I've been looking through the mercer gunslinger subclass and it's cool ih everything it can do, essentially it being specialized battle master for guns with the caveat that your firearms can misfire and everything, but thanks to the gunner feat it's largely made kind of redundant in certain areas:
Rapid Repair
Upon reaching 10th level, you learn how to quickly attempt to fix a jammed gun. You can spend a grit point to attempt to repair a misfired (but not broken) firearm as a bonus action.
Lightning Reload
Starting at 15th level, you can reload any firearm as a bonus action.
That's two whole class features that are sort of being wasted with the gunner feat, which allows you to ignore the loading property, has no misfire chance, and let's you fire into melee ranged without having to deal with disadvantage.
My question here is how would one fix the gunslinger feat in light of the gunner feat?
The gunner feat doesn't interact with the gunslinger. The firearms used by gunslinger don't have the loading property and the gunner feat doesn't make any mention of misfire
oh no i know that but with the gunner feat you may ignore loading which is one of the major downsides of using the slinger sub. You need to use one of your attacks/actions to do it thanks to the reloading property, whereas with the gunner feat you can just use a normal pistol and ignore the loading property.
Point being that the gunner feat on like a rogue or battle master or what have you is gonna blow the slinger out of the water in most instances
I really like gunslinger, but it is just homebrew. I am sure it there were ever a truly official printing of the subclass, it would be reworked quite a bit to bring it in line with firearms from the DMG and the Gunner Feat. Who knows, Mr Mercer may actually update it himself at some point.
oh no i know that but with the gunner feat you may ignore loading which is one of the major downsides of using the slinger sub. You need to use one of your attacks/actions to do it thanks to the reloading property, whereas with the gunner feat you can just use a normal pistol and ignore the loading property.
Point being that the gunner feat on like a rogue or battle master or what have you is gonna blow the slinger out of the water in most instances
At this point it is just best to ignore the subclass unless Matt somehow updates it in light of new feat. Right now it is best to be any other class + gunner feat for a gunslinger or even just battlemaster+ gunner feat
so this issue of Gunner not working for Gun slinger just came up in a game for me and there is a workaround for it I found. also to quote Davyd "the firearms used by gunslinger don't have the loading.....". Both DMG and gunslinger do have a form of loading, the only difference is how it is worded. gunslinger is "reload" and DMG is loading. so really minus the prefix or suffix of the word. they are the same; however, where they differ is the ammo count each gun could hold and misfire, but misfire alone is its own feature and does not affect the feat of the Gunner in any way. this is because misfires make you take action or attack to remove the issue of the misfire. so the only thing the gunner really does is take away the action of reloading.
so if the DM doesn't allow gunner with gunslinger here is a workaround, but due note these are ideas that your DM can say no to. loading feature: so the quickest way to say I don't need ammo is to take artificer level 2 and take the infusion repeating shot. this will allow you to not worry about the reloading feature in gunslinger, it also gives you a plus one item . however, it does not deal with the misfire rule in gunslinger if your DM makes you use those guns. close range: so gunner also gives another really good thing, "Being within 5 feet of a hostile creature doesn’t impose disadvantage on your ranged attack rolls." so this feature here sounds a lot like another feat that a lot of bow users love. Crossbow Expert,"Being within 5 feet of a hostile creature doesn’t impose disadvantage on your ranged attack rolls." so why does this work? well answer Range attack rolls. so reading for face value this feat gives 2 things for crossbows and then 1 thing for all range attacks. so firearms being a ranged attack make them fall under this rule.
to sum up: by the time you reach level 5 overall, you could become an artifcer of level 2 which gives you magic and a plus one weapon from your infusion. then you have your fighter of level 3, and with a fighting style of archy you have + 2 to hit, action surge, and grit and trick shot. plus if you get a starting feat by whatever means you have a feat to maximize the build more. Another way to look at this is if you forgo reaching gunslinger early on and go 3 to 5 levels in artifcer and go down battle smith you can use your INT as your attack mod, and if you go 5 you get an extra attack. also a steel Defender as a friend. Pros to the build so a gun that is a plus 3 to hit. some okay spells. no need to have ammo. close range fighting. Spells. early magic items. Cons to the build loss of extra attack. ( base on path and level you take) weird stat spread of int,dex,wis. wordplay. misfire rule.
