I just got to 8th level and am thinking of adding entangle but I wanted to get peoples sense of how it plays out it’s mid tier rangers. My ranger has a 16 WIS. Since I have a fey wanderer I am trying to find effective first level spells to keep open misty steps at second level. Have people used entangle with their Rangers? Does it hit enough to be worth it? Thanks in advance.
Entangle doesn’t really “hit” think of it as a 20 foot square slow zone you can put anywhere you want in a 60’ radius. By turning the terrain into difficult terrain you reduce the speed of folks passing thru to 12or 15’ so those beyond typically have 2 rounds in it to get through. That means 2 tries at the strength save minimum. It’s best use as a flow control to break up swarms/hordes into manageable groups. Against large creatures it’s not of great use but against hordes/minions it’s a very useful tool.
I used it a couple of times at a choke point to prevent being overrun by a mob of enemies. We retreated and kited the deadlier ones. The actual entangling wasn't all that great.
I have that too. But as a fey wanderer I want to keep a level two slot or two free for misty step for movement/escape. Also, sometimes spike growth is too big for the fight so I wanted a smaller option with a potentially beneficial rider such as restrained.
I have that too. But as a fey wanderer I want to keep a level two slot or two free for misty step for movement/escape. Also, sometimes spike growth is too big for the fight so I wanted a smaller option with a potentially beneficial rider such as restrained.
I see. Go for it!
Without magic items, we are talking out a spell save DC with 10% less effectiveness than a maxed casting stat from say a druid. It’s a solid tactical spell.
I agree with Frank. Entangle is one of the best 1st-level control spells in the game. Druids tend to have higher save DC's, so they tend to be better at it. But Rangers still make great use of it. And especially as a Fey Wanderer, you're encouraged to pump your Wisdom more than most other Rangers (bar new Beast Master,) so you should be able to catch up to a Druid's spell save quicker. Also, see if your DM can throw you a bone and give you a Moon Sickle. It's perfect for this kind of stuff.
What are your other 1st-level spells? Once you get past the bowl of temptation that is Hunter's Mark, you'll find that Rangers have a lot of great spells at that level. Ensnaring Strike, Fog Cloud, Goodberry, Long Strider, Zephyr Strike, Fog Cloud, Cure Wounds, Detect Magic, and Absorb Elements are just some of my personal favorites.
I am thinking of swapping out Hunter's Mark for Entangle. So I would have Goodberry, Absorb Elements, and Entangle. For second level I have Spike Growth and Summon Beast. I want to lean into the control/summoning aspects of the Ranger spell list. And with favored foe and sharpshooter I do enough damage to live without Hunter's Mark.
WIS 16 ensures a good spell save DC, main problem is that both Entangle and Ensnaring Strike (which is a great spell as well) require STR saves and creatures usually have it high. That’s why I consider Web a little bit better than Entangle, although level 2.
But do you know an usually underrated alternative to restrain your enemies? Net.
You already have Sharpshooter to mitigate the strange disadvantage of a net if you attack at 15 ft range. It’s an attack roll that even have the amazing +2 benefit of Archery fighting style. And you will restrain an enemy for at least 1 round. No save! I know you will need to spend all your action on that, but Entangle would require the same, so it’s fine.
Another possible option of battlefield control besides the aforementioned Spike Growth is Fog Cloud. You could use to give you protection like casting just right behind you and start move in and out to attack, or simply cast upon a group of enemies to make them lost.
I think the value of Entangle depends partly on your DM; if they're very good at tracking movement and positioning then it can be a fantastic spell.
You ideally want some kind of obstructions you can place it in between; a pair of rocks, crates/carts, sides of a gulley, corridor in a building etc. can all work as your goal is to force the enemy to pass down where you can hit them to maximum effect.
It's going to work best on groups of enemies, especially if they're having to travel in a column to get to you (due to the aforementioned obstructions). When I've used it I tend to aim it such that half of the area is ahead of the enemy, and the other half hits some at the front. This means fewer enemies testing for being restrained, but also means that enemies that pass their save still lose most of their movement trying to leave the area.
