So I had an idea of making a cult/guild that is a elemental(ish) primordial stuff and dragon thingy stuff. Basically, a guild of mages who are split into the 4 elements, they are of course fond of dragons of chromatic dragons. My idea with them is that they are going to wake primordial titans or something with the word "primordial" and something elemental that has been asleep for a long time, maybe even dead. And I was hoping for some help with how to first of create a guild on a fairly large scale, but also on these primordial entities. Here are some... thingies that might be good to know:
-They are probably chaotic evil, neutral evil, or Lawful evil. I'm not so good at seeing the difference between neutral evil and chaotic evil. I mostly just think that it means that neutral evil are clever enough to have allies and not just kill every ******* living and breathing thing on the planet. -Dragons are involved. Dunno how. But I know why. Cause they are evil and ******* awesome. Else I really have no reason to use dragons with these people xD. But if dragons could be involved it would be great. -The 4 parts of this guild is of course the four elements. Fire, Earth, Water, Air. (P.S: How would be a good way of making those different parts of the guild without making it the last air bender? Or just fire is ulti evil and strong, water is cold and probably filled with healing, earth is muscle wizards, and air are flying piles of shit. I would like each of those parts somewhat unique and fresh. Not so predictable. Sorry I'm asking too much here! Sorry!)
What you may want to look into are the Catastrophic Dragons from 4E Lore. Essentially, when the Gods and Primordials fought during the Dawn War, a group of dragons sided with the Primordials and were turned into elemental dragons.
I've seen some people online have tried to homebrew them for 5e as well. They would make great monsters for you to build elemental cults around.
As for your cultists, the elemental themed cults from the Princes of the Apocalypse adventure would be a good fit.
Thank you sir! The cults seem very interesting. Their ways of seeing the elements in their most destructive and devastating forms possible. Fire is a little weird though, why would they want to rid the earth of any life? If everything dies there is nothing to set ablaze or worth in the world. Would make more sense if they wished the prime plane to seem more like Avernus, the 1st layer of the nine hells. But whatever. Thank you for the help sir! ^^
Explains a lot. So Lawful evil I guess would be the best for them. As they want to rule the world. You know, the normal power control hungry idiotic kill all who oppose us! Kinda deal. Any tips on primordial dragon loving mages who are lawful evil? ^^
If you don't want to use the stereotypical "4 Elemental Schools" thing with the mages, you could try taking a page out of the Wheel of Time. What I mean by that is to have the sects have different colors, but those colors, instead of focusing on any particular element of magic, have their own ways of approaching problems and such. I know that's still a little cleched, but hear me out:
Red Sect (Fire Ahja)- The most direct of all the Sects. They are the ones that you most likely will fight on a regular basis.
Blue Sect (Water Ahja)- This Sect is the most manipulative. They tend to favor using pawns to achieve their goals.
White/Yellow Sect (Air Ahja)- The Air Ahja sets themselves to look like the most charitable or good of the Sects. They are much more in the open than the others and make themselves look like an organization of servants of the people.
Brown Sect (Earth Ahja)- This Sect believes that knowledge is power above all else. They are the most secretive Sect and utilize spies far more extensively than the others. They also spend a good deal of time pouring over ancient tomes and long lost texts in search of secret knowledge. A lot of them are probably warlocks.
You'll probably want to fiddle around with the Sects, but that's along the lines of what I would do.
What sect would you say is best to throw at em first? Because clever people probably wouldn't just attack them or the likes. And I wanna have these people show up multiple times. What is a good and natural way of doing that without suddenly saying you see this man that looks like this and that and he throws fire at you. And then doing that for the next 3 times we play. ^^
Depends on how the Sects are incorporated into the setting. Are they secret cults or are they more open? Like, is the earth cult more decentralized and spread across a bunch of farm villages whose members meet in secret basement chambers to do their cult rituals in order to ensure their mountainous neighbors are plagued by avalanches each year? Do the Water Cultists command a section of coastline and visit quarterly to demand tribute from the local fishing villages or force them to face the wrath of storms? Does the Fire Sect rule openly over a gleaming city, demanding sacrifices to their slumbering volcano god-dragon or as a way to bring down winged wildfires upon their political enemies lands?
