Hello there. Just a quick introduction; I have't played this game since the 1980's. However, my son, who has been getting dragged in deeper and deeper to video games has shown an interest in this game, and bought the books. Seeing an opportunity to pull him out of the games some and nurture some more face time with him before he leaves for college (4 years from now LOL), I read the books and am preparing to pick up the ol' DM hat and consider getting back into this.
So, I have developed my own DM screen, practiced some elements of the game, am in the process of reading the Angry GM's blogs, and I must say this game is much more slick than it used to be. In any case, I am throwing out this quick request while I am at work:
Does anyone have a data-source/chart that details the interspecies associations between monsters in this universe?
For instance, we know Orcs will associate to some extent with Ogres, Trolls, Wargs, but will they associate with goblins? We know goblins, hobgoblin, bugbears associate, but will they associate with giants, werewolves?
My main reason for requesting this is I am trying to develop a fairly sophisticated "random encounter system" that would generate encounters that look fairly custom made....but it is best implemented if I can figure out these associations.
I could read the MM....but that would be more lengthy than asking here, LOL
I'm sorry that I do not know of an item like this, nor do I fully understand the history of the races. BUT what I do know is that the races in the Player's Handbook has a little something about this on each of the playable races. I also know that these race interactions are different between some campaign settings (Forbidden Realms and Greyhawk for example). So what you could do (and this is what I would do) is create your own setting, that way everything you create is true and fact and can be made up on the fly! I would just make sure to maybe make note of things like this so that you have consistency! Hope I helped somewhat!
The answer to these questions actually differs from setting to setting.
As such, I think the best thing to do is decide as DM what you would prefer the answer to the questions to be, and then have it be exactly that - whether it contradicts what some book or another says or not.
The answer to these questions actually differs from setting to setting.
As such, I think the best thing to do is decide as DM what you would prefer the answer to the questions to be, and then have it be exactly that - whether it contradicts what some book or another says or not.
This is the same thing I thought when I read your question, and I had asked your question about 3 years ago when I began building my own world. The answer is entirely up to you and your imagination/influence. Do you want to have it where Cave Trolls are the bruisers of the Goblins? Do you want it to where the Merfolk and the land dwellers have a relationship out of necessity rather than desire. Do the Were-creatures dominate the land and have subjugated all races that are smooth skins? Do your Elves co-mingle with the Dwarves?
Pick a lore that you're more comfortable with, LoTR, Dragonlance, Narnia, whatever, and make that your baseline. From there you can expand on the generalizations you've made to create the political, economic, and social structures you'll need for these encounters.
I was guessing this might be the answer; "you are the master of your universe, so you make those decisions". While quite freeing, it is also a daunting prospect. At least, if one is able to fly by the seat of their pants, then they can improv much of the mythos and then worry about making it more consistent and cogent later on (well, I imagine that's what everyone else does; runs their first adventure ram shod and then cleans it up once players have bought into the story line).
So that is what I am going to do. For now on, green skinned creatures and pale/beige/tan skinned creatures can't tolerate each other. So trolls and ogres can't see eye to eye. There, I've said it, now its law.
For instance, we know Orcs will associate to some extent with Ogres, Trolls, Wargs, but will they associate with goblins? We know goblins, hobgoblin, bugbears associate, but will they associate with giants, werewolves?
Welcome back - 5E is slick and also quite modular so you can add certain rules to encourage certain directions of play if you want which is great. Anyway:if you've got the 3 core books (PHB, DMG, MM) I would strongly suggest Volos guide to monsters. It's crammed with theme/fluff and ideas (as well as some stat blocks for them!).
I come from a warhammer background (don't hate me!) so to me goblins/trolls/orcs are all greenskins and can worktogether - but usually because there's someone bigger bullying them around!
However as far as 'official' D&D/faerun goes: Goblinoids (goblins, hobgoblins and bugbears) co-exist, they usually worship a small pantheon of tyrannical deities led by the goblin diety (I find religion is a good unifying motivator for evil races). It explicitly states that goblins get along with wargs, as well as wolves and vermin such as giant rats so they can all be tied in together. There are also demonic wolf/goblin hybrids called Bhargests which can appear as a wolf-demon or as a goblin and are quite nasty.
Goblins in D&D tend to be stupid and petty, bugbears are strong and stealthy but lazy and hobgoblins are organized.
Orcs tend to be seperate to goblins although they can have half-orcs too. Again there's nothing stopping a tribe of misfits working together. Orcs seem more tribal in my mind although I tend to play them like less friendly klingons (warrior culture, die a good death etc) compared to goblins who wouldn't hesistate to stab you in the back. There's also half-orc/half-ogres called Orogs which are just bigger and meaner.
