I was listening to a recent sorcerer concept video from Youtube's d4: D&D Deep Dive channel and in it there was a brief mention of a melee-focused sorcerer subclass that Dungeon Dudes are showing for an upcoming project. I was wondering if any of you have seen this, and if so what your thoughts were?
I have watched the video. The basic premise of the build is to take a level of Paladin for armor and shield proficiency as well as the spell Searing Smite. Run up to the enemy with your sword, hit it with True Strike, the use your bonus action to tack on an upcast Searing Smite. The smite does damage when you cast it, then again at the start of the monster's turn. The monster saves at the end of their turn to end the burning. If it fails, it keeps taking the damage every turn until they make their save or die. When upcast, both the initial damage and the extra damage scale by 1d6 per spell level each. So at Sorcerer 17, Pally 1, you would could run up to an enemy and True Strike with a Greatsword for 5d6+5, then tack on a Level 9 Searing Smite 9d6 right away, and 9d6 again at the start of their turn. That's a total of 23d6+5 damage or 85.5 damage on average.
That's the basic strategy, though I know Colby had some other stuff added to it do deal more damage (Great Weapon Master, Charger feat, etc.)
This build works well with Storm Sorcerer subclass, though the Searing Smite spell itself would not work for the Storm Sorcerer's lightning/thunder damage bonus. Thunderous Smite does, however.
My thanks to you both for the response. I neglected to say thank you to Sequilonis when they posted, my apology for that. Colby's build from DnD Deep Dive I did understand, and it was interesting. My question was more if anyone had familiarity with the Dungeon Dudes melee-focused subclass that he mentioned had excited him about trying to do a build of his own with existing PC options.
I was looking into this as well and I paid for the patreon to see it for myself.
To put it simply it's a decent subclass, strong at tier 1-2 and weaker at tier 3-4 (though that's not accounting for the spells you can cast).
I am happy to break it down for you in a simple summary of you want without copy pasting it as I think that's a disservice to the dungeon dudes by not paying for it. But I can give you an overall simplified description for each feature if you'd like?
I'm not sure whether you're talking about a sub-class (a set of additional rules that we apparently haven't seen yet) or a multi-class (a way of building a character). Since no one can usefully comment on the former, I'll assume the latter.
Taking a brief splash in Paladin and then piling on caster levels is a fairly common technique. If you're primarily interested in the martial side of things, Warlock is generally a stronger choice. While your spell level caps out at a lower level, the ability to Extra Attack up to three times and use Charisma as your weapon stat provides a lot more value than almost anything you could get from Sorcerer.
Bard is also likely a stronger option since Bard has better sub-classes than Sorcerer does to support such a playstyle. However, Bard runs afoul of the same issue Sorcerer does: why would anyone ever cast a 9th level Searing Smite? Sure, it does a lot of damage. So does Power Word: Kill - and there's no save against Power Word: Kill. Or you could cast Blade of Disaster with Elven Accuracy and average about double the damage per round of Searing Smite - and you can do so safely behind your Wall of Force.
I was looking into this as well and I paid for the patreon to see it for myself.
To put it simply it's a decent subclass, strong at tier 1-2 and weaker at tier 3-4 (though that's not accounting for the spells you can cast).
I am happy to break it down for you in a simple summary of you want without copy pasting it as I think that's a disservice to the dungeon dudes by not paying for it. But I can give you an overall simplified description for each feature if you'd like?
I'd love to see a summary of how the subclass works if you're ok providing that. I certainly agree with your comment on not copy-pasting it. Thanks very much!
It's called the Wraith blade Sorcerer and is themed around having a wraith or other undead spirit/ warrior spirit possessing you or being in your blood as an explanation for your origins.
@ level 3- Warrior Spirit - you gain martial proficiencies and an ability to see things etherealy.
@ level 3 - wraith blade spells - the standout spells from this list are fount of moonlight and steel wind strike though the others are good too.
@ level 3 - meta blade - here the dudes have done something I have done in my own custom homebrew and others too, they've utilised the meta magic styles with weapon attacks. The only two they haven't made one for is heightened and extended.