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"The mongoose blew out its candle and was asleep in bed before the room went dark." —Llanowar fable
Depends on how the Sects are incorporated into the setting. Are they secret cults or are they more open? Like, is the earth cult more decentralized and spread across a bunch of farm villages whose members meet in secret basement chambers to do their cult rituals in order to ensure their mountainous neighbors are plagued by avalanches each year? Do the Water Cultists command a section of coastline and visit quarterly to demand tribute from the local fishing villages or force them to face the wrath of storms? Does the Fire Sect rule openly over a gleaming city, demanding sacrifices to their slumbering volcano god-dragon or as a way to bring down winged wildfires upon their political enemies lands?
I'm thinking that they're mostly open. Expecially the fire sect or red sect whatever you wanna call it. Maybe one of the sects is a little more secret but they're not thieves guild I guess.
If they are mostly open, then just pick an environment and decide your plot hook. Does the party hear about that poor mountain village that is suffering from constant avalanches and come to help, only to run across the lair of a group from the Earth Sect channeling the power of an Avalanche Dragon to drive people away from their village for "reasons?" Does the party come across whole swaths of charred farmland and the pleas of local farmers to help drive out a group of fire cultist that are ritually calling forth a Wildfire Dragon to feed on their lands? Do you want the party to stop in a quaint fishing village that is about to not only weather a storm churned up by a Typhoon Dragon that causes the party to have to take shelter and help keep the villagers safe, but then also deal with the cadre of water cultists that show up by boat soon after demanding tribute or such storms will be the norm for years to come? Is a valley nation plagued by assaults from giant-eagle-riding air cultists led by an aarakokra who claims to be an emissary of the divine Tornado Dragon, but also wishes for the valley kingdom to be torn asunder so that his dragon lord may dance freely on the winds whipping through the area without having to contend with wind-breaking walls and castles?
Basically, just pick a location and start building.
Sorry if I missed something, but will the sects/cults be fighting each other? Will they try to recruit characters? Are you also using Forgotten Realms factions in your game? If I was like, a wizard, or someone else with high Intelligence, I would probably just play them against each other and not have to do any work lol
Where they show up is entirely dependant on what they want and how they are going to get it. Maybe they encounter an Earth Sect member while in some forgotten tomb filled with ancient texts, or maybe they meet a conspiracy theorist who claims a well known diplomatic group secretly controls all the politics. It really depends on what the Cultists have to do to achieve their goals.
Sorry if I missed something, but will the sects/cults be fighting each other? Will they try to recruit characters? Are you also using Forgotten Realms factions in your game? If I was like, a wizard, or someone else with high Intelligence, I would probably just play them against each other and not have to do any work lol
Oh yeah they the sects will by all means be together. I have an idea with that there is one sect that the players may be able to side with, to make it a lot easier, but they would have to sacrifice their morals for a time. I'm hoping that could lead to some very interesting RP scenarios. Yeah I'm playing in forgotten realms. I can't remember what the zherememaeiam stands for, can't even spell their name but guilds like the harpers yeah they exist.
Where they show up is entirely dependant on what they want and how they are going to get it. Maybe they encounter an Earth Sect member while in some forgotten tomb filled with ancient texts, or maybe they meet a conspiracy theorist who claims a well known diplomatic group secretly controls all the politics. It really depends on what the Cultists have to do to achieve their goals.
Good idea! I am aiming for a sect that seeks old lore and knowledge. But maybe not always in the best or most... kindest of ways. ^^ So a good old dungeon crawl with a plot hook at the end, might not be a bad idea! ^^
I think that is a very... Simplified explanation of lawful, neutral and chaotic evil. I mean, even Tiamat, a Chaotic Evil Fiend, wants to rule over the Material Plane. I think a better explanation would be in how they go about it.
Lawful Evil creatures hold themselves to some sort of belief system that they follow with a passion.
Chaotic Evil creatures does and says what they want to get their way.
Neutral Evil creatures fall someone in the middle.
