I was disappointing that Tasha's isn't going to introduce spell list for the PHB Rangers so I dusted off my list from an older 'Fixing the Ranger" thread and took the time to create a list for the new Drakewarden who I feel has only failed to received one because giving it one would have made the Beastmasters feel that much more neglected.
Spell list for PHB Hunter, Beastmaster, and the new Drakewarden
Considering we currently are in a period of leaks and official changes you should probably clarify that those expanded spell lists are onyl your personal homebrew. Just so people don't get unnecessarily confused.
Hunter list is fine. It's basically just a collection of universally useful spells and the Hunter doesn't really have any specific flavour on its own.
Not sure I agree with the Beastmaster list. The Beastmaster is all about having that one special companion, not about summoning a bunch of expendable minions.
I already said my part about the Drakewarden list in the other thread so I'll skip that one.
Yeah, I guess someone could be confused, but I thought it was pretty well known that they have not added expanded list to the PHB, though I thought Tasha's would have been the perfect time to do so. I updated the post clarifying this.
I get that Beastmaster as it is is about that one bond, but I think the class could be about being a master of beast, as in you do have lots of options for calling all manner of creature to your aid.
Ok, some years are passed since last post but... My interpretation of a list of expanded spells for the Hunter subclass are spells with simpler effect spells that have the function of giving physical improvements, resistances or compromising that of the opponent, here we go:
While the lists all look nice at this point with the ODD ranger having prepared spell access to the entire primal list except evocation none of the spell lists are really needed anymore - just convince your DM to let you run a ODD ranger with the subclass you want if it’s not the hunter from the UA.
Does ti make sense that 2 subclasses get the same spell at third level? Having different spells helps reinforce the flavor of each subclass
I believe so because the same magic can be compatible with the different concepts presented in subclasses of the same class. A very good example is "Protection from Good and Evil", present in both the Monster Slayer (a subclass whose concept is eliminating supernatural threats) and the Horizon Walker (a subclass whose theme is dealing with extraplanar threats).
Minor question but as swarmkeeper gets Faerie Fire shouldn't hunter get something else?
Unfortunately, the great idea of providing additional spells to Ranger subclasses only happened in Xanathar's guide (a book that was very unfairly treated by the community, by the way).
Bonus spells were also provided in Tasha's to the Fey Wanderer and the Swarmkeeper Ranger, BUT they were not extended in the same book to the Beastmaster. Later bonus spells were not given to the Drake Warden with the exception of Thaumaturgy.
It is my belief that the Hunter/Beastmaster/Drakewarden do not have bonus spells by design. Either it is simple stubbornness or a balance reason. At least for the pet classes I can easily understand the balance.
Bonus spells were also provided in Tasha's to the Fey Wanderer and the Swarmkeeper Ranger, BUT they were not extended in the same book to the Beastmaster. Later bonus spells were not given to the Drake Warden with the exception of Thaumaturgy.
I expressed myself badly here, I'm sorry, english isn't my native language. I meant that the idea for the additional spells exists since Xanathar's guide book.
It is my belief that the Hunter/Beastmaster/Drakewarden do not have bonus spells by design. Either it is simple stubbornness or a balance reason. At least for the pet classes I can easily understand the balance.
I agree with Beastmaster and Drakewarden, as they have powerful pets that compare to a list of five additional spells, but this is not the case with the Hunter subclass.
In my opinion, in this case it was not entirely WoTC's fault. I believe that when the subclass was created along with the Beastmaster, the proposal was to make a comparison between a ranger subclass that depended on a beast and a subclass that did not, exercising the role of a martial warrior with all the main nuances that it implies. (damage, defense, attack and reaction). The problem with that, regardless of the dubious quality of both subclasses, is that WoTC should have anticipated what more subclasses would come and what role and possible themes they would be able to exercise given what the Ranger class offered. The idea of giving Ranger additional spells (always spells that Rangers normally doesn't have access) in order to express thematics and role in later subclasses was a great success, but as WoTC never had the humility to admit a mistake really since the beginning of 5e or at least provide a retroactive book to improve the first subclasses and avoid the effect of powercreeping, the Hunter subclass was left without additional spells anyway.
There are those who say that the hunter does not have enough "personality" to justify a spell list, precisely because he is a standard class, as the Champion is for the Fighter. But as I posted my list above of spells for the hunter, I think it's quite possible to make a coherent list for a subclass that is themed to be a survivor and that follows nature's law of killing before being killed.
