I've been playing as an eldritch knight and it's been a lot of fun. With the release of one DND around the corner, I was wondering how you guys felt about the changes. I especially like how I don't have to be limited to evocation and adjuration spells and I bet there are some really fun spells and possibilities previously locked to an EK just waiting to be discovered.
I like eliminating the limitation on spell school. Several of my tables HB it that way anyway and it's really fun. I don't like the "replace one attack with a cantrip", ability. WtoC really need to get a handle on how to combine cantrips and attacks because the scaling of cantrips just makes it totally OP at higher levels as it works right now.
Do you think any of the changes will change how you build an EK? I know the Usual is to have good strength and constitution (of course) and only 14, maybe 16 int. With new spells being unlocked, do you see intelligence becoming more important as many other good spells require intelligence as the spell casting ability score?- Seeing as we are pulling out these spells from the wizards spell list.
I technically did not notice any such limitations when I made my Battle Smith 3/Eldritch Knight 17 Custom Lineage build. Maybe i’m just suppose to know which spells I can and can’t use?
Do you think any of the changes will change how you build an EK? I know the Usual is to have good strength and constitution (of course) and only 14, maybe 16 int. With new spells being unlocked, do you see intelligence becoming more important as many other good spells require intelligence as the spell casting ability score?- Seeing as we are pulling out these spells from the wizards spell list.
there could be int builds, especially with the new true strike, I did see one, I believe, with an int based staff shillelagh.
Do you think any of the changes will change how you build an EK? I know the Usual is to have good strength and constitution (of course) and only 14, maybe 16 int. With new spells being unlocked, do you see intelligence becoming more important as many other good spells require intelligence as the spell casting ability score?- Seeing as we are pulling out these spells from the wizards spell list.
there could be int builds, especially with the new true strike, I did see one, I believe, with an int based staff shillelagh.
Oh, cool!do you know where the build is so I can look at it?
I technically did not notice any such limitations when I made my Battle Smith 3/Eldritch Knight 17 Custom Lineage build. Maybe i’m just suppose to know which spells I can and can’t use?
In the current PB the only spells you can take are from evocation and abjuration, with like one exception I think. But Since you took those three levels in battle smith (which sounds like a really cool build by the way) I assume you took some artificer spells not limited to the two schools.
Do you think any of the changes will change how you build an EK? I know the Usual is to have good strength and constitution (of course) and only 14, maybe 16 int. With new spells being unlocked, do you see intelligence becoming more important as many other good spells require intelligence as the spell casting ability score?- Seeing as we are pulling out these spells from the wizards spell list.
I could definitely see going at least 16 in INT now, but the changes only modestly affect how I would play one in combat. In terms of combat the unlock would make me consider picking up: Levitate, Fly, Misty Step, Bigby's Hand, Haste, Web, Flaming Sphere, Telekinesis, Hold Person.
But mostly it opens up some interesting support/ooc builds, like an assassin-type fighter with Invisibility and Disguise Self, or an interrogator-type fighter with Detect Thoughts, and Fear, or a strongman-type fighter with Enlarge/Reduce and Jump, or a swashbuckler-type fighter with Charm Person, and Fortune's Favour, or a Jedi-type fighter with Catapult and Suggestion..
Personally I thought the school limits on the classes were good both for flavor and to keep some focus rather than letting an EK grab a bunch of utility stuff like Charm Person, Detect Magic/Thoughts, Invisibility, etc. They got one wildcard at 3rd with the subclass, and another at 8th, 14th, and 20th, so you could still have some flexibility on the build, but you couldn't just use it to get a full magic bag of tricks. I can live with the change, but I honestly don't think it was super necessary either.
sorry for the late reply, but for me personally, I think the school limitations are a bit restrictive. While I definitely see me taking mostly evocation and adjuration spells (as I am a fighter) I strongly believe that among the restriction will allow for more flavor and depth to the eldritch knight. It's kinda like opt-in complexity in a way. Sure, you could keep it simple by sticking to evocation and adjuration, or you could come up with something funkier like some of the examples Agilemind came up with. I hope that the changes will get more people to try out the eldritch knight. Sure, the blade singer may have more spells, and the hexblade is just really damn good, BUT as a standalone fighter subclass, I think the Eldritch Knight is pretty swell.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Personally I thought the school limits on the classes were good both for flavor and to keep some focus.
