Here is a concept for a character I'm building, I'm posting it to get other peoples thoughts and suggestions. As the title suggests the character is a Paladin (Oath breaker), Warlock (Hex Blade) mutliclass. The spread is 15 Paladin / 5 Warlock. The main focus would be charisma attacks thanks to Hex Warrior (meaning you can hopefully take lower strength and dexterity although you still need the strength for plate). Hopefully this means you can dump your ability score improvements into Charisma, Constitution and feats. As for the race I planned on variant human. Using the point buy system the states at start are as follows: Str: 15, Dex: 10, Con: 12, Int: 10, Wis: 9, Char: 15. The extra two points from variant human go into Charisma and either Constitution (a jump start for the other Ability Score Improvement) or Wisdom (for the added bonus of not having a minus in anything). As for the extra feat, I would probably take Sentinle (possibly Alert for the extra initiative, Savage Attacker for the higher damage, or even Cruel from the Tal'Dorei setting).
Paladin/Warlock has always seemed like a fun mix that I've never had the chance to try out. I'm assuming that you'll pick paladin to start (for heavy armor proficiency) then take warlock later on? As far as stats go, I'd personally dump Int before Wis unless you plan on doing a bunch of Int-based checks. I would definitely put the ASI into Con before either of these stats, though. With a 15/5 split you'll miss out on your last ASI.
As for feats, what sort of character are you planning to play? It sounds like you plan on being in melee with a shield so sentinel would be a good choice a frontliner. If you plan on using hex or any other concentration spell, I might recommend the resilient feat for Con--you'll boost your stat and get proficiency. Once you hit level 6 paladin and are able to add you Cha modifier to all your saves, no one, save a fireball, will break your concentration.
I am planning on being a front liner. I do like the idea of getting Resilient so the hex is harder to break. I am going to start in Paladin for the armor and weapon proficiency. I may actually go lower in int and wis (possibly and 8 in both) so I can make stats like Con higher. The only real problem with that is the other players in the group. Of the seven of us none of us are playing characters with positive Int. I wanted to get Int to 10 so at leased one of us wouldn't be a complete moron lol
Everyone has negative intelligence? As difficult as that may be, it may be more interesting....I still find it hard to believe that all seven of you might dump the same stat, haha. If you want to save points on strength, you could always play a dwarf. You don't get a feat at level 1, but you could still wear plate with mediocre strength. If you grab a level of hexblade early on then you'd only have to deal with low attack rolls until level 2.
That said, I think you have some solid stuff here for your character and in a group of seven, your other PCs can easily cover any blind spots you may have.
UPDATE: To anyone interested I've been messing with the concept a little more and here is what I've come up with. Rather than the Paladin 15/ Warlock 5 split a far better split is Paladin 8/ Warlock 12. I'm gonna go ahead and show this step by step. Now first off how should you level up? I found a good split to be 2 paladin levels (start with this) then 3 warlock levels all the way to level 20 (you can start by going 3 in paladin for Oath breaker but that's up to you. If you do this then do 3 paladin, 3 warlock, 1 paladin, 3 warlock and then go for 2 paladin, 3 warlock to level 20) . As for your starting stats use the point buy system and get a 15 in charisma and strength, from there customize them as you like (higher Con is always good). Be a variant Human and raise char to 16, use the other extra point for whatever (Constitution maybe?). For the feat I took sentinel but that's up to you. Lastly for background Solider works well with this.
Doing this spread to level 20 nets some good stuff. Firstly for the Ability score improvements start by getting Charisma to 20, from there you can dump them into other stats or get more feats. I ended up taking more feats with them (Shield Master, Resilient for Constitution, and Savage Attacker). For the Invocations (6 of them) take Improved Pact Weapon (even if you have a weapon stronger than +1 this lets you use it as an arcane focus so its worth it), Maddening Hex (extra damage is always good), Relentless Hex (block off the targets escape, get in close without if after moving your full movement their still to far, the uses are endless), Thirsting Blade( change this out for Eldritch Smite when Paladin gives you extra attack), Life Drinker (More on this later), and for the last one take whatever you want. Eyes of the Rune Keeper is helpful as is Devils Sight.
