So quick background. I've got 4 players and they're in a large dwarven city. They've been doing a quest in this city to protect a man who has accidentally cloned himself with a doppleganger ring. [If you're reading this and this sounds super super familiar, STOP READING] As part of the investigation they wanted to talk to the ring's previous owner's family (the original guy died). In order to do this they had to enter the wealthy district and did so by lying about being a performing group. Due to a 28 deception roll the guards let them enter without papers but with 4 of them escorting them instead. They tried to distract the guards with a minor illusion but it didn't work and when that plan fell through they threw some smoke bombs and scattered... in the middle of the most well guarded district in the city... with 4 guards directly around them and many more scattered about... Long story short, 2 surrendered to the guards after being cornered and were arrested, one tried to fight 10 guards and died, and the other is disguised and it will wear off soon and he's most likely going to be caught (he's was found nearby and the guards are holding him to get his statement after the situation resolves).
I'm just kinda at a loss for what to do. These guys assaulted guards, one of them was caught trying to jump over the kings palace walls ARMED, and I don't feel like I can let them go with a slap on the wrist. They're also new to this town and this was the first quest they were attempting so there's no one that can put a good word in for them. Any advice would be helpful. My current plan is to have the local assassin network reach out to them while they are in prison and offer to help them out for a price, but that's all I can think of
That is a difficult situation to figure out. Most of the ways that i can think about to get them out would make them wanted in the city and that might cause problems for your game plans. theres always the classic prison escape but that would leave them wanted which you may not want.
Another thing i can think of is maybe the place has some sort of trail by combat to be released but for an entire party to go through that it would be too time consuming and probably boring for the party.
Now the best thing i can thing of that would lead to the best results is maybe the city comes under some sort siege and the prison they were kept in was accidentally destroyed allowing them to escape (like pirates of the Caribbean) depending on your party they may want to just slip away or you could have the attacks start to attack them and when the players most likely fight back they could be pardoned after the attackers are warded off and they could gain some favor with the ruler of said city. that would also be a good time to maybe introduce some sort of villain for the party to maybe pursue.
Thats all i can really think of, that situation is a difficult one if it wasnt planned, it could easily derail a game but these things happen. I hope i helped and gave you some sort of idea!
First off, I have to say, that's a lot of cops to be enforcing anti-busking laws. If it's a gated neighborhood, so be it, but having the guards literally following them is putting your PCs in a heck of a tight corner and expecting them to come up with a real stroke of genius to get out.
Tell us more about the ring and the mission. They're protecting the guy from whom? His clone? I guess one thing you can do is have Detective Rockbutt throw them into an interrogation room and scream at them for an hour. They explain what they were actually doing in the nice neighborhood. No sir, we're not potential regicides, sir, we're adventurers tracking a rogue clone. Maybe he takes an interest? Maybe he knows something they don't know? But he can't follow up on it because it's politically delicate? But a pack of unusually oafish wandering performers maybe could? Maybe he even gives them the classic 24 hours to crack the case before he feeds them to the mushroom farms? Dwarven cities have like, two ways in and out, so they're not going anywhere.
From what you said, it doesn't sound like any of them killed any guards, just fought them. That part's easily fixed. The cops tie them to the floor and stomp on them and kick them until they have 1hp each before they let them go. If the players were genuinely foolish, I might also say that any especially nice stuff they had was "misplaced in the evidence room" and they weren't getting it back, but honestly, it sounds like you put them in an excessively difficult situation to start with, so I wouldn't punish them too hard.
ETA: I'm embarrassed that Big Lizard posted the same idea 8 minutes earlier, so now I have to come up with something else...ummm...what about the ring itself? What if it made clones of the PCs and they didn't know that they're clones? And the guards guillotine them and then you tell the PCs that the camera smash-cuts to them waking up in their client's living room? And all four of them are alive again? And this experience has given them some insight into the power of the doppleganger ring? That's a little hacky, but it's short notice, give me a break.
Ok well here are a couple of things you could potentially do, I personally kind of like No. 2.
1. Embarrassment: This situation should be very embarrassing for the Dwarven Guards. They let these guys in, lost them in the city, allowed one of them to scale the Kings Wall. This is not something the guards want their guard captains and superiors to find out about. The guards know there will be a trial, which means they will have to explain how these guys got lose, why they were let in without papers in the first place and who was responsible for that. All things the guards will want to avoid. So to circumvent that, the guards escort them to the city limits and let them go, taking all of their equipment and money (leaving them with nothing).