The school limit on EK, in the 2014 rules, amount to "you get abjuration and something that's completely useless to you"; evocation is literally the worst possible choice (even necromancy is better). In the 2024 rules evocation becomes a viable choice at level 18+ because of improved war magic.
Personally I thought the school limits on the classes were good both for flavor and to keep some focus.
The school limit on EK, in the 2014 rules, amount to "you get abjuration and something that's completely useless to you"; evocation is literally the worst possible choice (even necromancy is better). In the 2024 rules evocation becomes a viable choice at level 18+ because of improved war magic.
Even if it's not optimum, what's the point of playing a magic knight if you're not attacking with magic?
Even if it's not optimum, what's the point of playing a magic knight if you're not attacking with magic?
You have just described why the 2014 EK is terrible; it's not just 'not optimum', it's a trap option. The 2024 version will at least be using cantrips regularly at level 7+.
Personally I thought the school limits on the classes were good both for flavor and to keep some focus.
The school limit on EK, in the 2014 rules, amount to "you get abjuration and something that's completely useless to you"; evocation is literally the worst possible choice (even necromancy is better). In the 2024 rules evocation becomes a viable choice at level 18+ because of improved war magic.
Even if it's not optimum, what's the point of playing a magic knight if you're not attacking with magic?
Because you're a knight not a wizard. Why would a magic knight be casting a spell every single turn? If you're casting a spell every turn you are just a wizard that wears armour.
100% what Agilemind is saying there. I struggled with EK at first because mentally, it was a fighter/mage hybrid. When you look at it as a fighter who can enhance his skills with magic, it opens an awful lot of options and starts to look much better.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
100% what Agilemind is saying there. I struggled with EK at first because mentally, it was a fighter/mage hybrid. When you look at it as a fighter who can enhance his skills with magic, it opens an awful lot of options and starts to look much better.
That's true! An eldritch knight is a fighter first and foremost. But also something that I'd like to mention that doesn't seem to be brought up... Well, anywhere is that as an eldritch knight your not just another super strong soldier or some nimble archer... You're smart! Fighter may not be the best choice for role playing when out of combat, but that extra intelligence allows you to do, learn, and say things that your average -1 intelligence fighter wouldn't! Just like I said before, Opt in complexity. (I think eldritch knight is becoming my favorite subclass!)
Opening up the options for Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster are some of my favorite changes proposed for the 2024 PHB.
I read about that too. While I don't play a lot of rouge, I think I will try an Arcane trickster build once one DND comes out. I mean, how hilarious would it be if some tiny little rouge randomly cast a fireball from her hands completely catching the enemy off guard? It would be awesome; that's what!
That's true! An eldritch knight is a fighter first and foremost. But also something that I'd like to mention that doesn't seem to be brought up... Well, anywhere is that as an eldritch knight your not just another super strong soldier or some nimble archer... You're smart!
^^ There are a lot of spells that don't require attack rolls, and those spells work perfectly well on a character with low caster score.
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Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
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I've been playing as an eldritch knight and it's been a lot of fun. With the release of one DND around the corner, I was wondering how you guys felt about the changes. I especially like how I don't have to be limited to evocation and adjuration spells and I bet there are some really fun spells and possibilities previously locked to an EK just waiting to be discovered.
thoughts?
I like eliminating the limitation on spell school. Several of my tables HB it that way anyway and it's really fun. I don't like the "replace one attack with a cantrip", ability. WtoC really need to get a handle on how to combine cantrips and attacks because the scaling of cantrips just makes it totally OP at higher levels as it works right now.
Do you think any of the changes will change how you build an EK? I know the Usual is to have good strength and constitution (of course) and only 14, maybe 16 int. With new spells being unlocked, do you see intelligence becoming more important as many other good spells require intelligence as the spell casting ability score?- Seeing as we are pulling out these spells from the wizards spell list.
I technically did not notice any such limitations when I made my Battle Smith 3/Eldritch Knight 17 Custom Lineage build. Maybe i’m just suppose to know which spells I can and can’t use?
there could be int builds, especially with the new true strike, I did see one, I believe, with an int based staff shillelagh.
