon style. Two weapon lets you add str mod to off hand attacks, so maybe 3 damage/1round. Dial weilder you bump to bigger weapons, which evens out the damage boost (assuming a+3 modifier) plus the point of AC,  and drawing both is a nice plus. 

I'd take Slasher or Piercer over Fighting Initiate.  They actually provide full benefit for your natural weapon attack and any weapon you might use when not raging.  And they bump up your strength or dex.

I didn't think about that, using Dual wielder and just upping to bigger weapons. Interesting.

I didn't even think about these two. That gives me something to think about.

Quote from ALazyWhiteGuy >>

Hey Everyone,

So I've got an idea for a character, I'm thinking he comes from a Noble family that has the lycanthropy curse in the bloodline, which is why he can shift.

I've decided to take the fighting initiate feat to give my barbarian a much needed fighting style, but I'm stuck between two styles, unarmed fighting and two weapon fighting.

Now I love the flavor of unarmed fighting: a Noble trained in Pugilism, using his lycanthropic strength to throw jabs and hooks, using natural weapons during a rage.

But I also love the dps from two weapon fighting when not in a rage: 2d6 + 6 possible damage at level one (using a 16 str for example, standard array), easy out scales the 1d8 + 3 I'd be getting from unarmed fighting.

I guess I'm deciding between flavor and efficiency, but I wanted to know what other people would choose.

I also haven't accounted for grappling, but I don't know a bunch about the mechanic and if it would give unarmed fighting an edge.

Let me know what you think,

Thanks!

The unarmed fighting works great. You can still gain the benefit of the improved damage dice and use your claws, bite, or tail. an unarmed strike can be a kick or a headbutt, An elbow, etc. If you want to do some grappling, It can be a brutal controlling rager once you hit 5. 

I don't think either of those styles is going to be of much help for you; I'd probably take the defensive fighting style to raise my AC a bit.  Two weapon fighting won't work with your natural weapons, and unarmed fighting doesn't work with them either.  The fighting styles would only help you when you are not doing the thing you picked beast soul barbarian to do.  Defensive will help you every fight.

why would unarmed not work? you can choose tail and gain the AC and still use your hands for unarmed fighting. or pick your claws and make one unarmed strike, then claw and if you have tavern brawler, you can grapple between. 

Probably because I consider everything other than "claw" to be a trap option.

a d8 reaction to AC that leaves both hands free is a trap? shit.

I missed the reaction attack, so mea culpa.  Memory was telling me it was only a d8, reach attack for your action.  I suppose regen on the bite isn't the worst way to spend your action either.  Still, I prefer claws for most situations.

Quote from VikingEric >>

why would unarmed not work? you can choose tail and gain the AC and still use your hands for unarmed fighting. or pick your claws and make one unarmed strike, then claw and if you have tavern brawler, you can grapple between. 

 

 Having both the tail and the unarmed strikes doesn't entitle you to any extra attacks.  That's why.

I don't think any fighting style is worth spending a feat on for a Beast Barbarian. They spend so much time using natural weapons, and switching between set ups where they use different martial weapons that most of the weapon based ones will get used sparingly. Unarmed and Two-Weapon Fighting do not apply to natural weapons, unfortunately. Protection and Interception use your reaction so they don't mesh well with the tail.

Defense (for builds running around in medium armor), Blindfighting, and Superior Technique are the best fits, with Thrown Weapon and Archery being interesting side picks if you want to flesh out a ranged option. BUT, like I said, I don't think any of these are worth a feat.

Just dip for a fighting style if you really want one. Level 6 is a perfect break point for the Beast Barb, grabbing that sweet mobility and 4th rage per day, at which point you can multiclass into fighter, ranger or paladin to pick one of these up. Fighter is the easiest and cleanest MC, but interesting builds can come from the other two.

A lot of the more tradition barbarian feat options lose value on a Beast Barbarian. Polearm Master can still be a great fit if you're planning on using the tail pretty much exclusively (I suppose the bite works for this too but that option is so bad). But if you're planning on being loose with it and mixing it up with the claws or tail on the fly, it's harder to find good feats that synergize with both and add meaningful combat abilities (especially to the bonus action). Shield Master is currently my favorite.

