So I've got a Ranger in my campaign and he wants to use the new rules around Hunters Mark and Two-Weapon Fighting. Specifically that hunters mark no longer requires concentration and that Two-Weapon Fighting no longer requires a bonus action. The Hunters Mark changes seem fine, but I'm not sure about the Two Weapon Fighting.
I'm not experienced enough to fully understand the implications, but it seems like that will make for some really high damage fairly early on. Our campaign just started and I've planned it out to be lv1-lv7, but if a player can add that much damage early on I'm afraid he might just delete mobs that the rest of the party struggles with.
Also, if I do implement the removable of bonus action cost for two-weapon fighting, should I remove it for all players or is it just for Rangers? I'm a bit lost.
A couple things. The player is looking at the earlier Unearth Arcana versions and a few things have changed. Hunter’s Mark in later UA (and will be official in the 2024 PHB) was back to a regular spell that you could cast, with concentration still, I think WIS mod times for free per long rest.
TWF to not use your Bonus action required a weapon with the Nick weapon mastery which were dagger, light hammer, sickle, and scimitar. Both weapons had to have the light property as usual for TWF.
That being said I think the light weapons were all d6 so if both attacks hit it would be 4d6 damage (and you will still be able to do this in the new 2024 PHB) so might be a lot at level one but not that much more than a ranger wielding a higher damage weapon with HM and no TWF
The only light weapons with a d6 damage dice are the Scimitar, Shortsword and Handaxe. Of those, the Handaxe is not finesse and only the Scimitar has the Nick mastery option. The other Light weapons use a d4 damage die.
Using a Nick weapon doesn’t directly increase the damage beyond what’s normal for two-weapon fighting, but it does free up the BA for other uses.
Personally, I’d suggest politely declining his request. The new PHB is due out in September. If you’re interested in the revised rules, you could look at swapping over when you’ve got it and digested the new rules. If not interested , or you’d rather not swap mid-campaign, just stick with the current 2014 rules.
Good catch. I was thinking more along the lines of the highest damage die being d6 but muddled it up. Thanks for catching that.
To OP, if you absolutely want to allow the player to use the UA Ranger, use the one from UA6 not the Expert Classes UA. UA6 will be closer to what will be published in September.
Depending on what your table is like, I would definitely recommend against allowing the use of these two features, which are both quite advantageous compared to regular 2014 rules. As has been mentioned, Hunter's Mark without concentration was deemed too powerful for the 2024 rules, and the off-hand attack not requiring a bonus action also has caveats and is tied to the entire weapon mastery system for 2024. It sounds like the player is just trying to get every nice feature they have heard about being possible, and mixing 2014 and 2024 rules on one character seems like it could cause problems.
With that being said, is this player's character seeming underpowered compared to the rest of the group? I would guess not, since if they have been paying attention to these changes and want to use them to increase the power of their character, they would probably be informed enough to have somewhat optimized so far. On the other hand, if they are underpowered compared to the others in the group, I might consider one or both of the changes. Beware, though, because seeing this, the other players might start asking to cherry pick the best prospective UA/2024 features for their characters as well.
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So I've got a Ranger in my campaign and he wants to use the new rules around Hunters Mark and Two-Weapon Fighting. Specifically that hunters mark no longer requires concentration and that Two-Weapon Fighting no longer requires a bonus action. The Hunters Mark changes seem fine, but I'm not sure about the Two Weapon Fighting.
I'm not experienced enough to fully understand the implications, but it seems like that will make for some really high damage fairly early on. Our campaign just started and I've planned it out to be lv1-lv7, but if a player can add that much damage early on I'm afraid he might just delete mobs that the rest of the party struggles with.
Also, if I do implement the removable of bonus action cost for two-weapon fighting, should I remove it for all players or is it just for Rangers? I'm a bit lost.
A couple things. The player is looking at the earlier Unearth Arcana versions and a few things have changed. Hunter’s Mark in later UA (and will be official in the 2024 PHB) was back to a regular spell that you could cast, with concentration still, I think WIS mod times for free per long rest.
TWF to not use your Bonus action required a weapon with the Nick weapon mastery which were dagger, light hammer, sickle, and scimitar. Both weapons had to have the light property as usual for TWF.
That being said I think the light weapons were all d6 so if both attacks hit it would be 4d6 damage (and you will still be able to do this in the new 2024 PHB) so might be a lot at level one but not that much more than a ranger wielding a higher damage weapon with HM and no TWF
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
The only light weapons with a d6 damage dice are the Scimitar, Shortsword and Handaxe. Of those, the Handaxe is not finesse and only the Scimitar has the Nick mastery option. The other Light weapons use a d4 damage die.
Using a Nick weapon doesn’t directly increase the damage beyond what’s normal for two-weapon fighting, but it does free up the BA for other uses.
Personally, I’d suggest politely declining his request. The new PHB is due out in September. If you’re interested in the revised rules, you could look at swapping over when you’ve got it and digested the new rules. If not interested , or you’d rather not swap mid-campaign, just stick with the current 2014 rules.
Good catch. I was thinking more along the lines of the highest damage die being d6 but muddled it up. Thanks for catching that.
To OP, if you absolutely want to allow the player to use the UA Ranger, use the one from UA6 not the Expert Classes UA. UA6 will be closer to what will be published in September.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
Depending on what your table is like, I would definitely recommend against allowing the use of these two features, which are both quite advantageous compared to regular 2014 rules. As has been mentioned, Hunter's Mark without concentration was deemed too powerful for the 2024 rules, and the off-hand attack not requiring a bonus action also has caveats and is tied to the entire weapon mastery system for 2024. It sounds like the player is just trying to get every nice feature they have heard about being possible, and mixing 2014 and 2024 rules on one character seems like it could cause problems.
With that being said, is this player's character seeming underpowered compared to the rest of the group? I would guess not, since if they have been paying attention to these changes and want to use them to increase the power of their character, they would probably be informed enough to have somewhat optimized so far. On the other hand, if they are underpowered compared to the others in the group, I might consider one or both of the changes. Beware, though, because seeing this, the other players might start asking to cherry pick the best prospective UA/2024 features for their characters as well.