Oh, cool!do you know where the build is so I can look at it?
In the current PB the only spells you can take are from evocation and abjuration, with like one exception I think. But Since you took those three levels in battle smith (which sounds like a really cool build by the way) I assume you took some artificer spells not limited to the two schools.
I could definitely see going at least 16 in INT now, but the changes only modestly affect how I would play one in combat. In terms of combat the unlock would make me consider picking up: Levitate, Fly, Misty Step, Bigby's Hand, Haste, Web, Flaming Sphere, Telekinesis, Hold Person.
But mostly it opens up some interesting support/ooc builds, like an assassin-type fighter with Invisibility and Disguise Self, or an interrogator-type fighter with Detect Thoughts, and Fear, or a strongman-type fighter with Enlarge/Reduce and Jump, or a swashbuckler-type fighter with Charm Person, and Fortune's Favour, or a Jedi-type fighter with Catapult and Suggestion..
Personally I thought the school limits on the classes were good both for flavor and to keep some focus rather than letting an EK grab a bunch of utility stuff like Charm Person, Detect Magic/Thoughts, Invisibility, etc. They got one wildcard at 3rd with the subclass, and another at 8th, 14th, and 20th, so you could still have some flexibility on the build, but you couldn't just use it to get a full magic bag of tricks. I can live with the change, but I honestly don't think it was super necessary either.
sorry for the late reply, but for me personally, I think the school limitations are a bit restrictive. While I definitely see me taking mostly evocation and adjuration spells (as I am a fighter) I strongly believe that among the restriction will allow for more flavor and depth to the eldritch knight. It's kinda like opt-in complexity in a way. Sure, you could keep it simple by sticking to evocation and adjuration, or you could come up with something funkier like some of the examples Agilemind came up with. I hope that the changes will get more people to try out the eldritch knight. Sure, the blade singer may have more spells, and the hexblade is just really damn good, BUT as a standalone fighter subclass, I think the Eldritch Knight is pretty swell.
I very much like the changes.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
may I ask what you liked in particular?
The school limit on EK, in the 2014 rules, amount to "you get abjuration and something that's completely useless to you"; evocation is literally the worst possible choice (even necromancy is better). In the 2024 rules evocation becomes a viable choice at level 18+ because of improved war magic.
Even if it's not optimum, what's the point of playing a magic knight if you're not attacking with magic?
You have just described why the 2014 EK is terrible; it's not just 'not optimum', it's a trap option. The 2024 version will at least be using cantrips regularly at level 7+.
Opening up the options for Eldritch Knight and Arcane Trickster are some of my favorite changes proposed for the 2024 PHB.
Mother and Cat Herder. Playing TTRPGs since 1989 (She/Her)
Because you're a knight not a wizard. Why would a magic knight be casting a spell every single turn? If you're casting a spell every turn you are just a wizard that wears armour.
100% what Agilemind is saying there. I struggled with EK at first because mentally, it was a fighter/mage hybrid. When you look at it as a fighter who can enhance his skills with magic, it opens an awful lot of options and starts to look much better.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha
That's true! An eldritch knight is a fighter first and foremost. But also something that I'd like to mention that doesn't seem to be brought up... Well, anywhere is that as an eldritch knight your not just another super strong soldier or some nimble archer... You're smart! Fighter may not be the best choice for role playing when out of combat, but that extra intelligence allows you to do, learn, and say things that your average -1 intelligence fighter wouldn't! Just like I said before, Opt in complexity. (I think eldritch knight is becoming my favorite subclass!)
I read about that too. While I don't play a lot of rouge, I think I will try an Arcane trickster build once one DND comes out. I mean, how hilarious would it be if some tiny little rouge randomly cast a fireball from her hands completely catching the enemy off guard? It would be awesome; that's what!
Well, maybe. An EK whose spells known are, say
is a perfectly well-built EK... and will be fine with an Intelligence of 8.
^^ There are a lot of spells that don't require attack rolls, and those spells work perfectly well on a character with low caster score.
Any time an unfathomably powerful entity sweeps in and offers godlike rewards in return for just a few teensy favors, it’s a scam. Unless it’s me. I’d never lie to you, reader dearest.
Tasha