@ level 6 - you get the bladesinger extra attack
@ level 14 - you get a ghost from which is great for manoeuvrability
@ level 18 - ghostly possession - you can effectively possess someone but there are limitations to prevent it's continued abuse which is good.
It's called the Wraith blade Sorcerer and is themed around having a wraith or other undead spirit/ warrior spirit possessing you or being in your blood as an explanation for your origins.
@ level 3- Warrior Spirit - you gain martial proficiencies and an ability to see things etherealy.
@ level 3 - wraith blade spells - the standout spells from this list are fount of moonlight and steel wind strike though the others are good too.
@ level 3 - meta blade - here the dudes have done something I have done in my own custom homebrew and others too, they've utilised the meta magic styles with weapon attacks. The only two they haven't made one for is heightened and extended.
@ level 6 - you get the bladesinger extra attack
@ level 14 - you get a ghost from which is great for manoeuvrability
@ level 18 - ghostly possession - you can effectively possess someone but there are limitations to prevent it's continued abuse which is good.
Ahh, I had no idea it had an undead theme. That's not usually my thing, but what you have described sounds like it could be reflavored for something fey-themed perhaps. Thanks for the insights! I wonder if there is an upcoming product they plan to publish this in.
I’m not familiar with the video, but was playing with the concept yesterday. Basically start as a Level 1 Dwarven (maybe DEX) Fighter, Dual wield Short Sword and *Scimitar, then go Dragon Sorcerer and using Flame Blade as a scimitar, which needs a bit of DM fiat and is a bit MAD.
you don't really need extra attack to do decent melee with a sorcerer ..... p 6 / s 4 @10th lvl = ~23 dmg / round with extra attack Greenflame Blade or Booming Blade ( with draconic ) = ~18 dmg
I’m not familiar with the video, but was playing with the concept yesterday. Basically start as a Level 1 Dwarven (maybe DEX) Fighter, Dual wield Short Sword and *Scimitar, then go Dragon Sorcerer and using Flame Blade as a scimitar, which needs a bit of DM fiat and is a bit MAD.
i wouldn't use flame blade with a dragon sorcerer after reaching 9th lvl in sorcerer flame blade @5th spell lvl slot ~17 additional dmg, depending on DM if you can use truestrike, booming blade, greenflame with it summon Dragon @5th spell lvl slot 19 add dmg @11th lvl flame blade: 20 dmg; summon dragon : 47 add
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Hello
I was listening to a recent sorcerer concept video from Youtube's d4: D&D Deep Dive channel and in it there was a brief mention of a melee-focused sorcerer subclass that Dungeon Dudes are showing for an upcoming project. I was wondering if any of you have seen this, and if so what your thoughts were?
I have watched the video. The basic premise of the build is to take a level of Paladin for armor and shield proficiency as well as the spell Searing Smite. Run up to the enemy with your sword, hit it with True Strike, the use your bonus action to tack on an upcast Searing Smite. The smite does damage when you cast it, then again at the start of the monster's turn. The monster saves at the end of their turn to end the burning. If it fails, it keeps taking the damage every turn until they make their save or die. When upcast, both the initial damage and the extra damage scale by 1d6 per spell level each. So at Sorcerer 17, Pally 1, you would could run up to an enemy and True Strike with a Greatsword for 5d6+5, then tack on a Level 9 Searing Smite 9d6 right away, and 9d6 again at the start of their turn. That's a total of 23d6+5 damage or 85.5 damage on average.
That's the basic strategy, though I know Colby had some other stuff added to it do deal more damage (Great Weapon Master, Charger feat, etc.)
This build works well with Storm Sorcerer subclass, though the Searing Smite spell itself would not work for the Storm Sorcerer's lightning/thunder damage bonus. Thunderous Smite does, however.
My thanks to you both for the response. I neglected to say thank you to Sequilonis when they posted, my apology for that. Colby's build from DnD Deep Dive I did understand, and it was interesting. My question was more if anyone had familiarity with the Dungeon Dudes melee-focused subclass that he mentioned had excited him about trying to do a build of his own with existing PC options.