2. The Understanding Captain: Introduce the Captain of the Guard, a very sympathetic, honest guy who just wants to get to the bottom of "why" these guys came into his city sector under false pretenses. If they come clean, the Captain realizes he knew the previous owner of the Doppelganger Ring and has personal reasons why he would want to help the party complete the quest. He helps get them out of trouble and gives them the clues they need for the quest. If they lie, he lets them sit in Jail and tries again several days later.
3. Trial and Prison: The group is tried for their crimes using whatever justice system is in place, they are sentenced to several years in Jail. Let them serve the time. Just do a "and three years later".. They have failed the quest, lost all gear and all money and are thrown out of the city in the rags on their back. Each player loses a point of constitution permanently (for bad nutrition and prison conditions). Let there be consequences.
I'm a fan of option #1 with whatever story modification makes sense.It can be a great 20-30 min roleplay ing session to start a session.
An Investigator is brought in to get down to the Why this all occurred. A Zone of Truth machine doo-hickey ensures truthful responses. Such a scandal is wanted to be avoided on behalf of the city's political powers, and a declaration can be made that "a single dangerous insane malefactor was killed in regard to a potential burglary., with grateful assistance from 3 law abiding unnamed citizens " Officially a lone gunman situation, the rest of the group being handed down suspended hard labor sentences to be imposed for even the next minor infraction. Unofficially, they now owe a bribe to the lead Investigator as well.
All that's really occurred is a story deviation but otherwise doesn't interrupt whatever greater story plot you're creating.
First off, I have to say, that's a lot of cops to be enforcing anti-busking laws. If it's a gated neighborhood, so be it, but having the guards literally following them is putting your PCs in a heck of a tight corner and expecting them to come up with a real stroke of genius to get out.
Tell us more about the ring and the mission. They're protecting the guy from whom? His clone? I guess one thing you can do is have Detective Rockbutt throw them into an interrogation room and scream at them for an hour. They explain what they were actually doing in the nice neighborhood. No sir, we're not potential regicides, sir, we're adventurers tracking a rogue clone. Maybe he takes an interest? Maybe he knows something they don't know? But he can't follow up on it because it's politically delicate? But a pack of unusually oafish wandering performers maybe could? Maybe he even gives them the classic 24 hours to crack the case before he feeds them to the mushroom farms? Dwarven cities have like, two ways in and out, so they're not going anywhere.
From what you said, it doesn't sound like any of them killed any guards, just fought them. That part's easily fixed. The cops tie them to the floor and stomp on them and kick them until they have 1hp each before they let them go. If the players were genuinely foolish, I might also say that any especially nice stuff they had was "misplaced in the evidence room" and they weren't getting it back, but honestly, it sounds like you put them in an excessively difficult situation to start with, so I wouldn't punish them too hard.
ETA: I'm embarrassed that Big Lizard posted the same idea 8 minutes earlier, so now I have to come up with something else...ummm...what about the ring itself? What if it made clones of the PCs and they didn't know that they're clones? And the guards guillotine them and then you tell the PCs that the camera smash-cuts to them waking up in their client's living room? And all four of them are alive again? And this experience has given them some insight into the power of the doppleganger ring? That's a little hacky, but it's short notice, give me a break.
For the story behind the ring is that originally a noble commissioned it to thwart assassination attempts, it was originally made to make a soulless body double (basically a breathing husk). The noble wasn't satisfied and added an enchantment to give the clone memories and awareness so it could better function as a double, but the extra enchantment ended up splitting memories between the original and the clone. This went south after he used the ring and the original owner and the clone (who both thought they were the real one) got into an argument and ended up killing each other. The ring ended up getting picked up by an extremely paranoid shop owner who has used it 7 times to date with each clone getting more crazy as their memories are split more and more. The original quest was just to protect one of the clones who thought people were after him.
As far as there being a lot guards, I'd designed the city with 3 tiers and this was the one where all the noble families, the king, and the high level church members live, as well as the more posh shops to cater to them, and in a city of 40,000 there are about 1,000 residents on this floor. I'd originally intended for the guard escort to take them to the estate, and from there they could get some information, before most likely getting the door slammed in their face and getting a dressing down from the guards. But the whole incident when down 50 feet from the front gate in the middle of a wide open courtyard. The player who died ran around for a few minutes before going back to the front gate which had been refortified and despite the guards telling him repeatedly to surrender the fought and ended up dying. The rest of them just ended up running for a couple minutes around while guards called for reinforcements before getting caught.