Now, this is what breaks the build. Lets say your weapon is a simple long sword, now +1 because of Improved Pact Weapon. You make a single attack and it hits, here's what you add. Firstly you use Charisma for attack and damage roles thanks to Hex Warrior, next you add your Charisma Modifier to the damage because of Life Drinker, next you add another Charisma Modifier to the damage thanks to Aura of Hate from Oath breaker, next its a +1 weapon meaning the dice you role is a whopping 1d8 + 16. Next you make two of those, meaning your MINIMUM damage if both your attacks hit is 34 (spit with necrotic and slashing). Now lets break it more. Say your Target was hexed, that's an extra 1d6. Now through an Eldritch Smite into the mix, an extra 6d8 necrotic damage and now your target is prone, next your strongest level divine smite adds 3d8 extra radiant. This alone is already 1d8(sword)+1d6(hex)+6d8(eldritch smite)+3d8(divine smite)+16. The minimum damage for this is 27. Now you make two of these attack, bringing the minimum to 54. Now lets say for a moment you just so happened to have a Sword of Sharpess +3 as your pact weapon. Now since you do not have many spell slots to fuel this, save it for a boss or something giving you trouble and rest often if you can.
You can see how broken one attack can be. Now if you decide NOT to use your spell slots for Eldritch / Divine smite you can still use great spells to give you the upper hand. Think Darkness or Hunger of Hadar and even Hellish Rebuke.
From what I can tell probably the best set up for this character is a +3 Shield (possibly Adamant for the negation to crits), +3 armor (plate), a powerful magic long sword (Sword of Sharpness, Vorpal Sword, even a long sword version of Black razor or the Sword of Kas if the campaign is right). The other magic items are up to you but these alone can take this character to the next level. Needless to say I think this character could make a broken PC, a tough as nails enemy or even a final boss for some campaigns.
Woah, that's some decent damage! At what level are you calculating it? Fully leveled, you'd be a force to be reckoned with (well, until you run out of spell slots). The only drawback I see is that you have to wait until level 9 for extra attack (when you're level 5 warlock).
I think it's really interesting how you've shifted from a paladin-focused build to a warlock focus. The eldricht smite is something I didn't think of (especially since I believe the paladin's smite damage is capped at 5d8). You miss the paladin's flat 1d8 radiant damage bonus at level 11, but having those 5th level slots earlier really packs a punch.
That is indeed an impressive build. Only one thing: Eldritch Smite can only be used once per turn, so technically the second attack could only benefit from Divine Smite.
Nonetheless, it is a very solid build.
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Yeah, Im calculating the build at level 20. Another way this could be done is going 5 in Paladin from the start, giving you acess to the extra attack early. I would just have to calculate the stat spread from there if that was the case.
I'm building something quite similar to this at the moment though I rolled for stats and am able to have a 20 CHA at level one as a Half-elf. My biggest difference is that I grabbed Polearm Master at lvl 4 so now I have 4 potential attacks per round with which I can add a minimum of plus +12 to each with Hex warrior + Aura of Hate + Duelist (shield and spear.) I think the static damage increase combined with the chances to attack outweighs what I lose on weapon die damage. This is all at lvl 9 (8/1 split)
I would consider either Fey Touched with Silvery Barbs as your feat or mobile. Having a way to keep enemies off you or being able to disengage is going to be important once you hit 7th level Paladin because of the extra damage undead and fiends will do to you.
Mobile works great with your Paladin Oathbreaker Channel divinity because anyone who is frightened can't approach you. So you can attack then back up out of range then attack next turn. You could do the same with Misty Step (at the cost of a spell slot).
I would also consider undead Warlock instead of Hexblade. That does make you somewhat MAD, but you already have a 15 Strength anyway. Form of Dread is awesome and again lets frighten an enemy every turn so they can't approach you. You can also use it from range with EB.
I am planning on being a front liner. I do like the idea of getting Resilient so the hex is harder to break. I am going to start in Paladin for the armor and weapon proficiency. I may actually go lower in int and wis (possibly and 8 in both) so I can make stats like Con higher. The only real problem with that is the other players in the group. Of the seven of us none of us are playing characters with positive Int. I wanted to get Int to 10 so at leased one of us wouldn't be a complete moron lol
I would not go to 8 in intelligence and wisdom. If you do that you will have a very 1-dimensional character and you won't even get a lot of use out of your charisma because how closely that pairs with wisdom or intelligence during comnversations.
IMO Constitution is overated and 1 point better on all 5 intelligence skills is better than 1 more hp per level and +1 on constitution saves.
I would also consider a half feat (Fey Touched, Gem Dragon, Shadow Touched) to give you a 16on Charisma (14+1human+1feat) and then you get another 2 points for Intelligence or wisdom. A half feat at 1st level is worth 2 points in character creation using point buy.
