I'm currently running Hoard of the Dragon Queen for a group of 5 players. The characters have all just hit Level 3 and one of the players, a human ranger, has messaged me an idea of theirs that I just wanted gather some opinions on. Rather than try and describe it and get this wrong, here's the message...
".....so I've chosen Beast Master as my Ranger archetype...and I've chosen a panther as my companion...I was thinking of doing a bit of customising if possible...Im also a warlock initiate so could I maybe link this beast to some sort of Demon? Like...after my family were killed and I escaped I made some sort of pact with a demon or my pain/anguish brought this beast forward to help me? Which means I also have a telepathic link to it? Maybe as long as its within a mile it can hear me but a shorter range for me to hear it respond? I know its a bit of a buff but I thought it would be a cool feature and something to potentially work in to the story later? Also, gives me an excuse/reason to bring her in...i told her to stay away as people tend to freak seeing her...so I've mentally been in touch throughout the campaign but now I know the group better I feel better introducing them to her? 😁 tell me to do one if I'm stretching the rules here 🤣🤣🤘"
What do you all think? Any possible changes or is this a straight yes/no?
I mean it's pretty up to you and the style of campaign you're running. to me, it certainly is a bit of a buff but I don't think its necessarily anything game breaking, and you as a DM could figure out what the limitations on it were.
Another possible easy answer would be that as his bond with this demon grows is when they would develop true telepathic connections but for now maybe they can only transmit emotions or some such. Have it be maybe at level 5 or something have it become more of e telepathic link of communication. But honestly it sounds like most of what your player is asking for is flavor and you should be able to pretty easily balance if needed.
Honestly it would also be a good way to balance out of they didn't;t have any good players with stealth. How I would handle it is letting my player know that they can have that be their panther but if they're going to use it for scouting they'll have to do rolls and checks, and that would put it in danger if it got caught out on its own. Panther isnt going to have the same stats as the players so at a certain point the risk/reward might eliminate a lot of your problem anyway.
I'm not sure what "Im also a warlock initiate" means in this context. Are they a multiclassed ranger/fiend warlock?
Anyway, if the beast is a gift from a warlock patron, perhaps one that is trying to recruit the character, then perhaps it would be better to treat the panther more as a familiar than as a beast companion. If it is killed perhaps it returns at the following midnight. It is a fiend spirit in the form of a panther. You could then use the rules for familiars, allowing communication within 100'. If the character actually takes three levels in fiend pact warlock then they could take Chain pact and the panther would become their familiar.
As far as 5e goes, the beast master ranger is a bit weak anyway so I don't see much in the way of balance issues if the creature is treated as either a ranger animal companion or a familiar or some combination.
I'm not sure what "Im also a warlock initiate" means in this context. Are they a multiclassed ranger/fiend warlock?
Anyway, if the beast is a gift from a warlock patron, perhaps one that is trying to recruit the character, then perhaps it would be better to treat the panther more as a familiar than as a beast companion. If it is killed perhaps it returns at the following midnight. It is a fiend spirit in the form of a panther. You could then use the rules for familiars, allowing communication within 100'. If the character actually takes three levels in fiend pact warlock then they could take Chain pact and the panther would become their familiar.
As far as 5e goes, the beast master ranger is a bit weak anyway so I don't see much in the way of balance issues if the creature is treated as either a ranger animal companion or a familiar or some combination.
Sounds like a Variant Human with Magic Initiate(Warlock) feat. Then he took Find Familiar.
In my own campaign, although our Beastmaster Ranger does not have a demon pet, she has the ability to whistle for her pet and it will come to her from just about anywhere, arriving at the time she whistles because it heard the whistle in the past and set out at such time and in such a way as to arrive when it was needed. (I got this idea from the Ranyhyn horses and the Bloodguard they serve in the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant.) This is similar and it has not caused any issues. For RP purposes it makes sense that you would not bring a panther into town and if you did people would freak out. But when it is time to go you need to get it back out of the nearby woods to your side... so a telepathic summons or a "magical whistle" does the trick.
I would probably rule the communication only goes one way. The animal, being a beast and not sentient as we understand the term, would not be able to transmit coherent enough thoughts that it could do telepathic conversations. At best it might be able to communicate very rudimentary ideas, like "Hungry," or "happy."
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Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
So if they are variant human warlock initiate you could just swap in some of the pact of the chain flavour stuff
Pact of the Chain
You learn the find familiar spell and can cast it as a ritual. The spell doesn’t count against your number of spells known.
When you cast the spell, you can choose one of the normal forms for your familiar or one of the following special forms: imp, pseudodragon, quasit, or sprite.
Additionally, when you take the Attack action, you can forgo one of your own attacks to allow your familiar to make one attack with its reaction.
Quasit and Imp both have the shape change ability which while they wouldn’t usually have panther as an option you could house rule it.