I think that is a very... Simplified explanation of lawful, neutral and chaotic evil. I mean, even Tiamat, a Chaotic Evil Fiend, wants to rule over the Material Plane. I think a better explanation would be in how they go about it.
Lawful Evil creatures hold themselves to some sort of belief system that they follow with a passion.
Chaotic Evil creatures does and says what they want to get their way.
Neutral Evil creatures fall someone in the middle.
I guess they would by all means be Lawful Evil, believing in the elements and some sort of code probably. I just find it hard that, lawful evil would have honor, and mostly good reasons to why they do what they do. While neutral evil would in my eyes have the evil deeds of chaotic evil, but the lawful deeds of lawful evil. It's a little weird. But I do love the alignment system. What if a single person was neutral evil. Is that somewhere in the box of "I wanna rule and conquer the world but I also kinda wanna do what I want at the same time"?
I guess they would by all means be Lawful Evil, believing in the elements and some sort of code probably. I just find it hard that, lawful evil would have honor, and mostly good reasons to why they do what they do. While neutral evil would in my eyes have the evil deeds of chaotic evil, but the lawful deeds of lawful evil. It's a little weird. But I do love the alignment system. What if a single person was neutral evil. Is that somewhere in the box of "I wanna rule and conquer the world but I also kinda wanna do what I want at the same time"?
The Lawful portion of the alignment doesn't imply you actually be honorable, it just speaks about how you follow a certain core value(s) that are unchanging and unwavering. These core value(s) drive a Lawful creature and define their purpose for living. I don't think it is fair to say all Lawful Evil creatures are honorable creatures, unless of course that creature's core belief that drives them is "I'd rather die then be dishonorable."
The truth is there are plenty of beliefs that drive a person, and not all of them are the same. If lying, stealing, murdering (et cetera) does not contradict a Lawful Evil creature's core beliefs, then it is perfectly reasonable for them to commit any of that.
That is a very good description of it! Could you do the same for neutral evil for me please? I just wanna make a villian who isn't "chaotic" evil but I might just have to give up on that. xD
Someone who is neutral Evil is someone who does what he can get away with. He is someone who smiles and waves in public when people are watching, but commits felons and theft when their is no risk of consequences.
A Neutral Evil person doesn't relish in the death and destruction they may or may not cause, but instead may see their actions as a means to an ends.
Neutral Evil characters might not actively seeking out the action of commiting evil acts, but would instead commit evil if there is a perceived benefit. A Neutral Evil person may say something like "don't take it personal, darling, it is only business..." Right before they kick someone off the ledge of a cliff.
Someone who is neutral Evil is someone who does what he can get away with. He is someone who smiles and waves in public when people are watching, but commits felons and theft when their is no risk of consequences.
A Neutral Evil person doesn't relish in the death and destruction they may or may not cause, but instead may see their actions as a means to an ends.
Neutral Evil characters might not actively seeking out the action of commiting evil acts, but would instead commit evil if there is a perceived benefit. A Neutral Evil person may say something like "don't take it personal, darling, it is only business..." Right before they kick someone off the ledge of a cliff.
Perfect! Thank you so much for your help! ^^ I really like neutral evil. It's my favorite evil alignment. Followed by lawful evil. So thank you for the help! ^^
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So I had an idea of making a cult/guild that is a elemental(ish) primordial stuff and dragon thingy stuff. Basically, a guild of mages who are split into the 4 elements, they are of course fond of dragons of chromatic dragons. My idea with them is that they are going to wake primordial titans or something with the word "primordial" and something elemental that has been asleep for a long time, maybe even dead. And I was hoping for some help with how to first of create a guild on a fairly large scale, but also on these primordial entities. Here are some... thingies that might be good to know:
-They are probably chaotic evil, neutral evil, or Lawful evil. I'm not so good at seeing the difference between neutral evil and chaotic evil. I mostly just think that it means that neutral evil are clever enough to have allies and not just kill every ******* living and breathing thing on the planet.
-Dragons are involved. Dunno how. But I know why. Cause they are evil and ******* awesome. Else I really have no reason to use dragons with these people xD. But if dragons could be involved it would be great.