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Here is a concept for a character I'm building, I'm posting it to get other peoples thoughts and suggestions. As the title suggests the character is a Paladin (Oath breaker), Warlock (Hex Blade) mutliclass. The spread is 15 Paladin / 5 Warlock. The main focus would be charisma attacks thanks to Hex Warrior (meaning you can hopefully take lower strength and dexterity although you still need the strength for plate). Hopefully this means you can dump your ability score improvements into Charisma, Constitution and feats. As for the race I planned on variant human. Using the point buy system the states at start are as follows: Str: 15, Dex: 10, Con: 12, Int: 10, Wis: 9, Char: 15. The extra two points from variant human go into Charisma and either Constitution (a jump start for the other Ability Score Improvement) or Wisdom (for the added bonus of not having a minus in anything). As for the extra feat, I would probably take Sentinle (possibly Alert for the extra initiative, Savage Attacker for the higher damage, or even Cruel from the Tal'Dorei setting).
What do you guys think?
Paladin/Warlock has always seemed like a fun mix that I've never had the chance to try out. I'm assuming that you'll pick paladin to start (for heavy armor proficiency) then take warlock later on? As far as stats go, I'd personally dump Int before Wis unless you plan on doing a bunch of Int-based checks. I would definitely put the ASI into Con before either of these stats, though. With a 15/5 split you'll miss out on your last ASI.
As for feats, what sort of character are you planning to play? It sounds like you plan on being in melee with a shield so sentinel would be a good choice a frontliner. If you plan on using hex or any other concentration spell, I might recommend the resilient feat for Con--you'll boost your stat and get proficiency. Once you hit level 6 paladin and are able to add you Cha modifier to all your saves, no one, save a fireball, will break your concentration.
I am planning on being a front liner. I do like the idea of getting Resilient so the hex is harder to break. I am going to start in Paladin for the armor and weapon proficiency. I may actually go lower in int and wis (possibly and 8 in both) so I can make stats like Con higher. The only real problem with that is the other players in the group. Of the seven of us none of us are playing characters with positive Int. I wanted to get Int to 10 so at leased one of us wouldn't be a complete moron lol
Everyone has negative intelligence? As difficult as that may be, it may be more interesting....I still find it hard to believe that all seven of you might dump the same stat, haha. If you want to save points on strength, you could always play a dwarf. You don't get a feat at level 1, but you could still wear plate with mediocre strength. If you grab a level of hexblade early on then you'd only have to deal with low attack rolls until level 2.
That said, I think you have some solid stuff here for your character and in a group of seven, your other PCs can easily cover any blind spots you may have.
Alright man thanks for the input :)
I'm gonna go ahead with this
UPDATE: To anyone interested I've been messing with the concept a little more and here is what I've come up with. Rather than the Paladin 15/ Warlock 5 split a far better split is Paladin 8/ Warlock 12. I'm gonna go ahead and show this step by step. Now first off how should you level up? I found a good split to be 2 paladin levels (start with this) then 3 warlock levels all the way to level 20 (you can start by going 3 in paladin for Oath breaker but that's up to you. If you do this then do 3 paladin, 3 warlock, 1 paladin, 3 warlock and then go for 2 paladin, 3 warlock to level 20) . As for your starting stats use the point buy system and get a 15 in charisma and strength, from there customize them as you like (higher Con is always good). Be a variant Human and raise char to 16, use the other extra point for whatever (Constitution maybe?). For the feat I took sentinel but that's up to you. Lastly for background Solider works well with this.
Doing this spread to level 20 nets some good stuff. Firstly for the Ability score improvements start by getting Charisma to 20, from there you can dump them into other stats or get more feats. I ended up taking more feats with them (Shield Master, Resilient for Constitution, and Savage Attacker). For the Invocations (6 of them) take Improved Pact Weapon (even if you have a weapon stronger than +1 this lets you use it as an arcane focus so its worth it), Maddening Hex (extra damage is always good), Relentless Hex (block off the targets escape, get in close without if after moving your full movement their still to far, the uses are endless), Thirsting Blade( change this out for Eldritch Smite when Paladin gives you extra attack), Life Drinker (More on this later), and for the last one take whatever you want. Eyes of the Rune Keeper is helpful as is Devils Sight.