As others have said, it is a slight buff to a very poor subclass. Beastmaster is one of the most badly designed and under powered class in the entire game. I would allow it. I would reduce the range though to maybe 200 - 300 feet. It is still greater than the standard familiar but 1 mile is a bit too far.
Hi All,
I'm currently running Hoard of the Dragon Queen for a group of 5 players. The characters have all just hit Level 3 and one of the players, a human ranger, has messaged me an idea of theirs that I just wanted gather some opinions on. Rather than try and describe it and get this wrong, here's the message...
".....so I've chosen Beast Master as my Ranger archetype...and I've chosen a panther as my companion...I was thinking of doing a bit of customising if possible...Im also a warlock initiate so could I maybe link this beast to some sort of Demon? Like...after my family were killed and I escaped I made some sort of pact with a demon or my pain/anguish brought this beast forward to help me? Which means I also have a telepathic link to it? Maybe as long as its within a mile it can hear me but a shorter range for me to hear it respond? I know its a bit of a buff but I thought it would be a cool feature and something to potentially work in to the story later? Also, gives me an excuse/reason to bring her in...i told her to stay away as people tend to freak seeing her...so I've mentally been in touch throughout the campaign but now I know the group better I feel better introducing them to her? 😁 tell me to do one if I'm stretching the rules here 🤣🤣🤘"
What do you all think? Any possible changes or is this a straight yes/no?
I mean it's pretty up to you and the style of campaign you're running. to me, it certainly is a bit of a buff but I don't think its necessarily anything game breaking, and you as a DM could figure out what the limitations on it were.
Another possible easy answer would be that as his bond with this demon grows is when they would develop true telepathic connections but for now maybe they can only transmit emotions or some such. Have it be maybe at level 5 or something have it become more of e telepathic link of communication. But honestly it sounds like most of what your player is asking for is flavor and you should be able to pretty easily balance if needed.
Honestly it would also be a good way to balance out of they didn't;t have any good players with stealth. How I would handle it is letting my player know that they can have that be their panther but if they're going to use it for scouting they'll have to do rolls and checks, and that would put it in danger if it got caught out on its own. Panther isnt going to have the same stats as the players so at a certain point the risk/reward might eliminate a lot of your problem anyway.
Just my thoughts
I'm not sure what "Im also a warlock initiate" means in this context. Are they a multiclassed ranger/fiend warlock?
Anyway, if the beast is a gift from a warlock patron, perhaps one that is trying to recruit the character, then perhaps it would be better to treat the panther more as a familiar than as a beast companion. If it is killed perhaps it returns at the following midnight. It is a fiend spirit in the form of a panther. You could then use the rules for familiars, allowing communication within 100'. If the character actually takes three levels in fiend pact warlock then they could take Chain pact and the panther would become their familiar.
As far as 5e goes, the beast master ranger is a bit weak anyway so I don't see much in the way of balance issues if the creature is treated as either a ranger animal companion or a familiar or some combination.
Sounds like a Variant Human with Magic Initiate(Warlock) feat. Then he took Find Familiar.
It doesn't look OP to me.
In my own campaign, although our Beastmaster Ranger does not have a demon pet, she has the ability to whistle for her pet and it will come to her from just about anywhere, arriving at the time she whistles because it heard the whistle in the past and set out at such time and in such a way as to arrive when it was needed. (I got this idea from the Ranyhyn horses and the Bloodguard they serve in the Chronicles of Thomas Covenant.) This is similar and it has not caused any issues. For RP purposes it makes sense that you would not bring a panther into town and if you did people would freak out. But when it is time to go you need to get it back out of the nearby woods to your side... so a telepathic summons or a "magical whistle" does the trick.
I would probably rule the communication only goes one way. The animal, being a beast and not sentient as we understand the term, would not be able to transmit coherent enough thoughts that it could do telepathic conversations. At best it might be able to communicate very rudimentary ideas, like "Hungry," or "happy."
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
Thank you for the feedback all. Much appreciated.
So if they are variant human warlock initiate you could just swap in some of the pact of the chain flavour stuff
Pact of the Chain
You learn the find familiar spell and can cast it as a ritual. The spell doesn’t count against your number of spells known.
When you cast the spell, you can choose one of the normal forms for your familiar or one of the following special forms: imp, pseudodragon, quasit, or sprite.
Additionally, when you take the Attack action, you can forgo one of your own attacks to allow your familiar to make one attack with its reaction.
Quasit and Imp both have the shape change ability which while they wouldn’t usually have panther as an option you could house rule it.
It seems fun to me. Just be sure to let other characters make similar changes if they find as good a reason story-wise or mechanically.
Don't pick too strong of a fiend. If that happens then, Hoo Boy.
As others have said, it is a slight buff to a very poor subclass. Beastmaster is one of the most badly designed and under powered class in the entire game. I would allow it. I would reduce the range though to maybe 200 - 300 feet. It is still greater than the standard familiar but 1 mile is a bit too far.