The innate evil racial religions tend to be relatively xenophobic / totalitarian (eg Gruumish the orc god states that orcs are the master race, but the goblin god states that goblins should be in charge, Lolth says drow should rule supreme etc) There's mention that Gruumish and Magublibet* (goblin god) hate each other and constantly fight an eternal war in the afterlife. You could get around these linear divisions by making a unified tribe who worship a different deity? So maybe an evil army of Tiamat has orc and hobgoblin line troops, with goblin warg riders as forward scouts and bugbears as auxillary assassins/flankers, in addition to the usual assortment of dragons, wyverns and the like?
Any of these monsters can easily be paired with things like trolls/ettins/ogres who don't really have their own super-important xenophobic deity and are probably happy to go with the flow (as long as they get food). Kobolds tend to be quite submissive and although they have their own deity (kurklemak* or something?) are happy to help out other bigger races - especially dragons - as long as they don't get eaten.
Giants have a massively complex pantheon but it seems that they're quite happy to work for/with other races as long as it suits them / they get paid / get food.
Gnolls have a whole god/ demon-lord of hungry-slaughter (Yeenooh*) that basically creates gnolls out of hyenas but there's nothing stopping you having 'agnostic' gnolls who are still evil and reproduce normally, but aren't driven to mindlessly slaughter and eat things. Ditto with minotaurs - again they are 'agnostic' like trolls and ogres although are loosely affiliated with Baphomet (in that he looks like a minotaur and likes to mindlessly slaughter things -presumably in a maze?)
Then you have the random other monsters such as chimeras, hydras, drakes, dragons, manticores and so on who could end up allied with anyone anywhere. Presumably some bribery with food and/or treasure is in order.
Basically it's your world, shape it how you think is cool. If in your world goblins are just immature orcs that's cool too, or you could have an Oglin - 1/2 orc 1/2 goblin. (AKA an uruk-hai) - it's your world after all - even if it's an official setting, you can still twist, modify and change it as long as everyone is on the same page!
I feel like you got a pretty good answer already, but I felt like throwing in my 2 cents. I like to build dungeons that have two or three different types (or groups I guess) of monsters with different goals and reactions to each other. That way the players may have a political option to deal the encounters (like turning them against each other or talking their way out of a fight sometimes) so they don't always have to hack and slash through everything.... unless they want to.
I like to do this by picking two or three monster groups from the MM, reading up on the race summary there, and thinking about what it would take to make them fight each-other or work together. Then I work those things into the narrative until the players have a choice on how they want to handle it.
Hello there. Just a quick introduction; I have't played this game since the 1980's. However, my son, who has been getting dragged in deeper and deeper to video games has shown an interest in this game, and bought the books. Seeing an opportunity to pull him out of the games some and nurture some more face time with him before he leaves for college (4 years from now LOL), I read the books and am preparing to pick up the ol' DM hat and consider getting back into this.
So, I have developed my own DM screen, practiced some elements of the game, am in the process of reading the Angry GM's blogs, and I must say this game is much more slick than it used to be. In any case, I am throwing out this quick request while I am at work:
Does anyone have a data-source/chart that details the interspecies associations between monsters in this universe?
For instance, we know Orcs will associate to some extent with Ogres, Trolls, Wargs, but will they associate with goblins? We know goblins, hobgoblin, bugbears associate, but will they associate with giants, werewolves?
My main reason for requesting this is I am trying to develop a fairly sophisticated "random encounter system" that would generate encounters that look fairly custom made....but it is best implemented if I can figure out these associations.
I could read the MM....but that would be more lengthy than asking here, LOL
Thanks for any assistance.
Cheers
John
I'm sorry that I do not know of an item like this, nor do I fully understand the history of the races. BUT what I do know is that the races in the Player's Handbook has a little something about this on each of the playable races. I also know that these race interactions are different between some campaign settings (Forbidden Realms and Greyhawk for example). So what you could do (and this is what I would do) is create your own setting, that way everything you create is true and fact and can be made up on the fly! I would just make sure to maybe make note of things like this so that you have consistency! Hope I helped somewhat!
Published Subclasses
The answer to these questions actually differs from setting to setting.
As such, I think the best thing to do is decide as DM what you would prefer the answer to the questions to be, and then have it be exactly that - whether it contradicts what some book or another says or not.
http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page
Maybe a good place to start. Other than that I recommend you check out the MM or Volo's.
I would look at Volo's since that describes various social structures for them.