Haven't watched the episodes you refer to, but this is probably pretty close Dungeon Dude ep: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Z21URtWQDA
Paladin/Sorc multiclass.
Also, look up Hexblade/Sorcerer multi-class using your search engine. Should provide a few options, too.
Hi,
I was looking into this as well and I paid for the patreon to see it for myself.
To put it simply it's a decent subclass, strong at tier 1-2 and weaker at tier 3-4 (though that's not accounting for the spells you can cast).
I am happy to break it down for you in a simple summary of you want without copy pasting it as I think that's a disservice to the dungeon dudes by not paying for it. But I can give you an overall simplified description for each feature if you'd like?
I'm not sure whether you're talking about a sub-class (a set of additional rules that we apparently haven't seen yet) or a multi-class (a way of building a character). Since no one can usefully comment on the former, I'll assume the latter.
Taking a brief splash in Paladin and then piling on caster levels is a fairly common technique. If you're primarily interested in the martial side of things, Warlock is generally a stronger choice. While your spell level caps out at a lower level, the ability to Extra Attack up to three times and use Charisma as your weapon stat provides a lot more value than almost anything you could get from Sorcerer.
Bard is also likely a stronger option since Bard has better sub-classes than Sorcerer does to support such a playstyle. However, Bard runs afoul of the same issue Sorcerer does: why would anyone ever cast a 9th level Searing Smite? Sure, it does a lot of damage. So does Power Word: Kill - and there's no save against Power Word: Kill. Or you could cast Blade of Disaster with Elven Accuracy and average about double the damage per round of Searing Smite - and you can do so safely behind your Wall of Force.
I'd love to see a summary of how the subclass works if you're ok providing that. I certainly agree with your comment on not copy-pasting it. Thanks very much!
@Allurian219
So this is how the subclass is broken down:
It's called the Wraith blade Sorcerer and is themed around having a wraith or other undead spirit/ warrior spirit possessing you or being in your blood as an explanation for your origins.
@ level 3- Warrior Spirit - you gain martial proficiencies and an ability to see things etherealy.
@ level 3 - wraith blade spells - the standout spells from this list are fount of moonlight and steel wind strike though the others are good too.
@ level 3 - meta blade - here the dudes have done something I have done in my own custom homebrew and others too, they've utilised the meta magic styles with weapon attacks. The only two they haven't made one for is heightened and extended.
@ level 6 - you get the bladesinger extra attack
@ level 14 - you get a ghost from which is great for manoeuvrability
@ level 18 - ghostly possession - you can effectively possess someone but there are limitations to prevent it's continued abuse which is good.
Ahh, I had no idea it had an undead theme. That's not usually my thing, but what you have described sounds like it could be reflavored for something fey-themed perhaps. Thanks for the insights! I wonder if there is an upcoming product they plan to publish this in.
I’m not familiar with the video, but was playing with the concept yesterday. Basically start as a Level 1 Dwarven (maybe DEX) Fighter, Dual wield Short Sword and *Scimitar, then go Dragon Sorcerer and using Flame Blade as a scimitar, which needs a bit of DM fiat and is a bit MAD.
you don't really need extra attack to do decent melee with a sorcerer .....
p 6 / s 4 @10th lvl = ~23 dmg / round with extra attack
Greenflame Blade or Booming Blade ( with draconic ) = ~18 dmg
dpR p6 / s4 @10th ~37 ( also mix smite, quicken )
dpR p1 / s9 @10th ~54 ( mix of smite, quicken, summon dragon )
@tier 3 + tier4 they are pretty close to each other
dpr p1 / s19 ~130
dpr p6 / s14 ~139
even a s20 isn't that far behind ( w/o smites ) with ~110 dpR
all calculations made with 4 encounters with 4 rounds each per long rest = 16 rounds total
i wouldn't use flame blade with a dragon sorcerer after reaching 9th lvl in sorcerer
flame blade @5th spell lvl slot ~17 additional dmg, depending on DM if you can use truestrike, booming blade, greenflame with it
summon Dragon @5th spell lvl slot 19 add dmg
@11th lvl flame blade: 20 dmg; summon dragon : 47 add