The dual wielder feat doesn't matter at all. When you engage in two-weapon fighting, the additional attack uses your bonus action, which you only get one of per turn. Two-weapon fighting only ever allows you a single additional attack.
This is an understandable confusion between the capital-A "Attack action" and a lowercase-a "attack". Extra Attack affects only the capital-A "Attack" action, allowing you to lowercase-a "attack" twice, instead of once, when you take that action. Two-weapon fighting is not part of a capital-A "Attack" action, it is only an extra lowercase-a "attack" as a distinct bonus action on the same turn. Therefore, two-weapon fighting and Extra Attack don't interact; you only get 3 lowercase-a "attacks" when you use both. Extra Attack also doesn't let you attack twice when you make an attack of opportunity or other reaction that allows an attack.
It is not intuitive. I believe they are fixing it with the rules updates coming later this year.
It's not intuitive, but it's not hard to parse from reading the relevant rules either. Honestly, I'd be surprised if they seriously change the wording or how baseline TWF works. The biggest change is just the weapon mastery to roll the attack into your Action, which still doesn't change the number of attacks made.
When a paladin gets an extra attack at level 5, does he get four attacks or three if he has the Dual wielder feat?
At Level 5, the Paladin's Extra Attack ability says they can attack twice when they take the attack action. It means exactly that. The rules for two-weapon fighting allow for an additional attack with your Bonus Action IF certain conditions are met. The Two-Weapon Fighting fighting style(which is not normally available to Paladins except though multiclassing or a feat) modifies the damage roll of that Bonus Action attack. The Dual Wielder feat changes the conditions which allow you to make that additional attack(you no longer need to be wielding Light weapons). No matter how many attacks you make with the Attack action, you only get one Bonus Action per turn.
These responses are far too descriptive for such a simple question. The answer is no you get 3. Two attacks with your action and the dual wielder attack with your bonus action if you choose to use your BA for that.
These responses are far too descriptive for such a simple question. The answer is no you get 3. Two attacks with your action and the dual wielder attack with your bonus action if you choose to use your BA for that.
Has this changed at all in 2024 with the nick property?
These responses are far too descriptive for such a simple question. The answer is no you get 3. Two attacks with your action and the dual wielder attack with your bonus action if you choose to use your BA for that.
Has this changed at all in 2024 with the nick property?
If you have both Nick and Dual Wielder on a character with Extra Attack (assuming 1 extra attack, rather than multiple from higher Fighter levels):
-Attack 1 -Attack 2 -Off-Hand Attack (3, moved to the Attack action by Nick) -BA: Attack 4 (Dual Wielder attack)
Note that, with Nick but without Dual Wielder, you can't use the Nick property to attack within the attack action with the off-hand weapon AND do a BA attack from the Light property; you need the Dual Wielder feat (or something else that grants a BA attack, like the War Cleric's ability) in order to get the fourth attack.
Yes, I also came to this conclusion, though it seems unintentional, likely overlooked when they added mastery properties.
Looks completely intentional to me. It's the only reason for the Dual Wielder feat to exist. Otherwise the Light property makes the feat irrelevant, because the feat wouldn't do anything.
As far as the text goes, the Dual Wielder feat gives you a BA attack that has no connection to the Light property BA attack. Obviously, you can only take one bonus action. But that's where the Nick mastery comes in - it moves the Light BA attack to part of the regular attack, and you still have the BA attack from Dual Wielder to use your BA with, so you get both of them.
I do not know if it was intended (I would not put it past the devs to have just whoopsed it), but it's a really bad feat if it doesn't stack with nick mastery.
When a paladin gets an extra attack at level 5, does he get four attacks or three if he has the Dual wielder feat?
The dual wielder feat doesn't matter at all. When you engage in two-weapon fighting, the additional attack uses your bonus action, which you only get one of per turn. Two-weapon fighting only ever allows you a single additional attack.
This is an understandable confusion between the capital-A "Attack action" and a lowercase-a "attack". Extra Attack affects only the capital-A "Attack" action, allowing you to lowercase-a "attack" twice, instead of once, when you take that action. Two-weapon fighting is not part of a capital-A "Attack" action, it is only an extra lowercase-a "attack" as a distinct bonus action on the same turn. Therefore, two-weapon fighting and Extra Attack don't interact; you only get 3 lowercase-a "attacks" when you use both. Extra Attack also doesn't let you attack twice when you make an attack of opportunity or other reaction that allows an attack.
It is not intuitive. I believe they are fixing it with the rules updates coming later this year.
It's not intuitive, but it's not hard to parse from reading the relevant rules either. Honestly, I'd be surprised if they seriously change the wording or how baseline TWF works. The biggest change is just the weapon mastery to roll the attack into your Action, which still doesn't change the number of attacks made.
Hi guys,
Just asking: where do I find the "Dual Wielder" feat?
I was searching through and it does not appear anywhere in the character creation, there is only Two-weapon fighting.
Where am I wrong?
It’s a feat, not a fighting style; you can take it in place of an ASI, or at 1st level as a variant human.
At Level 5, the Paladin's Extra Attack ability says they can attack twice when they take the attack action. It means exactly that. The rules for two-weapon fighting allow for an additional attack with your Bonus Action IF certain conditions are met. The Two-Weapon Fighting fighting style(which is not normally available to Paladins except though multiclassing or a feat) modifies the damage roll of that Bonus Action attack. The Dual Wielder feat changes the conditions which allow you to make that additional attack(you no longer need to be wielding Light weapons). No matter how many attacks you make with the Attack action, you only get one Bonus Action per turn.
These responses are far too descriptive for such a simple question. The answer is no you get 3. Two attacks with your action and the dual wielder attack with your bonus action if you choose to use your BA for that.
Has this changed at all in 2024 with the nick property?
If you have both Nick and Dual Wielder on a character with Extra Attack (assuming 1 extra attack, rather than multiple from higher Fighter levels):
-Attack 1
-Attack 2
-Off-Hand Attack (3, moved to the Attack action by Nick)
-BA: Attack 4 (Dual Wielder attack)
Note that, with Nick but without Dual Wielder, you can't use the Nick property to attack within the attack action with the off-hand weapon AND do a BA attack from the Light property; you need the Dual Wielder feat (or something else that grants a BA attack, like the War Cleric's ability) in order to get the fourth attack.
Yes, I also came to this conclusion, though it seems unintentional, likely overlooked when they added mastery properties.
Looks completely intentional to me. It's the only reason for the Dual Wielder feat to exist. Otherwise the Light property makes the feat irrelevant, because the feat wouldn't do anything.
As far as the text goes, the Dual Wielder feat gives you a BA attack that has no connection to the Light property BA attack. Obviously, you can only take one bonus action. But that's where the Nick mastery comes in - it moves the Light BA attack to part of the regular attack, and you still have the BA attack from Dual Wielder to use your BA with, so you get both of them.
I do not know if it was intended (I would not put it past the devs to have just whoopsed it), but it's a really bad feat if it doesn't stack with nick mastery.
Devs actually described it as working this way when advertising right before the launch of the PHB. Totally intended.