The world tree barbarian is definitely weak, but it's significantly different from the other subclasses so I gave it a thumbs up. I might try it as a curiousity at some point.
Cavalier is possible, just don't expect much changes. other classes they imported without playtest, it literally says use the version found in another book, not even a line of errata.
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
I could see some kind of subclass, that uses thrown weapons. Let's call it skirmisher. A subclass that specializes in distracting enemies to make them deal less damage but it needs to stay relatively close to the enemies to use its feats. Guildwars 1 had the Paragon which was leaning in that direction ( although you had many bard like abilities)
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
It has other issues, but they're all fairly minor
Unwavering mark is a bit of tracking hassle, because of the need to remember who exactly has qualified for your special bonus attack. Making it a reaction would make that part less annoying but has the issue of consuming your ability to use an opportunity or sentinel attack.
Hold the Line is also a bit redundant with sentinel.
Ferocious Charger is fairly unimpressive for a level 15 feature, particularly now that you can have a weapon with topple anyway.
Cavalier is possible, just don't expect much changes. other classes they imported without playtest, it literally says use the version found in another book, not even a line of errata.
Who says they will not make some changes? It said use as is for the playtest. But just like the 9 classes that they say are finished with playtesting, we know, and they’ve said, they will still make changes and tweaks to them. They very well could tweak those classes being ported if they feel they are close but need some adjustments to keep in line with the new versions of subclasses.
Im not saying it’s definitely happening but just that it’s a possibility.
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
It has other issues, but they're all fairly minor
Unwavering mark is a bit of tracking hassle, because of the need to remember who exactly has qualified for your special bonus attack. Making it a reaction would make that part less annoying but has the issue of consuming your ability to use an opportunity or sentinel attack.
Hold the Line is also a bit redundant with sentinel.
Ferocious Charger is fairly unimpressive for a level 15 feature, particularly now that you can have a weapon with topple anyway.
True, but doesn’t sentinel not go off opportunity attacks anymore? I really like the reaction idea, though. That’s really good. Ferocious Charger could use some work, but as is at least you get the benifit of it working with any weapon kind of like giving you two masteries if you don’t have one with topple.
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
It has other issues, but they're all fairly minor
Unwavering mark is a bit of tracking hassle, because of the need to remember who exactly has qualified for your special bonus attack. Making it a reaction would make that part less annoying but has the issue of consuming your ability to use an opportunity or sentinel attack.
Hold the Line is also a bit redundant with sentinel.
Ferocious Charger is fairly unimpressive for a level 15 feature, particularly now that you can have a weapon with topple anyway.
True, but doesn’t sentinel not go off opportunity attacks anymore? I really like the reaction idea, though. That’s really good. Ferocious Charger could use some work, but as is at least you get the benifit of it working with any weapon kind of like giving you two masteries if you don’t have one with topple.
Sentinel still works with opportunity attacks. You might be thinking of Polearm Master, in which the attack triggered by an enemy entering your reach is now called a Reactive Strike (previously was an OA). Thus, PAM and Sentinel don’t interact as they used to.
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
It has other issues, but they're all fairly minor
Unwavering mark is a bit of tracking hassle, because of the need to remember who exactly has qualified for your special bonus attack. Making it a reaction would make that part less annoying but has the issue of consuming your ability to use an opportunity or sentinel attack.
Hold the Line is also a bit redundant with sentinel.
Ferocious Charger is fairly unimpressive for a level 15 feature, particularly now that you can have a weapon with topple anyway.
Having played a cavalier, I can tell you unwavering mark is no hassle. Hold the line actually synergizes really well with sentinel. At least it does with the current sentinel, not sure about a new sentinel. And if you really think it’s redundant, well, that frees up a feat for something else. I’ll give you ferocious charger is underwhelming. But you can have a weapon with topple, or you can have a weapon with anything else, and still topple people. And since fighters can swap their weapon properties, you get both. As I’m now realizing cergonian said.
Unrelated, If they do update cavalier, they won’t remove mounted stuff from it. It’s been mounted since 1e when it was its own class. The developers love the traditions.
I think a way to make it work as a reaction would be
If you make an attack as a reaction against a marked target, gain advantage on the attack and add half your fighter level to the damage.
That helps with being sticky (because it adds to opportunity attacks), makes sentinel better, and also allows for some interesting interactions with abilities such as commander's strike.
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
It has other issues, but they're all fairly minor
Unwavering mark is a bit of tracking hassle, because of the need to remember who exactly has qualified for your special bonus attack. Making it a reaction would make that part less annoying but has the issue of consuming your ability to use an opportunity or sentinel attack.