-The 4 parts of this guild is of course the four elements. Fire, Earth, Water, Air. (P.S: How would be a good way of making those different parts of the guild without making it the last air bender? Or just fire is ulti evil and strong, water is cold and probably filled with healing, earth is muscle wizards, and air are flying piles of shit. I would like each of those parts somewhat unique and fresh. Not so predictable. Sorry I'm asking too much here! Sorry!)
Thanks in advance! ^^
What you may want to look into are the Catastrophic Dragons from 4E Lore. Essentially, when the Gods and Primordials fought during the Dawn War, a group of dragons sided with the Primordials and were turned into elemental dragons.
I've seen some people online have tried to homebrew them for 5e as well. They would make great monsters for you to build elemental cults around.
As for your cultists, the elemental themed cults from the Princes of the Apocalypse adventure would be a good fit.
Thank you sir! The cults seem very interesting. Their ways of seeing the elements in their most destructive and devastating forms possible. Fire is a little weird though, why would they want to rid the earth of any life? If everything dies there is nothing to set ablaze or worth in the world. Would make more sense if they wished the prime plane to seem more like Avernus, the 1st layer of the nine hells. But whatever. Thank you for the help sir! ^^
Lawful evil wants to rule. Laws help them do this.
Neutral evils wants to further their ends. Everything is just xp to them.
chaotic evil wants to let the city burn.
Explains a lot. So Lawful evil I guess would be the best for them. As they want to rule the world. You know, the normal power control hungry idiotic kill all who oppose us! Kinda deal. Any tips on primordial dragon loving mages who are lawful evil? ^^
If you don't want to use the stereotypical "4 Elemental Schools" thing with the mages, you could try taking a page out of the Wheel of Time. What I mean by that is to have the sects have different colors, but those colors, instead of focusing on any particular element of magic, have their own ways of approaching problems and such. I know that's still a little cleched, but hear me out:
Red Sect (Fire Ahja)- The most direct of all the Sects. They are the ones that you most likely will fight on a regular basis.
Blue Sect (Water Ahja)- This Sect is the most manipulative. They tend to favor using pawns to achieve their goals.
White/Yellow Sect (Air Ahja)- The Air Ahja sets themselves to look like the most charitable or good of the Sects. They are much more in the open than the others and make themselves look like an organization of servants of the people.
Brown Sect (Earth Ahja)- This Sect believes that knowledge is power above all else. They are the most secretive Sect and utilize spies far more extensively than the others. They also spend a good deal of time pouring over ancient tomes and long lost texts in search of secret knowledge. A lot of them are probably warlocks.
You'll probably want to fiddle around with the Sects, but that's along the lines of what I would do.
What sect would you say is best to throw at em first? Because clever people probably wouldn't just attack them or the likes. And I wanna have these people show up multiple times.
What is a good and natural way of doing that without suddenly saying you see this man that looks like this and that and he throws fire at you. And then doing that for the next 3 times we play. ^^
Depends on how the Sects are incorporated into the setting. Are they secret cults or are they more open? Like, is the earth cult more decentralized and spread across a bunch of farm villages whose members meet in secret basement chambers to do their cult rituals in order to ensure their mountainous neighbors are plagued by avalanches each year? Do the Water Cultists command a section of coastline and visit quarterly to demand tribute from the local fishing villages or force them to face the wrath of storms? Does the Fire Sect rule openly over a gleaming city, demanding sacrifices to their slumbering volcano god-dragon or as a way to bring down winged wildfires upon their political enemies lands?
I'm thinking that they're mostly open. Expecially the fire sect or red sect whatever you wanna call it. Maybe one of the sects is a little more secret but they're not thieves guild I guess.
