It only restricts movement if the target actually wants to move, which isn't neccesarily the case.
Sure. But most enemies want to move, further many (perhaps most) MUST move to be effective.
There is no save! It automatically takes afffect. This is HUGE on a creature with legendary resistance .... unless he is both immune to poison and does not have to move to be effective and I can only think of any of those off the top of my head.
But at the same time you only have two chances to succeed and then you are out so it's not sustainable and not very reliable.
It AUTOMATICALLY succeeds. There is no save. You only use it after you hit, so there is no "chance to succeed" it always suceeds.
I don't get why you don't understand that. The other Arcane shots mostly have saves (for the effects, not the damage). Grasping arrow has no save.
Also for clarity you have 2 chances until 15th level. After that it is 9 shots in a normal adventuring day and at least one in every single fight.
No it doesn't. Also, just because the battle master maneuvers have their weaknesses doesn't mean that the weaknesses of the Arcane Shots go away.
Fewer enemies are resistant to poison damage then are resistant to non-magic P/B/S. It is not a weakness, it is a strength. Grasping arrow is going to affect more enemies than weapon attacks will effect.
The point is you are calling this a weakness when it is a strength.
It may be weaker than other grasping arrows which do other even more effective types of damage, but saying something else is stronger does not make that a weakness
And a Fighter who dumps dex has a DC to sneak, that does not mean his attacks don't damage people or affect people.
If you dump intelligence (a big if) enemies will still take the poison damage without a save, still take any movement damage between your turn and their turn and then lose an action on their turn to ATTEMPT a check against your weak DC.
So you basically have to choose between being a one trick pony or be less not be as nerfed?
Actually I would argue it is the other way around. If you go with say a lower constitution and a higher intelligence you go from being a 1-trick pony oriented solely towards combat to a more versatile useful and fun to play character bringing combat as well as Intelligence-based skills to the table in addition to having more viable Arcane Shot options. Obviously you would want your background, racial and class skill choices to compliment this.
Moreover any build that uses point buy is a compromise and being narrowly focused will make you better at what you focus on at the cost of many other things.
When you are talking about "one trick pony", I notice you are also not bringing Arcane Archer Lore, Curving shot, Magic arrow or Eveready shot into the discussion. Probably because they do not support your argument?
Different from Battlemaster maneuvers that usually have a duration of 1 round. Grasping Arrow has a duration of 1 minute. I agree two per rest is not ideal, but this is an ability that can win encounters by itself. It was made to kill BBEGs, not minions. It’s an Athletics check that could be rolled with disadvantage because of Hex. Do you realize that legendary/magic resistance do not affect this roll because it’s an ability check and not a saving throw? Yes, your mighty Wizard/Cleric buddies suffering because their awesome Hypnotic Pattern/Spirit Guardians are not being effective against powerful enemies who roll saving throws with advantage or simply choose to pass will envy your humble Grasping Arrow causing lots of damage and potentiality making them waste their action.
Grasping Arrow is a hidden gem that it’s powerful alone. My proposed build just potencialize their capacity.
Grasping arrow isn't bad but it's doesn't make the AA as good as you think it does. How many things have resistance and/or immunity to poison? That's half the damage gone already. The slashing damage only activates when it moves without teleporting. So it just stays and fights, like most monsters are want to do. Or it teleports, as many other monsters can do. Add to this how MAD your build is. You need at least Cha and Dex 13 and to get the DC up to your 13/14 you need an Int of at 14 (unless you want to wait until higher levels where creatures have more HP and are more likely to have teleportation magic) so are you going to let your Dex or Con suffer?
Oh, it's also a magical effect so it can easily be dispelled.
I don't know what kind of white room scenario you're imagining here but this is rarely the case unless your whole party consists of Fighters and Barbarians that don't do anything else than using basic attacks.
No white room scenario more than the original suggestion so no need to strawman. :)
With your kind of arguing spells like Spike Growth and such are terrible as well (hint: they aren't).
Again, no need for strawmen. :)
And no, just one level dip into Warlock doesn't make this build not being an Arcane Archer build.
Of course it does. It's a multiclassed character. That's what "multiclass" means.
It just optimizes it with multiclassing. At its core it's still an Arcane Archer.