I do appreciate the advice though. It's been difficult because this is my first time DMing and while I built the city and lots of routes for this quest to go, I had no idea they were going to do something like that because they just did it. No discussion. Just one player using the message spell to let the others know to scatter at the signal (which no one objected to) and throwing smoke bombs.
Okay everyone. Thanks a ton for the advice. I was really caught off guard by all the whole situation and having to deal with my first character death as a DM shook me up a bit too. I've definitely got some ideas going forward. My main one is having an investigator like Johnwinstohn suggested, who is actually part of the assassins guild in the city (I've been wanting to introduce them to this since they got a kick out of interacting with the thieves guild in another town), who will help them get out in exchange for a debt to be cashed in later. From there the investigator would rig the investigation and leverage the other things you guys talked about to get them off more lightly.
You have dedicated a lot of effort to stop the players from entering the city and put your entire campaign at risk for this scenario in which the guards stop the players from meeting these people and getting their next clue, I just wonder why its so critical to the story that they not enter the city?
For some more background they've been playing in the city for a few days game time, it was just the noble district that had the guard presence. In my response to Tim I mentioned more details about the city, but the long and short of it was that the district is well protected because that's where the gentry live and the reason they needed papers was to insure they had a purpose in being there. The guard escort was originally intended as a way for them to circumvent needing papers and resulted from them rolling well and being persuasive and with the guards wanting to cover their asses. I'd intended for them to be able to get some critical information and maybe get a fine from the guards for lying to them, but thing went off the rails too quickly. This also occurred 50 feet from the front gate over several minutes, which gave the guards time to mobilize.
Sorry, I wrote that summary really quickly and briefly so a lot of the important details were missed
In one objective, neutral frame of reference, everything played out as logically as could have been expected given the parameters and what (hopefully) the players/characters knew ahead of time. The party chose to make decisions including bluffing its way into a secured area, then taking more and more risky chances in a quickly devolving situation, then inciting violence, the most naturally and logically outcome occurred. You, as the DM, didn't force them into deception, didn't throw smoke bombs, and didn't force a character into a fight to the death. That was all on the party. Your role is to adjudicate the outcomes of their choices. I think you handled it overall sensibly, and it's smart to take a step back to consider hiw to provide a logical next step option to get things back on track. As others have pointed out, you can't account for any and all decisions characters make, some stuff (like this situation) has to be made-up on the fly in the heat of the moment. It's a great opportunity to exercise DM improv and the like, but at the end of the day the party also gets to see that taking chances carries a risk with logical consequences.
What's the player with the dead character going to do at this point? Might be a good opportunity to roll-up a new character to join the party as a Guard (fighter?) to keep tabs on them, or something else that can be relatable to this moment what a way to incorporate an unexpected situation into a longer term story element...
Sounds like you have some ideas, but I wanted to throw one in. They could be tried, convicted and sentenced to hard labor in the deep mines. Probably easier for them to escape from there than from the citadel/jail. Then they're lost in the underdark, maybe with some mining tools they've repurposed as weapons, and not much else.
Sounds like you have some ideas, but I wanted to throw one in. They could be tried, convicted and sentenced to hard labor in the deep mines. Probably easier for them to escape from there than from the citadel/jail. Then they're lost in the underdark, maybe with some mining tools they've repurposed as weapons, and not much else.
That's a really good idea too. It also would give them a good reason decompress, just hit some stuff and a chance to bond with the new PC that's going to be introduced. Plus that could lead to another big plot point in the story. The setting is Norse 1000 years post-Ragnarok but it didn't go as planned and the survivors stopped the conflict by imprisoning the gods. So far they've freed Loki from under the first major metropolis they were in, so this could be a way to get them access to the god under this city.
So quick background. I've got 4 players and they're in a large dwarven city. They've been doing a quest in this city to protect a man who has accidentally cloned himself with a doppleganger ring. [If you're reading this and this sounds super super familiar, STOP READING] As part of the investigation they wanted to talk to the ring's previous owner's family (the original guy died). In order to do this they had to enter the wealthy district and did so by lying about being a performing group. Due to a 28 deception roll the guards let them enter without papers but with 4 of them escorting them instead. They tried to distract the guards with a minor illusion but it didn't work and when that plan fell through they threw some smoke bombs and scattered... in the middle of the most well guarded district in the city... with 4 guards directly around them and many more scattered about... Long story short, 2 surrendered to the guards after being cornered and were arrested, one tried to fight 10 guards and died, and the other is disguised and it will wear off soon and he's most likely going to be caught (he's was found nearby and the guards are holding him to get his statement after the situation resolves).