I've been looking through the mercer gunslinger subclass and it's cool ih everything it can do, essentially it being specialized battle master for guns with the caveat that your firearms can misfire and everything, but thanks to the gunner feat it's largely made kind of redundant in certain areas:
Rapid Repair
Upon reaching 10th level, you learn how to quickly attempt to fix a jammed gun. You can spend a grit point to attempt to repair a misfired (but not broken) firearm as a bonus action.
Lightning Reload
Starting at 15th level, you can reload any firearm as a bonus action.
That's two whole class features that are sort of being wasted with the gunner feat, which allows you to ignore the loading property, has no misfire chance, and let's you fire into melee ranged without having to deal with disadvantage.
My question here is how would one fix the gunslinger feat in light of the gunner feat?
The gunner feat doesn't interact with the gunslinger. The firearms used by gunslinger don't have the loading property and the gunner feat doesn't make any mention of misfire
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oh no i know that but with the gunner feat you may ignore loading which is one of the major downsides of using the slinger sub. You need to use one of your attacks/actions to do it thanks to the reloading property, whereas with the gunner feat you can just use a normal pistol and ignore the loading property.
Point being that the gunner feat on like a rogue or battle master or what have you is gonna blow the slinger out of the water in most instances
I really like gunslinger, but it is just homebrew. I am sure it there were ever a truly official printing of the subclass, it would be reworked quite a bit to bring it in line with firearms from the DMG and the Gunner Feat. Who knows, Mr Mercer may actually update it himself at some point.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
At this point it is just best to ignore the subclass unless Matt somehow updates it in light of new feat. Right now it is best to be any other class + gunner feat for a gunslinger or even just battlemaster+ gunner feat
so this issue of Gunner not working for Gun slinger just came up in a game for me and there is a workaround for it I found. also to quote Davyd "the firearms used by gunslinger don't have the loading.....". Both DMG and gunslinger do have a form of loading, the only difference is how it is worded. gunslinger is "reload" and DMG is loading. so really minus the prefix or suffix of the word. they are the same; however, where they differ is the ammo count each gun could hold and misfire, but misfire alone is its own feature and does not affect the feat of the Gunner in any way. this is because misfires make you take action or attack to remove the issue of the misfire. so the only thing the gunner really does is take away the action of reloading.
so if the DM doesn't allow gunner with gunslinger here is a workaround, but due note these are ideas that your DM can say no to.
loading feature: so the quickest way to say I don't need ammo is to take artificer level 2 and take the infusion repeating shot. this will allow you to not worry about the reloading feature in gunslinger, it also gives you a plus one item . however, it does not deal with the misfire rule in gunslinger if your DM makes you use those guns.
close range: so gunner also gives another really good thing, "Being within 5 feet of a hostile creature doesn’t impose disadvantage on your ranged attack rolls." so this feature here sounds a lot like another feat that a lot of bow users love. Crossbow Expert,"Being within 5 feet of a hostile creature doesn’t impose disadvantage on your ranged attack rolls." so why does this work? well answer Range attack rolls. so reading for face value this feat gives 2 things for crossbows and then 1 thing for all range attacks. so firearms being a ranged attack make them fall under this rule.
to sum up: by the time you reach level 5 overall, you could become an artifcer of level 2 which gives you magic and a plus one weapon from your infusion. then you have your fighter of level 3, and with a fighting style of archy you have + 2 to hit, action surge, and grit and trick shot. plus if you get a starting feat by whatever means you have a feat to maximize the build more. Another way to look at this is if you forgo reaching gunslinger early on and go 3 to 5 levels in artifcer and go down battle smith you can use your INT as your attack mod, and if you go 5 you get an extra attack. also a steel Defender as a friend.
Pros to the build
so a gun that is a plus 3 to hit.
some okay spells.
no need to have ammo.
close range fighting.
Spells.
early magic items.
Cons to the build
loss of extra attack. ( base on path and level you take)
weird stat spread of int,dex,wis.
wordplay.
misfire rule.