...that still relies on multiclassing to be good. Which means that you can't say that AA is as good as it's claimed to be since it requires something that isn't the AA.
If you're a purist that doesn't accept multiclassing for whatever reason then that's on you but then you also gotta accept that you're playing this game differently than the vast majority of people.
I've never claimed anything of the sorts so again, please don't strawman.
It's not THAT MAD either. A 13 in a bunch of stats is not a whole lot and you don't need an incredibly high INT for a working Arcane Archer build. Your main focus is DEX. You are a martial, not a caster. Not to mention that as Fighter you have more ASIs than anyone else.
Having a 13 in more than three abilities IS MAD. And having only a 13 only gives you a +1 modifier which isn't very good.
You want to dispel it? Great! A wasted Action AND a wasted spell. That's great value for your short rest magic arrow!
The spell sin't wasted. Maybe read up on what Dispel Magic actually does? ;)
Honestly, this is just ridiculous. I won't go into detail replying to everything, ECM03 does that well enough already. All I'm going to say is, it's you who maybe should actually read what things do and agree to disagree.
The spell sin't wasted. Maybe read up on what Dispel Magic actually does? ;)
Dispel magic can only dispel a spell, this is well established and thoroughly documented. You can target a magical effect that is not a spell but you can not dispel it. It only dispels spells, period. References:
There are other ways to surpress grasping arrow, a beholder's eye ray for example will surpress it, but those effects are rare. Sure when they are there they will work against GA and they will work almost against everything a wizard is going to cast. But no one runs around suggesting a Wizard is weak because there are things that can surpress (or even dispel) every spell he casts.
I'm playing a wood elf gloomstalker ranger turn damphir. I got really lucky with stats, and dm allowed me to take elven accuracy as my racial feat at lvl one. My stats are with bonus' str 13 dex 20 con 17 wis 20 int 10 char 15 I'm thinking of going with ranger until lvl 5. Then 4 lvls of fighter for arcane archer then 4 lvls in rouge for assassan. After that I'm not sure. more ranger or fighter? The feats will be sharpshooter, alert, fey touched aberrant dragon mark, depending on how for the game goes I'll throw in lucky. I'm taking the archery fighting style from ranger and defence from fighter. I have studded leather armor for ac of 18. Thoughs and comments welcome. Thanks all.
I'm playing a wood elf gloomstalker ranger turn damphir. I got really lucky with stats, and dm allowed me to take elven accuracy as my racial feat at lvl one. My stats are with bonus' str 13 dex 20 con 17 wis 20 int 10 char 15 I'm thinking of going with ranger until lvl 5. Then 4 lvls of fighter for arcane archer then 4 lvls in rouge for assassan. After that I'm not sure. more ranger or fighter? The feats will be sharpshooter, alert, fey touched aberrant dragon mark, depending on how for the game goes I'll throw in lucky. I'm taking the archery fighting style from ranger and defence from fighter. I have studded leather armor for ac of 18. Thoughs and comments welcome. Thanks all.
as far as martial prowess goes, this is a solid build and there's not much wrong with. However, my opinion is that you're going to miss out on the ranger goodies. If you go four levels into fighter, you're getting action surge most notable, but from AA, what're you really getting? Some things you can do twice per short rest? eeehhh. By contrast, you could've had 3rd lvl spells and free wisdom saving throw proficiency. I value that more than whatever AA gets access to.
What're you wanting to get from rogue? more skills? One level will do. cunning action? situation, but only need two. So, any more? It's going to depend on your goals.
If I were building this character, I might do ranger 5, then do 2 levels of fighter, then back to ranger until your second feat or you unlock 3rd lvl spells. If you do want a fighter subclass, samurai's hard to beat in terms of power, especially with gloom stalker ranger.
I'm currently playing a 12/4 Horizon Walker Ranger/Assassin and love it. I'm sure Gloomstalker is fun as well.
If you get a DM that will work with you on setting up surprise rounds it is very powerful. However if it is a dungeon crawl where everything just pops up on you it can be underwhelming.
I did take the alert feat so I get the bonus to initiative (+10 currently) and so we never get surprised.
The ultimate scout build for sure as you will have expertise on several skills and a super high passive perception.