If they are mostly open, then just pick an environment and decide your plot hook. Does the party hear about that poor mountain village that is suffering from constant avalanches and come to help, only to run across the lair of a group from the Earth Sect channeling the power of an Avalanche Dragon to drive people away from their village for "reasons?" Does the party come across whole swaths of charred farmland and the pleas of local farmers to help drive out a group of fire cultist that are ritually calling forth a Wildfire Dragon to feed on their lands? Do you want the party to stop in a quaint fishing village that is about to not only weather a storm churned up by a Typhoon Dragon that causes the party to have to take shelter and help keep the villagers safe, but then also deal with the cadre of water cultists that show up by boat soon after demanding tribute or such storms will be the norm for years to come? Is a valley nation plagued by assaults from giant-eagle-riding air cultists led by an aarakokra who claims to be an emissary of the divine Tornado Dragon, but also wishes for the valley kingdom to be torn asunder so that his dragon lord may dance freely on the winds whipping through the area without having to contend with wind-breaking walls and castles?
Basically, just pick a location and start building.
Sorry if I missed something, but will the sects/cults be fighting each other? Will they try to recruit characters? Are you also using Forgotten Realms factions in your game? If I was like, a wizard, or someone else with high Intelligence, I would probably just play them against each other and not have to do any work lol
I stole my pfp from this person: https://mobile.twitter.com/xelart1/status/1177312449575432193
Where they show up is entirely dependant on what they want and how they are going to get it. Maybe they encounter an Earth Sect member while in some forgotten tomb filled with ancient texts, or maybe they meet a conspiracy theorist who claims a well known diplomatic group secretly controls all the politics. It really depends on what the Cultists have to do to achieve their goals.
Oh yeah they the sects will by all means be together. I have an idea with that there is one sect that the players may be able to side with, to make it a lot easier, but they would have to sacrifice their morals for a time. I'm hoping that could lead to some very interesting RP scenarios. Yeah I'm playing in forgotten realms. I can't remember what the zherememaeiam stands for, can't even spell their name but guilds like the harpers yeah they exist.
Good idea! I am aiming for a sect that seeks old lore and knowledge. But maybe not always in the best or most... kindest of ways. ^^
So a good old dungeon crawl with a plot hook at the end, might not be a bad idea! ^^
I think that is a very... Simplified explanation of lawful, neutral and chaotic evil. I mean, even Tiamat, a Chaotic Evil Fiend, wants to rule over the Material Plane. I think a better explanation would be in how they go about it.
Lawful Evil creatures hold themselves to some sort of belief system that they follow with a passion.
Chaotic Evil creatures does and says what they want to get their way.
Neutral Evil creatures fall someone in the middle.
I guess they would by all means be Lawful Evil, believing in the elements and some sort of code probably. I just find it hard that, lawful evil would have honor, and mostly good reasons to why they do what they do. While neutral evil would in my eyes have the evil deeds of chaotic evil, but the lawful deeds of lawful evil. It's a little weird. But I do love the alignment system. What if a single person was neutral evil. Is that somewhere in the box of "I wanna rule and conquer the world but I also kinda wanna do what I want at the same time"?
The Lawful portion of the alignment doesn't imply you actually be honorable, it just speaks about how you follow a certain core value(s) that are unchanging and unwavering. These core value(s) drive a Lawful creature and define their purpose for living. I don't think it is fair to say all Lawful Evil creatures are honorable creatures, unless of course that creature's core belief that drives them is "I'd rather die then be dishonorable."
The truth is there are plenty of beliefs that drive a person, and not all of them are the same. If lying, stealing, murdering (et cetera) does not contradict a Lawful Evil creature's core beliefs, then it is perfectly reasonable for them to commit any of that.
That is a very good description of it! Could you do the same for neutral evil for me please? I just wanna make a villian who isn't "chaotic" evil but I might just have to give up on that. xD
Someone who is neutral Evil is someone who does what he can get away with. He is someone who smiles and waves in public when people are watching, but commits felons and theft when their is no risk of consequences.
A Neutral Evil person doesn't relish in the death and destruction they may or may not cause, but instead may see their actions as a means to an ends.
Neutral Evil characters might not actively seeking out the action of commiting evil acts, but would instead commit evil if there is a perceived benefit. A Neutral Evil person may say something like "don't take it personal, darling, it is only business..." Right before they kick someone off the ledge of a cliff.
Perfect! Thank you so much for your help! ^^ I really like neutral evil. It's my favorite evil alignment. Followed by lawful evil. So thank you for the help! ^^