I'm just kinda at a loss for what to do. These guys assaulted guards, one of them was caught trying to jump over the kings palace walls ARMED, and I don't feel like I can let them go with a slap on the wrist. They're also new to this town and this was the first quest they were attempting so there's no one that can put a good word in for them. Any advice would be helpful. My current plan is to have the local assassin network reach out to them while they are in prison and offer to help them out for a price, but that's all I can think of
That is a difficult situation to figure out. Most of the ways that i can think about to get them out would make them wanted in the city and that might cause problems for your game plans. theres always the classic prison escape but that would leave them wanted which you may not want.
Another thing i can think of is maybe the place has some sort of trail by combat to be released but for an entire party to go through that it would be too time consuming and probably boring for the party.
Now the best thing i can thing of that would lead to the best results is maybe the city comes under some sort siege and the prison they were kept in was accidentally destroyed allowing them to escape (like pirates of the Caribbean) depending on your party they may want to just slip away or you could have the attacks start to attack them and when the players most likely fight back they could be pardoned after the attackers are warded off and they could gain some favor with the ruler of said city. that would also be a good time to maybe introduce some sort of villain for the party to maybe pursue.
Thats all i can really think of, that situation is a difficult one if it wasnt planned, it could easily derail a game but these things happen. I hope i helped and gave you some sort of idea!
-Manna <3
First off, I have to say, that's a lot of cops to be enforcing anti-busking laws. If it's a gated neighborhood, so be it, but having the guards literally following them is putting your PCs in a heck of a tight corner and expecting them to come up with a real stroke of genius to get out.
Tell us more about the ring and the mission. They're protecting the guy from whom? His clone? I guess one thing you can do is have Detective Rockbutt throw them into an interrogation room and scream at them for an hour. They explain what they were actually doing in the nice neighborhood. No sir, we're not potential regicides, sir, we're adventurers tracking a rogue clone. Maybe he takes an interest? Maybe he knows something they don't know? But he can't follow up on it because it's politically delicate? But a pack of unusually oafish wandering performers maybe could? Maybe he even gives them the classic 24 hours to crack the case before he feeds them to the mushroom farms? Dwarven cities have like, two ways in and out, so they're not going anywhere.
From what you said, it doesn't sound like any of them killed any guards, just fought them. That part's easily fixed. The cops tie them to the floor and stomp on them and kick them until they have 1hp each before they let them go. If the players were genuinely foolish, I might also say that any especially nice stuff they had was "misplaced in the evidence room" and they weren't getting it back, but honestly, it sounds like you put them in an excessively difficult situation to start with, so I wouldn't punish them too hard.
ETA: I'm embarrassed that Big Lizard posted the same idea 8 minutes earlier, so now I have to come up with something else...ummm...what about the ring itself? What if it made clones of the PCs and they didn't know that they're clones? And the guards guillotine them and then you tell the PCs that the camera smash-cuts to them waking up in their client's living room? And all four of them are alive again? And this experience has given them some insight into the power of the doppleganger ring? That's a little hacky, but it's short notice, give me a break.
I'm a fan of option #1 with whatever story modification makes sense.It can be a great 20-30 min roleplay ing session to start a session.
An Investigator is brought in to get down to the Why this all occurred. A Zone of Truth machine doo-hickey ensures truthful responses. Such a scandal is wanted to be avoided on behalf of the city's political powers, and a declaration can be made that "a single dangerous insane malefactor was killed in regard to a potential burglary., with grateful assistance from 3 law abiding unnamed citizens " Officially a lone gunman situation, the rest of the group being handed down suspended hard labor sentences to be imposed for even the next minor infraction. Unofficially, they now owe a bribe to the lead Investigator as well.
All that's really occurred is a story deviation but otherwise doesn't interrupt whatever greater story plot you're creating.