I'm trying to build a character who assassinates people from the dark at range with out anyone knowing they where there. I'm not going for the most optimal build but more of an optimized flavor build.
I have a question about the shape water spell. My character is a damphir. Is it possible for her to stand on the ceiling above an enemy cast shape water, freeze it into a spike shape and let gravity do its thing.
Good morning all. Need advice on an unconventional flavor build. I'm playing a wood elf turned dhampir gloomstalker ranger. My stats are 13str 20dex with bonus 17con 10 int 20wis with bonus and 15char. With elven accuracy as lvl 1 racial feat Going to lvl 4 with ranger for asi sharpshooter. Can't decide if I should go with 4 lvls of arcane archer first then go to hexblade warlock. Or if I should go 4 lvls hexblade then fighter. Suggestions please.
If the campaign goes to 20 the final result will be 4 ranger 7 arcane archer 9 warlock.
Good morning all. Need advice on an unconventional flavor build. I'm playing a wood elf turned dhampir gloomstalker ranger. My stats are 13str 20dex with bonus 17con 10 int 20wis with bonus and 15char. With elven accuracy as lvl 1 racial feat Going to lvl 4 with ranger for asi sharpshooter. Can't decide if I should go with 4 lvls of arcane archer first then go to hexblade warlock. Or if I should go 4 lvls hexblade then fighter. Suggestions please.
If the campaign goes to 20 the final result will be 4 ranger 7 arcane archer 9 warlock.
Given those choices I would go Arcane Archer.
I don't see Hexblade doing a lot for you. Not sure the reason you are looking at that subclass as you already have martial weapons, medium armor and your dex is better than your charisma so the hex weapon won't be useful (in addition it does not work on bows). If you want the Warlock spells and Invocations, the other sublclasses are all better than Hexblade for this build I think. Undead Warlock would be the ideal thematically with a Dhapir I think, in addition to being the strongest mechanically with your class breakdown. Undying and Archfey would also fit in well thematically. Fiend, Great Old One and Genie would all be better than Hexblade mechanically, although they might not work thematically.
Everyone in a while some genius decides to try and use a non-damaging spell to do damage. The answer should always be:
1) This spell will not do more damage or be more likely to do damage than a spell of the same level that states it does damage.
2) You do not 'auto' hit by saying "I let it fall on X" anymore than you auto hit because you say "I hit him with my sword": No. That is either an attack or a save or BOTH. See rule #1 for damage etc.
-----
In addition, 90% of the time when someone tries this kind of thing they have made a major mistake, such as understanding how physics works, or understanding how combat works.
I have a question about the shape water spell. My character is a damphir. Is it possible for her to stand on the ceiling above an enemy cast shape water, freeze it into a spike shape and let gravity do its thing.
There are a few issues with this:
Where is the water coming from, and how much of it is there actually going to be? Shape water requires the water to already exist, and it can't target more than a 5 foot cube at a time. Even if you have a full waterskin to draw from you're probably not going to make a very big spike (similar in size to a club, so probably similar impact depending on how generous your DM is).
How are you holding it in place? You can only shape the water while it's water, and if you're trying to form it on the ceiling it'll fall before you have a chance to freeze it.
How long will it take? Shape water is an action, so it'll take your action on one turn to shape it, then your action on another turn to freeze it, before you can actually drop it.
The best way I could see something like this working is if you used shape water to make one ice spike in advance, since it lasts for an hour (and you can't create a second as you'd need three effects active at once). You can then carry the spike up onto the ceiling for a "free" attack by dropping it for a little bonus damage. As a DM I'd be happy to allow that as an occasional ploy in an ambush, probably not with high damage (unless you get a good amount of water), certainly no more than equivalent fall damage, and as Mog_Dracov says it makes sense to give the target a saving throw, as this is consistent with creatures falling onto other creatures. As an occasional ploy it could be fun, but I wouldn't expect it to work as a common tactic.
Not to give the wrong impression; I'm all for creative uses of spells, but this seems like one that has too many road-blocks to be effective. If you're on the ceiling anyway, why not just ask if there are stalactites you can kick loose, chandeliers you can drop etc.? 😉
Snipe with a battle master.... Use goading attack from long distance and give your enemy disadvantage until he can reach you. SS with precision + elven accuracy takes a very low roll to miss. Take two levels of warlock for nice hex boost.