While the restraining is great, IMO the difficult terrain is the key feature as it just works; even if it only delays enemies by a single turn, that's an extra turn you get to shoot at them from a range, and potentially an extra turn without the enemy striking back. If you can restrain even some of those enemies then they will restrict the others behind them even further (or block them completely). With good positioning your enemies will either have no choice but to lose speed going through the area, or lose the same time going around it (if they even can).
It's a shame you can't trigger further restrain checks, but I think it's pretty good value for a 1st level spell. That said, you need your DM and your group to work with you a bit to get the most out of it, as if you've got players who just rush into every fight then you may not get a chance to really benefit from it; it'll work best if all your party members have decent ranged options, or otherwise things they can do while the enemy are slowed (though even melee focused players can hold an action for when the enemy come close).
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Entangle is a great spell at teir one and maybe some at tier two. A good question is how good is it in your particular group of PCs. Can no other PC cast it? Then please take it! If at least one other PC can cast it, take something else, especially by tier two. A ranger really comes online at level 5 (as a striker role), so using an action to cast something that a full caster can cast may not be the most fun or tactical. But rangers are good and entangle is good so it's not bad! :-)
I am the only character who can cast it. I have used it mainly for surprise right before initiative to decent effect. Once the fighting starts I focus sharpshooting arrows in peoples heads.
I am the only character who can cast it. I have used it mainly for surprise right before initiative to decent effect. Once the fighting starts I focus sharpshooting arrows in peoples heads.
Another thing with this spell is combat engagement, maneuver tactics, and possible retreat.
While just about any other martial build (fighter (non archer), paladin, barbarian, and rogue (non archer)) needs to be right up front and in the fray of battle to do anything, let alone be effective, rangers can win a battle before it’s begun, or at least swing the odds in favor of their side, so long as they have some room to work with. Something unique to rangers among martial classes. Entangle, fog cloud, spike growth, pass without trace, conjure animals, plant growth, all can do similar things to turn the tide of an encounter. Entangle let’s you do that starting at level 2 instead of level 5. If another full caster in the party has access to the spell, let them worry about it.
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I just got to 8th level and am thinking of adding entangle but I wanted to get peoples sense of how it plays out it’s mid tier rangers. My ranger has a 16 WIS. Since I have a fey wanderer I am trying to find effective first level spells to keep open misty steps at second level. Have people used entangle with their Rangers? Does it hit enough to be worth it? Thanks in advance.
Entangle doesn’t really “hit” think of it as a 20 foot square slow zone you can put anywhere you want in a 60’ radius. By turning the terrain into difficult terrain you reduce the speed of folks passing thru to 12or 15’ so those beyond typically have 2 rounds in it to get through. That means 2 tries at the strength save minimum. It’s best use as a flow control to break up swarms/hordes into manageable groups. Against large creatures it’s not of great use but against hordes/minions it’s a very useful tool.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
I used it a couple of times at a choke point to prevent being overrun by a mob of enemies. We retreated and kited the deadlier ones. The actual entangling wasn't all that great.
Is it a first level slot need? Why not spike growth?
I have that too. But as a fey wanderer I want to keep a level two slot or two free for misty step for movement/escape. Also, sometimes spike growth is too big for the fight so I wanted a smaller option with a potentially beneficial rider such as restrained.
I see. Go for it!
Without magic items, we are talking out a spell save DC with 10% less effectiveness than a maxed casting stat from say a druid. It’s a solid tactical spell.
I agree with Frank. Entangle is one of the best 1st-level control spells in the game. Druids tend to have higher save DC's, so they tend to be better at it. But Rangers still make great use of it. And especially as a Fey Wanderer, you're encouraged to pump your Wisdom more than most other Rangers (bar new Beast Master,) so you should be able to catch up to a Druid's spell save quicker. Also, see if your DM can throw you a bone and give you a Moon Sickle. It's perfect for this kind of stuff.