Wow, thanks for the many replies so far.
I was guessing this might be the answer; "you are the master of your universe, so you make those decisions". While quite freeing, it is also a daunting prospect. At least, if one is able to fly by the seat of their pants, then they can improv much of the mythos and then worry about making it more consistent and cogent later on (well, I imagine that's what everyone else does; runs their first adventure ram shod and then cleans it up once players have bought into the story line).
So that is what I am going to do. For now on, green skinned creatures and pale/beige/tan skinned creatures can't tolerate each other. So trolls and ogres can't see eye to eye. There, I've said it, now its law.
Cheers
John
Welcome back - 5E is slick and also quite modular so you can add certain rules to encourage certain directions of play if you want which is great. Anyway:if you've got the 3 core books (PHB, DMG, MM) I would strongly suggest Volos guide to monsters. It's crammed with theme/fluff and ideas (as well as some stat blocks for them!).
I come from a warhammer background (don't hate me!) so to me goblins/trolls/orcs are all greenskins and can worktogether - but usually because there's someone bigger bullying them around!
However as far as 'official' D&D/faerun goes: Goblinoids (goblins, hobgoblins and bugbears) co-exist, they usually worship a small pantheon of tyrannical deities led by the goblin diety (I find religion is a good unifying motivator for evil races). It explicitly states that goblins get along with wargs, as well as wolves and vermin such as giant rats so they can all be tied in together. There are also demonic wolf/goblin hybrids called Bhargests which can appear as a wolf-demon or as a goblin and are quite nasty.
Goblins in D&D tend to be stupid and petty, bugbears are strong and stealthy but lazy and hobgoblins are organized.
Orcs tend to be seperate to goblins although they can have half-orcs too. Again there's nothing stopping a tribe of misfits working together. Orcs seem more tribal in my mind although I tend to play them like less friendly klingons (warrior culture, die a good death etc) compared to goblins who wouldn't hesistate to stab you in the back. There's also half-orc/half-ogres called Orogs which are just bigger and meaner.
The innate evil racial religions tend to be relatively xenophobic / totalitarian (eg Gruumish the orc god states that orcs are the master race, but the goblin god states that goblins should be in charge, Lolth says drow should rule supreme etc) There's mention that Gruumish and Magublibet* (goblin god) hate each other and constantly fight an eternal war in the afterlife. You could get around these linear divisions by making a unified tribe who worship a different deity? So maybe an evil army of Tiamat has orc and hobgoblin line troops, with goblin warg riders as forward scouts and bugbears as auxillary assassins/flankers, in addition to the usual assortment of dragons, wyverns and the like?
Any of these monsters can easily be paired with things like trolls/ettins/ogres who don't really have their own super-important xenophobic deity and are probably happy to go with the flow (as long as they get food). Kobolds tend to be quite submissive and although they have their own deity (kurklemak* or something?) are happy to help out other bigger races - especially dragons - as long as they don't get eaten.
Giants have a massively complex pantheon but it seems that they're quite happy to work for/with other races as long as it suits them / they get paid / get food.
Gnolls have a whole god/ demon-lord of hungry-slaughter (Yeenooh*) that basically creates gnolls out of hyenas but there's nothing stopping you having 'agnostic' gnolls who are still evil and reproduce normally, but aren't driven to mindlessly slaughter and eat things. Ditto with minotaurs - again they are 'agnostic' like trolls and ogres although are loosely affiliated with Baphomet (in that he looks like a minotaur and likes to mindlessly slaughter things -presumably in a maze?)
Then you have the random other monsters such as chimeras, hydras, drakes, dragons, manticores and so on who could end up allied with anyone anywhere. Presumably some bribery with food and/or treasure is in order.
Basically it's your world, shape it how you think is cool. If in your world goblins are just immature orcs that's cool too, or you could have an Oglin - 1/2 orc 1/2 goblin. (AKA an uruk-hai) - it's your world after all - even if it's an official setting, you can still twist, modify and change it as long as everyone is on the same page!
*its 2AM here and I can't spell!
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Hi John,
I feel like you got a pretty good answer already, but I felt like throwing in my 2 cents. I like to build dungeons that have two or three different types (or groups I guess) of monsters with different goals and reactions to each other. That way the players may have a political option to deal the encounters (like turning them against each other or talking their way out of a fight sometimes) so they don't always have to hack and slash through everything.... unless they want to.
I like to do this by picking two or three monster groups from the MM, reading up on the race summary there, and thinking about what it would take to make them fight each-other or work together. Then I work those things into the narrative until the players have a choice on how they want to handle it.
Yep. Cheers!
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