My favorite is a Wood Elf, Rogue 1 level, then Ranger Hunter 5 levels, Rogue 5 more levels (Scout at 3rd), then finish to taste with Fighter Champion 3 levels or all the rest in Rogue...
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Sure. But most enemies want to move, further many (perhaps most) MUST move to be effective.
There is no save! It automatically takes afffect. This is HUGE on a creature with legendary resistance .... unless he is both immune to poison and does not have to move to be effective and I can only think of any of those off the top of my head.
It AUTOMATICALLY succeeds. There is no save. You only use it after you hit, so there is no "chance to succeed" it always suceeds.
I don't get why you don't understand that. The other Arcane shots mostly have saves (for the effects, not the damage). Grasping arrow has no save.
Also for clarity you have 2 chances until 15th level. After that it is 9 shots in a normal adventuring day and at least one in every single fight.
Fewer enemies are resistant to poison damage then are resistant to non-magic P/B/S. It is not a weakness, it is a strength. Grasping arrow is going to affect more enemies than weapon attacks will effect.
The point is you are calling this a weakness when it is a strength.
It may be weaker than other grasping arrows which do other even more effective types of damage, but saying something else is stronger does not make that a weakness
And a Fighter who dumps dex has a DC to sneak, that does not mean his attacks don't damage people or affect people.
If you dump intelligence (a big if) enemies will still take the poison damage without a save, still take any movement damage between your turn and their turn and then lose an action on their turn to ATTEMPT a check against your weak DC.
Actually I would argue it is the other way around. If you go with say a lower constitution and a higher intelligence you go from being a 1-trick pony oriented solely towards combat to a more versatile useful and fun to play character bringing combat as well as Intelligence-based skills to the table in addition to having more viable Arcane Shot options. Obviously you would want your background, racial and class skill choices to compliment this.
Moreover any build that uses point buy is a compromise and being narrowly focused will make you better at what you focus on at the cost of many other things.
When you are talking about "one trick pony", I notice you are also not bringing Arcane Archer Lore, Curving shot, Magic arrow or Eveready shot into the discussion. Probably because they do not support your argument?
Honestly, this is just ridiculous. I won't go into detail replying to everything, ECM03 does that well enough already. All I'm going to say is, it's you who maybe should actually read what things do and agree to disagree.
I've never encountered a forum where I got this many "talking to a wall" impressions as this one...
Dispel magic can only dispel a spell, this is well established and thoroughly documented. You can target a magical effect that is not a spell but you can not dispel it. It only dispels spells, period. References:
https://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/SA-Compendium.pdf - page 16
https://twitter.com/jeremyecrawford/status/692448278160502786?lang=en
There are other ways to surpress grasping arrow, a beholder's eye ray for example will surpress it, but those effects are rare. Sure when they are there they will work against GA and they will work almost against everything a wizard is going to cast. But no one runs around suggesting a Wizard is weak because there are things that can surpress (or even dispel) every spell he casts.
I'm playing a wood elf gloomstalker ranger turn damphir. I got really lucky with stats, and dm allowed me to take elven accuracy as my racial feat at lvl one. My stats are with bonus' str 13 dex 20 con 17 wis 20 int 10 char 15 I'm thinking of going with ranger until lvl 5. Then 4 lvls of fighter for arcane archer then 4 lvls in rouge for assassan. After that I'm not sure. more ranger or fighter? The feats will be sharpshooter, alert, fey touched aberrant dragon mark, depending on how for the game goes I'll throw in lucky. I'm taking the archery fighting style from ranger and defence from fighter. I have studded leather armor for ac of 18. Thoughs and comments welcome. Thanks all.
as far as martial prowess goes, this is a solid build and there's not much wrong with. However, my opinion is that you're going to miss out on the ranger goodies. If you go four levels into fighter, you're getting action surge most notable, but from AA, what're you really getting? Some things you can do twice per short rest? eeehhh. By contrast, you could've had 3rd lvl spells and free wisdom saving throw proficiency. I value that more than whatever AA gets access to.