Is Tasha's Custom Lineage an option? If so then going for that and choosing a half-feat (such as Skill Expert: Athletics) can leave you with an 18 strength at level 1 and some nice utility. Grab Shield Master at level 4 and you have a use for your bonus action that can be used no matter which natural attack you pick. With rage fueled advantage and expertise, this build is a monster at those athletics checks. This would be a build that would appreciate wearing half-plate and using a Fighter dip to pick up Defense Fighting Style. 

Quote from 6thLyranGuard >>

Quote from VikingEric >>

why would unarmed not work? you can choose tail and gain the AC and still use your hands for unarmed fighting. or pick your claws and make one unarmed strike, then claw and if you have tavern brawler, you can grapple between. 

 

 Having both the tail and the unarmed strikes doesn't entitle you to any extra attacks.  That's why.

 You don't need them. Unarmed fighting with beast: Your fists and tail are all a d8 and you have the tail reaction against a hit. Plus if you grapple someone it's a d4 at the start of each turn. This is strictly looking at making a brawling grappler that holds and beats and drops enemies. 

First round, rage, d8 punch, grapple. 

Second round d4, d8 punch, d8 punch. 

Etc, etc. And you've got +1d8 to your AC and a reach weapon available if someone else gets within 10 feet of you. 

And if you can get a dancing sword or choose a race that give you a BA attack. Shit man. Your pulling down huge numbers and being a battlefield controller. 

Quote from HeironymusZot >>

I don't think any fighting style is worth spending a feat on for a Beast Barbarian. They spend so much time using natural weapons, and switching between set ups where they use different martial weapons that most of the weapon based ones will get used sparingly. Unarmed and Two-Weapon Fighting do not apply to natural weapons, unfortunately. Protection and Interception use your reaction so they don't mesh well with the tail.

Defense (for builds running around in medium armor), Blindfighting, and Superior Technique are the best fits, with Thrown Weapon and Archery being interesting side picks if you want to flesh out a ranged option. BUT, like I said, I don't think any of these are worth a feat.

Just dip for a fighting style if you really want one. Level 6 is a perfect break point for the Beast Barb, grabbing that sweet mobility and 4th rage per day, at which point you can multiclass into fighter, ranger or paladin to pick one of these up. Fighter is the easiest and cleanest MC, but interesting builds can come from the other two.

A lot of the more tradition barbarian feat options lose value on a Beast Barbarian. Polearm Master can still be a great fit if you're planning on using the tail pretty much exclusively (I suppose the bite works for this too but that option is so bad). But if you're planning on being loose with it and mixing it up with the claws or tail on the fly, it's harder to find good feats that synergize with both and add meaningful combat abilities (especially to the bonus action). Shield Master is currently my favorite.

Is Tasha's Custom Lineage an option? If so then going for that and choosing a half-feat (such as Skill Expert: Athletics) can leave you with an 18 strength at level 1 and some nice utility. Grab Shield Master at level 4 and you have a use for your bonus action that can be used no matter which natural attack you pick. With rage fueled advantage and expertise, this build is a monster at those athletics checks. This would be a build that would appreciate wearing half-plate and using a Fighter dip to pick up Defense Fighting Style. 

 

In fact, two weapon fighting style gets a standard barb to where a beast barb with claws is...without using a feat.  A two weapon barb would need two feats to surpass the beast barb out of the box by picking up dual wielder to use d8 weapons.  Claws allows the beast barb to really get busy with stacking their rage damage mod, and IIRC you can get away with using a shield as well.  Beast with claws has a lot of potential.

If I leaned more into the idea of an unarmed grappler Beast Barb, do you think tavern brawler or grappler would be a must have at level 4?

At level 4, I am not taking either.  I am going with ASI to raise my str.  you have reckless attack, so grappler really doesn't give you much.  Tavern Brawler, just straight up stinks for beast barbs.  You're not going to punch people with d4 fists when you can punch them with D6 claws...twice.

100% agree with crzyhawk. Personally I would also be looking at shield master, but I'll admit I have a bit of a thing for that feat. And yes, it does work with claws since they don't specify needing both hands open to make the extra attack. 3 attacks + shield shove is awesome. 

I'd either find a good use for your bonus action or just boost strength. The grappling feats are bad and you're good enough at it already just by virtue of high strength, proficiency and rage advantage.