What are your other 1st-level spells? Once you get past the bowl of temptation that is Hunter's Mark, you'll find that Rangers have a lot of great spells at that level. Ensnaring Strike, Fog Cloud, Goodberry, Long Strider, Zephyr Strike, Fog Cloud, Cure Wounds, Detect Magic, and Absorb Elements are just some of my personal favorites.
I am thinking of swapping out Hunter's Mark for Entangle. So I would have Goodberry, Absorb Elements, and Entangle. For second level I have Spike Growth and Summon Beast. I want to lean into the control/summoning aspects of the Ranger spell list. And with favored foe and sharpshooter I do enough damage to live without Hunter's Mark.
Does it land often enough without max wisdom to make it worthwhile for Elven Advantage as an archer? Would Ensnaring Strike be better?
WIS 16 ensures a good spell save DC, main problem is that both Entangle and Ensnaring Strike (which is a great spell as well) require STR saves and creatures usually have it high. That’s why I consider Web a little bit better than Entangle, although level 2.
But do you know an usually underrated alternative to restrain your enemies? Net.
You already have Sharpshooter to mitigate the strange disadvantage of a net if you attack at 15 ft range. It’s an attack roll that even have the amazing +2 benefit of Archery fighting style. And you will restrain an enemy for at least 1 round. No save! I know you will need to spend all your action on that, but Entangle would require the same, so it’s fine.
Another possible option of battlefield control besides the aforementioned Spike Growth is Fog Cloud. You could use to give you protection like casting just right behind you and start move in and out to attack, or simply cast upon a group of enemies to make them lost.
I think the value of Entangle depends partly on your DM; if they're very good at tracking movement and positioning then it can be a fantastic spell.
You ideally want some kind of obstructions you can place it in between; a pair of rocks, crates/carts, sides of a gulley, corridor in a building etc. can all work as your goal is to force the enemy to pass down where you can hit them to maximum effect.
It's going to work best on groups of enemies, especially if they're having to travel in a column to get to you (due to the aforementioned obstructions). When I've used it I tend to aim it such that half of the area is ahead of the enemy, and the other half hits some at the front. This means fewer enemies testing for being restrained, but also means that enemies that pass their save still lose most of their movement trying to leave the area.
While the restraining is great, IMO the difficult terrain is the key feature as it just works; even if it only delays enemies by a single turn, that's an extra turn you get to shoot at them from a range, and potentially an extra turn without the enemy striking back. If you can restrain even some of those enemies then they will restrict the others behind them even further (or block them completely). With good positioning your enemies will either have no choice but to lose speed going through the area, or lose the same time going around it (if they even can).
It's a shame you can't trigger further restrain checks, but I think it's pretty good value for a 1st level spell. That said, you need your DM and your group to work with you a bit to get the most out of it, as if you've got players who just rush into every fight then you may not get a chance to really benefit from it; it'll work best if all your party members have decent ranged options, or otherwise things they can do while the enemy are slowed (though even melee focused players can hold an action for when the enemy come close).
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Entangle is a great spell at teir one and maybe some at tier two. A good question is how good is it in your particular group of PCs. Can no other PC cast it? Then please take it! If at least one other PC can cast it, take something else, especially by tier two. A ranger really comes online at level 5 (as a striker role), so using an action to cast something that a full caster can cast may not be the most fun or tactical. But rangers are good and entangle is good so it's not bad! :-)
I am the only character who can cast it. I have used it mainly for surprise right before initiative to decent effect. Once the fighting starts I focus sharpshooting arrows in peoples heads.
Awesome! Keep it. Viney death!
Another thing with this spell is combat engagement, maneuver tactics, and possible retreat.
While just about any other martial build (fighter (non archer), paladin, barbarian, and rogue (non archer)) needs to be right up front and in the fray of battle to do anything, let alone be effective, rangers can win a battle before it’s begun, or at least swing the odds in favor of their side, so long as they have some room to work with. Something unique to rangers among martial classes. Entangle, fog cloud, spike growth, pass without trace, conjure animals, plant growth, all can do similar things to turn the tide of an encounter. Entangle let’s you do that starting at level 2 instead of level 5. If another full caster in the party has access to the spell, let them worry about it.