What're you wanting to get from rogue? more skills? One level will do. cunning action? situation, but only need two. So, any more? It's going to depend on your goals.
If I were building this character, I might do ranger 5, then do 2 levels of fighter, then back to ranger until your second feat or you unlock 3rd lvl spells. If you do want a fighter subclass, samurai's hard to beat in terms of power, especially with gloom stalker ranger.
I'm currently playing a 12/4 Horizon Walker Ranger/Assassin and love it. I'm sure Gloomstalker is fun as well.
If you get a DM that will work with you on setting up surprise rounds it is very powerful. However if it is a dungeon crawl where everything just pops up on you it can be underwhelming.
I did take the alert feat so I get the bonus to initiative (+10 currently) and so we never get surprised.
The ultimate scout build for sure as you will have expertise on several skills and a super high passive perception.
I'm trying to build a character who assassinates people from the dark at range with out anyone knowing they where there. I'm not going for the most optimal build but more of an optimized flavor build.
I have a question about the shape water spell. My character is a damphir. Is it possible for her to stand on the ceiling above an enemy cast shape water, freeze it into a spike shape and let gravity do its thing.
Piercing, with Sharp Shooter is a great combo and it adds one to your dex.
Good morning all. Need advice on an unconventional flavor build. I'm playing a wood elf turned dhampir gloomstalker ranger. My stats are 13str 20dex with bonus 17con 10 int 20wis with bonus and 15char. With elven accuracy as lvl 1 racial feat Going to lvl 4 with ranger for asi sharpshooter. Can't decide if I should go with 4 lvls of arcane archer first then go to hexblade warlock. Or if I should go 4 lvls hexblade then fighter. Suggestions please.
If the campaign goes to 20 the final result will be 4 ranger 7 arcane archer 9 warlock.
Given those choices I would go Arcane Archer.
I don't see Hexblade doing a lot for you. Not sure the reason you are looking at that subclass as you already have martial weapons, medium armor and your dex is better than your charisma so the hex weapon won't be useful (in addition it does not work on bows). If you want the Warlock spells and Invocations, the other sublclasses are all better than Hexblade for this build I think. Undead Warlock would be the ideal thematically with a Dhapir I think, in addition to being the strongest mechanically with your class breakdown. Undying and Archfey would also fit in well thematically. Fiend, Great Old One and Genie would all be better than Hexblade mechanically, although they might not work thematically.
Everyone in a while some genius decides to try and use a non-damaging spell to do damage. The answer should always be:
1) This spell will not do more damage or be more likely to do damage than a spell of the same level that states it does damage.
2) You do not 'auto' hit by saying "I let it fall on X" anymore than you auto hit because you say "I hit him with my sword": No. That is either an attack or a save or BOTH. See rule #1 for damage etc.
-----
In addition, 90% of the time when someone tries this kind of thing they have made a major mistake, such as understanding how physics works, or understanding how combat works.
There are a few issues with this:
The best way I could see something like this working is if you used shape water to make one ice spike in advance, since it lasts for an hour (and you can't create a second as you'd need three effects active at once). You can then carry the spike up onto the ceiling for a "free" attack by dropping it for a little bonus damage. As a DM I'd be happy to allow that as an occasional ploy in an ambush, probably not with high damage (unless you get a good amount of water), certainly no more than equivalent fall damage, and as Mog_Dracov says it makes sense to give the target a saving throw, as this is consistent with creatures falling onto other creatures. As an occasional ploy it could be fun, but I wouldn't expect it to work as a common tactic.
Not to give the wrong impression; I'm all for creative uses of spells, but this seems like one that has too many road-blocks to be effective. If you're on the ceiling anyway, why not just ask if there are stalactites you can kick loose, chandeliers you can drop etc.? 😉
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Snipe with a battle master.... Use goading attack from long distance and give your enemy disadvantage until he can reach you. SS with precision + elven accuracy takes a very low roll to miss. Take two levels of warlock for nice hex boost.
My favorite is a Wood Elf, Rogue 1 level, then Ranger Hunter 5 levels, Rogue 5 more levels (Scout at 3rd), then finish to taste with Fighter Champion 3 levels or all the rest in Rogue...