Now, this is what breaks the build. Lets say your weapon is a simple long sword, now +1 because of Improved Pact Weapon. You make a single attack and it hits, here's what you add. Firstly you use Charisma for attack and damage roles thanks to Hex Warrior, next you add your Charisma Modifier to the damage because of Life Drinker, next you add another Charisma Modifier to the damage thanks to Aura of Hate from Oath breaker, next its a +1 weapon meaning the dice you role is a whopping 1d8 + 16. Next you make two of those, meaning your MINIMUM damage if both your attacks hit is 34 (spit with necrotic and slashing). Now lets break it more. Say your Target was hexed, that's an extra 1d6. Now through an Eldritch Smite into the mix, an extra 6d8 necrotic damage and now your target is prone, next your strongest level divine smite adds 3d8 extra radiant. This alone is already 1d8(sword)+1d6(hex)+6d8(eldritch smite)+3d8(divine smite)+16. The minimum damage for this is 27. Now you make two of these attack, bringing the minimum to 54. Now lets say for a moment you just so happened to have a Sword of Sharpess +3 as your pact weapon. Now since you do not have many spell slots to fuel this, save it for a boss or something giving you trouble and rest often if you can.
You can see how broken one attack can be. Now if you decide NOT to use your spell slots for Eldritch / Divine smite you can still use great spells to give you the upper hand. Think Darkness or Hunger of Hadar and even Hellish Rebuke.
From what I can tell probably the best set up for this character is a +3 Shield (possibly Adamant for the negation to crits), +3 armor (plate), a powerful magic long sword (Sword of Sharpness, Vorpal Sword, even a long sword version of Black razor or the Sword of Kas if the campaign is right). The other magic items are up to you but these alone can take this character to the next level. Needless to say I think this character could make a broken PC, a tough as nails enemy or even a final boss for some campaigns.
Woah, that's some decent damage! At what level are you calculating it? Fully leveled, you'd be a force to be reckoned with (well, until you run out of spell slots). The only drawback I see is that you have to wait until level 9 for extra attack (when you're level 5 warlock).
I think it's really interesting how you've shifted from a paladin-focused build to a warlock focus. The eldricht smite is something I didn't think of (especially since I believe the paladin's smite damage is capped at 5d8). You miss the paladin's flat 1d8 radiant damage bonus at level 11, but having those 5th level slots earlier really packs a punch.
That is indeed an impressive build. Only one thing: Eldritch Smite can only be used once per turn, so technically the second attack could only benefit from Divine Smite.
Nonetheless, it is a very solid build.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
OK thanks, I didn't think of that!
Yeah, Im calculating the build at level 20. Another way this could be done is going 5 in Paladin from the start, giving you acess to the extra attack early. I would just have to calculate the stat spread from there if that was the case.
I'm building something quite similar to this at the moment though I rolled for stats and am able to have a 20 CHA at level one as a Half-elf. My biggest difference is that I grabbed Polearm Master at lvl 4 so now I have 4 potential attacks per round with which I can add a minimum of plus +12 to each with Hex warrior + Aura of Hate + Duelist (shield and spear.) I think the static damage increase combined with the chances to attack outweighs what I lose on weapon die damage. This is all at lvl 9 (8/1 split)
Did you play your character? How was it?
I would consider either Fey Touched with Silvery Barbs as your feat or mobile. Having a way to keep enemies off you or being able to disengage is going to be important once you hit 7th level Paladin because of the extra damage undead and fiends will do to you.
Mobile works great with your Paladin Oathbreaker Channel divinity because anyone who is frightened can't approach you. So you can attack then back up out of range then attack next turn. You could do the same with Misty Step (at the cost of a spell slot).
I would also consider undead Warlock instead of Hexblade. That does make you somewhat MAD, but you already have a 15 Strength anyway. Form of Dread is awesome and again lets frighten an enemy every turn so they can't approach you. You can also use it from range with EB.
I would not go to 8 in intelligence and wisdom. If you do that you will have a very 1-dimensional character and you won't even get a lot of use out of your charisma because how closely that pairs with wisdom or intelligence during comnversations.
IMO Constitution is overated and 1 point better on all 5 intelligence skills is better than 1 more hp per level and +1 on constitution saves.
I would also consider a half feat (Fey Touched, Gem Dragon, Shadow Touched) to give you a 16on Charisma (14+1human+1feat) and then you get another 2 points for Intelligence or wisdom. A half feat at 1st level is worth 2 points in character creation using point buy.