Hold the Line is also a bit redundant with sentinel.
Ferocious Charger is fairly unimpressive for a level 15 feature, particularly now that you can have a weapon with topple anyway.
True, but doesn’t sentinel not go off opportunity attacks anymore? I really like the reaction idea, though. That’s really good. Ferocious Charger could use some work, but as is at least you get the benifit of it working with any weapon kind of like giving you two masteries if you don’t have one with topple.
Sentinel still works with opportunity attacks. You might be thinking of Polearm Master, in which the attack triggered by an enemy entering your reach is now called a Reactive Strike (previously was an OA). Thus, PAM and Sentinel don’t interact as they used to.
Yup, that was exactly what I was thinking about. Thank you. I knew it was one of them.
yeah, the issue is, psi knight is apparently not a popular subclass.
According to who? I loved it, if it had any issue at all it was being overshadowed by Rune Knight in the same book. Sure it's MAD, but it's also on the class that gets two bonus ASIs.
Cavalier is possible, just don't expect much changes. other classes they imported without playtest, it literally says use the version found in another book, not even a line of errata.
All of those were Tasha subclasses though - Mercy Monk, Stars Druid, Aberrant/Clockwork Sorcerer, and Fey Wanderer Ranger - while Cavalier is from Xanathar's, so would likely be seen as needing work (especially since it does.)
yeah, the issue is, psi knight is apparently not a popular subclass.
According to who? I loved it, if it had any issue at all it was being overshadowed by Rune Knight in the same book. Sure it's MAD, but it's also on the class that gets two bonus ASIs.
Cavalier is possible, just don't expect much changes. other classes they imported without playtest, it literally says use the version found in another book, not even a line of errata.
All of those were Tasha subclasses though - Mercy Monk, Stars Druid, Aberrant/Clockwork Sorcerer, and Fey Wanderer Ranger - while Cavalier is from Xanathar's, so would likely be seen as needing work (especially since it does.)
I looked up the top fighter classes by popularity, I don't really have a dog in that race but the data I found suggested it.
the fact that they are from tashas doesnt inherently mean its better(in terms of needing changes), some are, some are not. But more to the point, they are looking for a subclass that needs almost no work, or feedback. The reason they dropped brawler is because they didnt think they could fix it in one playtest. And since they are, according to them, done with fighter in playtests, any subclass they choose needs to meet the bar of needing zero playtests.
to be clear, I'm not saying psi warrior is bad, but, they may choose a more popular option if it also needs no real changes.
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
Regardless of that, it should be reasonable to directly compare subclasses released at the same time and in the same way. This tells us
XGTE: Samurai > Arcane Archer > Cavalier (42% - 38% - 20%). I think it's reasonably clear that there's an issue with the cavalier.
TCOE: Rune Knight > Psi Warrior (at least 72% for rune knight -- psi warrior isn't on there so it's less than 1.1%). Again, psi warrior clearly has issues.
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
Regardless of that, it should be reasonable to directly compare subclasses released at the same time and in the same way. This tells us
XGTE: Samurai > Arcane Archer > Cavalier (42% - 38% - 20%). I think it's reasonably clear that there's an issue with the cavalier.
TCOE: Rune Knight > Psi Warrior (at least 72% for rune knight -- psi warrior isn't on there so it's less than 1.1%). Again, psi warrior clearly has issues.
I outright stated that Rune Knight overshadowed Psi Warrior. That doesn't mean Psi Warrior "has issues" so much as Rune Knight being more exciting. As the only way for a Fighter to reach Huge size natively on top of all the other things it does, that's understandable.
I outright stated that Rune Knight overshadowed Psi Warrior. That doesn't mean Psi Warrior "has issues" so much as Rune Knight being more exciting. As the only way for a Fighter to reach Huge size natively on top of all the other things it does, that's understandable.
"Doesn't excite people" means the subclass has issues.
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
Regardless of that, it should be reasonable to directly compare subclasses released at the same time and in the same way. This tells us
XGTE: Samurai > Arcane Archer > Cavalier (42% - 38% - 20%). I think it's reasonably clear that there's an issue with the cavalier.
TCOE: Rune Knight > Psi Warrior (at least 72% for rune knight -- psi warrior isn't on there so it's less than 1.1%). Again, psi warrior clearly has issues.
I outright stated that Rune Knight overshadowed Psi Warrior. That doesn't mean Psi Warrior "has issues" so much as Rune Knight being more exciting. As the only way for a Fighter to reach Huge size natively on top of all the other things it does, that's understandable.