Boldly go
For the story behind the ring is that originally a noble commissioned it to thwart assassination attempts, it was originally made to make a soulless body double (basically a breathing husk). The noble wasn't satisfied and added an enchantment to give the clone memories and awareness so it could better function as a double, but the extra enchantment ended up splitting memories between the original and the clone. This went south after he used the ring and the original owner and the clone (who both thought they were the real one) got into an argument and ended up killing each other. The ring ended up getting picked up by an extremely paranoid shop owner who has used it 7 times to date with each clone getting more crazy as their memories are split more and more. The original quest was just to protect one of the clones who thought people were after him.
As far as there being a lot guards, I'd designed the city with 3 tiers and this was the one where all the noble families, the king, and the high level church members live, as well as the more posh shops to cater to them, and in a city of 40,000 there are about 1,000 residents on this floor. I'd originally intended for the guard escort to take them to the estate, and from there they could get some information, before most likely getting the door slammed in their face and getting a dressing down from the guards. But the whole incident when down 50 feet from the front gate in the middle of a wide open courtyard. The player who died ran around for a few minutes before going back to the front gate which had been refortified and despite the guards telling him repeatedly to surrender the fought and ended up dying. The rest of them just ended up running for a couple minutes around while guards called for reinforcements before getting caught.
I do appreciate the advice though. It's been difficult because this is my first time DMing and while I built the city and lots of routes for this quest to go, I had no idea they were going to do something like that because they just did it. No discussion. Just one player using the message spell to let the others know to scatter at the signal (which no one objected to) and throwing smoke bombs.
Okay everyone. Thanks a ton for the advice. I was really caught off guard by all the whole situation and having to deal with my first character death as a DM shook me up a bit too. I've definitely got some ideas going forward. My main one is having an investigator like Johnwinstohn suggested, who is actually part of the assassins guild in the city (I've been wanting to introduce them to this since they got a kick out of interacting with the thieves guild in another town), who will help them get out in exchange for a debt to be cashed in later. From there the investigator would rig the investigation and leverage the other things you guys talked about to get them off more lightly.
For some more background they've been playing in the city for a few days game time, it was just the noble district that had the guard presence. In my response to Tim I mentioned more details about the city, but the long and short of it was that the district is well protected because that's where the gentry live and the reason they needed papers was to insure they had a purpose in being there. The guard escort was originally intended as a way for them to circumvent needing papers and resulted from them rolling well and being persuasive and with the guards wanting to cover their asses. I'd intended for them to be able to get some critical information and maybe get a fine from the guards for lying to them, but thing went off the rails too quickly. This also occurred 50 feet from the front gate over several minutes, which gave the guards time to mobilize.
Sorry, I wrote that summary really quickly and briefly so a lot of the important details were missed
In one objective, neutral frame of reference, everything played out as logically as could have been expected given the parameters and what (hopefully) the players/characters knew ahead of time. The party chose to make decisions including bluffing its way into a secured area, then taking more and more risky chances in a quickly devolving situation, then inciting violence, the most naturally and logically outcome occurred. You, as the DM, didn't force them into deception, didn't throw smoke bombs, and didn't force a character into a fight to the death. That was all on the party. Your role is to adjudicate the outcomes of their choices. I think you handled it overall sensibly, and it's smart to take a step back to consider hiw to provide a logical next step option to get things back on track. As others have pointed out, you can't account for any and all decisions characters make, some stuff (like this situation) has to be made-up on the fly in the heat of the moment. It's a great opportunity to exercise DM improv and the like, but at the end of the day the party also gets to see that taking chances carries a risk with logical consequences.
What's the player with the dead character going to do at this point? Might be a good opportunity to roll-up a new character to join the party as a Guard (fighter?) to keep tabs on them, or something else that can be relatable to this moment what a way to incorporate an unexpected situation into a longer term story element...
Boldly go
Sounds like you have some ideas, but I wanted to throw one in. They could be tried, convicted and sentenced to hard labor in the deep mines. Probably easier for them to escape from there than from the citadel/jail. Then they're lost in the underdark, maybe with some mining tools they've repurposed as weapons, and not much else.
That's a really good idea too. It also would give them a good reason decompress, just hit some stuff and a chance to bond with the new PC that's going to be introduced. Plus that could lead to another big plot point in the story. The setting is Norse 1000 years post-Ragnarok but it didn't go as planned and the survivors stopped the conflict by imprisoning the gods. So far they've freed Loki from under the first major metropolis they were in, so this could be a way to get them access to the god under this city.
You might be able to center the quest about breaking out of the prison, then doing the doppleganger ring tomorrow
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