I was disappointing that Tasha's isn't going to introduce spell list for the PHB Rangers so I dusted off my list from an older 'Fixing the Ranger" thread and took the time to create a list for the new Drakewarden who I feel has only failed to received one because giving it one would have made the Beastmasters feel that much more neglected.
Spell list for PHB Hunter, Beastmaster, and the new Drakewarden
Hunter:
3rd Faerie Fire
5th Blindness/Deafness
9th take Haste from the the Horizon Walker, give them Blink
13th Confusion
17th Hold Monster
Beastmaster:
3rd Find Familiar
5th Find Steed
9th Hypnotic Pattern
13th Giant Insect
17th Insect Plague
Drakewarden:
3rd Tasha's Caustic Brew
5th Dragon's Breath
9th Erupting Earth or Fear
13th Elemental Bane
17th Immolation
I like them!
How about conjure animals for the beast master 9th level spell?!
Rangers already get that spell
Oh. I see what you’re doing. Got it.
I thought if we gave it to them on their beast master spell list it would free up a known spell.
It would, but I prefer to expand out
Yeah, I guess someone could be confused, but I thought it was pretty well known that they have not added expanded list to the PHB, though I thought Tasha's would have been the perfect time to do so. I updated the post clarifying this.
I get that Beastmaster as it is is about that one bond, but I think the class could be about being a master of beast, as in you do have lots of options for calling all manner of creature to your aid.
I personally went with this for my beastmaster spell list;
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Ok, some years are passed since last post but... My interpretation of a list of expanded spells for the Hunter subclass are spells with simpler effect spells that have the function of giving physical improvements, resistances or compromising that of the opponent, here we go:
While the lists all look nice at this point with the ODD ranger having prepared spell access to the entire primal list except evocation none of the spell lists are really needed anymore - just convince your DM to let you run a ODD ranger with the subclass you want if it’s not the hunter from the UA.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Minor question but as swarmkeeper gets Faerie Fire shouldn't hunter get something else?
Could always change it, but not like it's a requirement that says classes can't have the same spells in list.
My Homebrew | Background | Feats | Magic Items | Races | Spells | Subclass | Homebrewery
To see my more recent homebrew creations, please check out my content on Hombrewery.
Does ti make sense that 2 subclasses get the same spell at third level? Having different spells helps reinforce the flavor of each subclass
I believe so because the same magic can be compatible with the different concepts presented in subclasses of the same class. A very good example is "Protection from Good and Evil", present in both the Monster Slayer (a subclass whose concept is eliminating supernatural threats) and the Horizon Walker (a subclass whose theme is dealing with extraplanar threats).
Unfortunately, the great idea of providing additional spells to Ranger subclasses only happened in Xanathar's guide (a book that was very unfairly treated by the community, by the way).
Bonus spells were also provided in Tasha's to the Fey Wanderer and the Swarmkeeper Ranger, BUT they were not extended in the same book to the Beastmaster. Later bonus spells were not given to the Drake Warden with the exception of Thaumaturgy.
It is my belief that the Hunter/Beastmaster/Drakewarden do not have bonus spells by design. Either it is simple stubbornness or a balance reason. At least for the pet classes I can easily understand the balance.
I expressed myself badly here, I'm sorry, english isn't my native language. I meant that the idea for the additional spells exists since Xanathar's guide book.
I agree with Beastmaster and Drakewarden, as they have powerful pets that compare to a list of five additional spells, but this is not the case with the Hunter subclass.
In my opinion, in this case it was not entirely WoTC's fault. I believe that when the subclass was created along with the Beastmaster, the proposal was to make a comparison between a ranger subclass that depended on a beast and a subclass that did not, exercising the role of a martial warrior with all the main nuances that it implies. (damage, defense, attack and reaction). The problem with that, regardless of the dubious quality of both subclasses, is that WoTC should have anticipated what more subclasses would come and what role and possible themes they would be able to exercise given what the Ranger class offered. The idea of giving Ranger additional spells (always spells that Rangers normally doesn't have access) in order to express thematics and role in later subclasses was a great success, but as WoTC never had the humility to admit a mistake really since the beginning of 5e or at least provide a retroactive book to improve the first subclasses and avoid the effect of powercreeping, the Hunter subclass was left without additional spells anyway.
There are those who say that the hunter does not have enough "personality" to justify a spell list, precisely because he is a standard class, as the Champion is for the Fighter. But as I posted my list above of spells for the hunter, I think it's quite possible to make a coherent list for a subclass that is themed to be a survivor and that follows nature's law of killing before being killed.