Psi Warrior suffered from its playtest being more unique than what got released. Psionic dice were suppose to scale up and down depending on how you rolled. It got voted down and the resource become a worse version of combat maneuvers. Also being MAD doesn’t help the subclass. Rune Knight seems the best choice for the 4th fighter if their goal is to have to do the least work. Samurai also works, but I would expect a name change.
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
Regardless of that, it should be reasonable to directly compare subclasses released at the same time and in the same way. This tells us
XGTE: Samurai > Arcane Archer > Cavalier (42% - 38% - 20%). I think it's reasonably clear that there's an issue with the cavalier.
TCOE: Rune Knight > Psi Warrior (at least 72% for rune knight -- psi warrior isn't on there so it's less than 1.1%). Again, psi warrior clearly has issues.
I outright stated that Rune Knight overshadowed Psi Warrior. That doesn't mean Psi Warrior "has issues" so much as Rune Knight being more exciting. As the only way for a Fighter to reach Huge size natively on top of all the other things it does, that's understandable.
Psi Warrior suffered from its playtest being more unique than what got released. Psionic dice were suppose to scale up and down depending on how you rolled. It got voted down and the resource become a worse version of combat maneuvers. Also being MAD doesn’t help the subclass. Rune Knight seems the best choice for the 4th fighter if their goal is to have to do the least work. Samurai also works, but I would expect a name change.
ahhh that change didnt make it, that kinda sucks. That seemed a lot more entertaining to me. My desire to give psi warrior a shot is fairly low now. (i guess i read the UA one when people were talking about it, and thought it might be worth a swing)
also, the literal best part about samurai is that its associated with being a samurai. i highly doubt many people would care about it based on mechanics.Especially in one dnd, which has way more access to advantage.
If they changed Samurai's name, i think it would have no popularity
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
Regardless of that, it should be reasonable to directly compare subclasses released at the same time and in the same way. This tells us
XGTE: Samurai > Arcane Archer > Cavalier (42% - 38% - 20%). I think it's reasonably clear that there's an issue with the cavalier.
TCOE: Rune Knight > Psi Warrior (at least 72% for rune knight -- psi warrior isn't on there so it's less than 1.1%). Again, psi warrior clearly has issues.
The issue with Cavalier is perception. There are two problems. First, is people have the opinion that it's mounted based, and most games have little call for mounted combat. That opinion is mostly wrong. The rest of the kit is really solid even if your world has no horses. The mounted features are mostly ribbons.
The second issue with Cavalier is that it's Sentinel: The class. This is more reasonable, however it looks past the fact that you can spend that feat on something else, AND it's got a bit more going for it than 'just' the sentinel features. Is it as good as a battlemaster who takes sentinel? Probably not, but BM is hands down the most robust fighter type. With weapon masteries coming online and some of the other features, I think that Cavalier will be a really good subclass. It just needs to shed the bad perceptions that people have for it.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
I outright stated that Rune Knight overshadowed Psi Warrior. That doesn't mean Psi Warrior "has issues" so much as Rune Knight being more exciting. As the only way for a Fighter to reach Huge size natively on top of all the other things it does, that's understandable.
"Doesn't excite people" means the subclass has issues.
The lack of a "wow factor" does not mean the class is mechanically weak. The last chart I saw which tracked classes and subclasses, the Champion made up 40% of fighters on this website.
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The world tree barbarian is definitely weak, but it's significantly different from the other subclasses so I gave it a thumbs up. I might try it as a curiousity at some point.
Well, at least, it’s not bad. Just the born to saddle part but that’s not horrible either. It’s better than Arcane Archer as it stands. I was just hoping that with Brawler being out they would replace it with something in the next play test even if it’s just one or two time’s especially with us all eagerly awaiting the monk’s second coming.
I could see some kind of subclass, that uses thrown weapons. Let's call it skirmisher. A subclass that specializes in distracting enemies to make them deal less damage but it needs to stay relatively close to the enemies to use its feats. Guildwars 1 had the Paragon which was leaning in that direction ( although you had many bard like abilities)
It has other issues, but they're all fairly minor
Who says they will not make some changes? It said use as is for the playtest. But just like the 9 classes that they say are finished with playtesting, we know, and they’ve said, they will still make changes and tweaks to them. They very well could tweak those classes being ported if they feel they are close but need some adjustments to keep in line with the new versions of subclasses.
Im not saying it’s definitely happening but just that it’s a possibility.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
True, but doesn’t sentinel not go off opportunity attacks anymore?
I really like the reaction idea, though. That’s really good.
Ferocious Charger could use some work, but as is at least you get the benifit of it working with any weapon kind of like giving you two masteries if you don’t have one with topple.
Sentinel still works with opportunity attacks. You might be thinking of Polearm Master, in which the attack triggered by an enemy entering your reach is now called a Reactive Strike (previously was an OA). Thus, PAM and Sentinel don’t interact as they used to.
Having played a cavalier, I can tell you unwavering mark is no hassle.
Hold the line actually synergizes really well with sentinel. At least it does with the current sentinel, not sure about a new sentinel. And if you really think it’s redundant, well, that frees up a feat for something else.
I’ll give you ferocious charger is underwhelming. But you can have a weapon with topple, or you can have a weapon with anything else, and still topple people. And since fighters can swap their weapon properties, you get both. As I’m now realizing cergonian said.
Unrelated, If they do update cavalier, they won’t remove mounted stuff from it. It’s been mounted since 1e when it was its own class. The developers love the traditions.
I think a way to make it work as a reaction would be
That helps with being sticky (because it adds to opportunity attacks), makes sentinel better, and also allows for some interesting interactions with abilities such as commander's strike.
Yup, that was exactly what I was thinking about. Thank you. I knew it was one of them.
According to who? I loved it, if it had any issue at all it was being overshadowed by Rune Knight in the same book. Sure it's MAD, but it's also on the class that gets two bonus ASIs.
All of those were Tasha subclasses though - Mercy Monk, Stars Druid, Aberrant/Clockwork Sorcerer, and Fey Wanderer Ranger - while Cavalier is from Xanathar's, so would likely be seen as needing work (especially since it does.)
I looked up the top fighter classes by popularity, I don't really have a dog in that race but the data I found suggested it.
https://www.thegamer.com/dungeons-dragons-best-fighter-subclasses-ranked-popularity-dnd-gunslinger-arcane-archer-cavalier/
the fact that they are from tashas doesnt inherently mean its better(in terms of needing changes), some are, some are not. But more to the point, they are looking for a subclass that needs almost no work, or feedback. The reason they dropped brawler is because they didnt think they could fix it in one playtest. And since they are, according to them, done with fighter in playtests, any subclass they choose needs to meet the bar of needing zero playtests.
to be clear, I'm not saying psi warrior is bad, but, they may choose a more popular option if it also needs no real changes.
The data that list is based on is from the same year Tasha's itself released. Rune Knight and Psi Warrior were brand new back then and less widely available than the others.
Regardless of that, it should be reasonable to directly compare subclasses released at the same time and in the same way. This tells us
I outright stated that Rune Knight overshadowed Psi Warrior. That doesn't mean Psi Warrior "has issues" so much as Rune Knight being more exciting. As the only way for a Fighter to reach Huge size natively on top of all the other things it does, that's understandable.
"Doesn't excite people" means the subclass has issues.
Psi Warrior suffered from its playtest being more unique than what got released. Psionic dice were suppose to scale up and down depending on how you rolled. It got voted down and the resource become a worse version of combat maneuvers. Also being MAD doesn’t help the subclass.
Rune Knight seems the best choice for the 4th fighter if their goal is to have to do the least work. Samurai also works, but I would expect a name change.
ahhh that change didnt make it, that kinda sucks. That seemed a lot more entertaining to me. My desire to give psi warrior a shot is fairly low now. (i guess i read the UA one when people were talking about it, and thought it might be worth a swing)
also, the literal best part about samurai is that its associated with being a samurai. i highly doubt many people would care about it based on mechanics.Especially in one dnd, which has way more access to advantage.
If they changed Samurai's name, i think it would have no popularity
The issue with Cavalier is perception. There are two problems. First, is people have the opinion that it's mounted based, and most games have little call for mounted combat. That opinion is mostly wrong. The rest of the kit is really solid even if your world has no horses. The mounted features are mostly ribbons.
The second issue with Cavalier is that it's Sentinel: The class. This is more reasonable, however it looks past the fact that you can spend that feat on something else, AND it's got a bit more going for it than 'just' the sentinel features. Is it as good as a battlemaster who takes sentinel? Probably not, but BM is hands down the most robust fighter type. With weapon masteries coming online and some of the other features, I think that Cavalier will be a really good subclass. It just needs to shed the bad perceptions that people have for it.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
The lack of a "wow factor" does not mean the class is mechanically weak. The last chart I saw which tracked classes and subclasses, the Champion made up 40% of fighters on this website.