I belong to several D&D Facebook groups, some of which are for new players. I like to recommend DNDB to new players so they can get the basics free, and then buy products as they learn. I’m a long time player, but DNDB was extremely helpful in both helping me learn the newest version and playing on line.
Another member of the group told a new player NOT to buy from DNDB because when One D&D drops next year, all accounts must have mandatory paid subscriptions even to access sources that we have bought the licenses to use.
I recall this being discussed a few months back. But I thought WOTC walked back that kind of talk. Does anyone know if this is Indeed the way it will go down? (the other person called it FACT that it would happen). Knowing the answer will help me in deciding whether to continue to endorse this site to new players and likely affect my personal buying habits.
I am a Master subscriber now, and don’t see that changing. But there is a big difference between me wanting to do it and being forced to do it. The idea that I could lose access to several books I bought here rather than in hard cover format rattles me a bit.
It should be noted, there is also no evidence this was discussed a few months back, as you stated. This was a rumour spread during the OGL fiasco by a social media influencer who had “sources inside Wizards” providing him information—basically the equivalent of “my uncle works for Nintendo.”
He made a number of claims about Wizards - such as their plans to make subscriptions mandatory and more expensive and “leaks” about upcoming announcements - all of which failed to pan out. It was very, very clear he has no inside source and was just looking to post incendiary content, truth be darned, to take advantage against widespread anti-Wizards sentiment and increase his own viewership. Then, like so many falsehoods on the internet, it took on a life of its own—the bad information was repeated and reposted so many times that, by the time it became clear its originator was a hack, no one remembered this was another of his fabrications.
The fact that folks still think this was ever truly on the table is a perfect example of a lie getting halfway around the world before the truth can get its pants on.
All that is to say, this is really not something you should be overly concerned about—not only has Wizards been pretty clear this is not part of their current plan, the evidence seems to indicate any claims that it once was planned were made up.
It should be noted, there is also no evidence this was discussed a few months back, as you stated. This was a rumour spread during the OGL fiasco by a social media influencer who had “sources inside Wizards” providing him information—basically the equivalent of “my uncle works for Nintendo.”
He made a number of claims about Wizards - such as their plans to make subscriptions mandatory and more expensive and “leaks” about upcoming announcements - all of which failed to pan out. It was very, very clear he has no inside source and was just looking to post incendiary content, truth be darned, to take advantage against widespread anti-Wizards sentiment and increase his own viewership. Then, like so many falsehoods on the internet, it took on a life of its own—the bad information was repeated and reposted so many times that, by the time it became clear its originator was a hack, no one remembered this was another of his fabrications.
The fact that folks still think this was ever truly on the table is a perfect example of a lie getting halfway around the world before the truth can get its pants on.
All that is to say, this is really not something you should be overly concerned about—not only has Wizards been pretty clear this is not part of their current plan, the evidence seems to indicate any claims that it once was planned were made up.
This is exactly how I was feeling about it. But feelings aren’t facts, and when this guy said it was a fact…a fact that my own independent searches could not verify, I knew I could get the straight story from you guys. I think that any such move would have been detrimental to the industry, the community and the bottom line. But as you said, the rumors took on life. So when I said I was remembering talk about it, I in no way meant to imply “official” talk. But I guess when I mentioned “walking it back”, I was conflating this issue with that other issue you mentioned.
Thanks so much for spelling it out, complete with the events as they unfolded in this tale of gossip trying to pass as news.
I think this was before OGL. There were slides being passed around forums etc that "leaked" that they were going to do a subscription-only model. One of the regulars here posted it alongside a rather long and nasty rant. Anyways, turns out the slides were fake (the person posting it genuinely thought they were real until they were proven otherwise).
Really disappointing that people go to such lengths and nastiness to fake such things.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
The absurd slide deck both preceded and was also part of the allegations in the leak that included the OGL fiasco.
End of the day, no one* knows what, if at all, changes will occur to DDB's business model when the post One D&D product line rolls through. There are a lot of folks with varying levels of investment, both emotionally and materially, who really want said roll out to crap the bed. Anyone claiming to have facts about the future of One D&D outside of what's been documented at say the Content Creators Summit is either misinformed or misinforming.
As to the OP's opposition on Facebook. Even if the hater was right in the long run, so what? A free account limits someone to 6 characters anyway. That's not hard to export if the subscription pricing changes or otherwise become prohibitive. We've got the better part of a year** most likely before we see anything from it, and that's plenty of time for a new player to decide whether D&D or DDB is something you want to further invest in.
*Yes there are probably a handful of folks who do know what things might look like, but they're all under NDAs and no one's officially announced anything.
**I doubt the world is going to suddenly change Jan 2024. My guess is we'll see the new PHB out at GenCon or thereabouts the earliest, with the MM and DMGs ending the year, _IF_ they don't hold off on the PHB till the end of 2024 as a holiday sales driver (more PHBs being sold more than any other D&D book, though having all three out by Christmas may make for a boxed set missing a side, slipcase set).
It should be noted, there is also no evidence this was discussed a few months back, as you stated. This was a rumour spread during the OGL fiasco by a social media influencer who had “sources inside Wizards” providing him information—basically the equivalent of “my uncle works for Nintendo.”
He made a number of claims about Wizards - such as their plans to make subscriptions mandatory and more expensive and “leaks” about upcoming announcements - all of which failed to pan out. It was very, very clear he has no inside source and was just looking to post incendiary content, truth be darned, to take advantage against widespread anti-Wizards sentiment and increase his own viewership. Then, like so many falsehoods on the internet, it took on a life of its own—the bad information was repeated and reposted so many times that, by the time it became clear its originator was a hack, no one remembered this was another of his fabrications.
The fact that folks still think this was ever truly on the table is a perfect example of a lie getting halfway around the world before the truth can get its pants on.
All that is to say, this is really not something you should be overly concerned about—not only has Wizards been pretty clear this is not part of their current plan, the evidence seems to indicate any claims that it once was planned were made up.
This is exactly how I was feeling about it. But feelings aren’t facts, and when this guy said it was a fact…a fact that my own independent searches could not verify, I knew I could get the straight story from you guys.
Remember, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim, and as the late Chris Hitchens liked to say, that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
Going to a subscription-only model would be a giant PR fiasco and likely lawsuit bait, and probably wouldn't even make them money; while stupidity is by no means unheard of, given the general trends in gaming models I would consider it far more likely that they'll eliminate subscriptions entirely and make things like additional character slots microtransactions (not that I have any information about that either).
Further, it's already a "Pay for anything not OGL" model. They are making money in that manner.
I don't find it crazy that a business seeks profit in exchange for their product. They just need to make one we want (and a VTT that's 100% D&D Beyond meshed is what I want).
Further, it's already a "Pay for anything not OGL" model. They are making money in that manner.
I don't find it crazy that a business seeks profit in exchange for their product. They just need to make one we want (and a VTT that's 100% D&D Beyond meshed is what I want).
I am most looking forward to that VTT. There are other fun game play aspects that they may be Introducing soon according to a survey I took. But I can’t recall if I signed an NDA on that, so I will leave it there.
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I belong to several D&D Facebook groups, some of which are for new players. I like to recommend DNDB to new players so they can get the basics free, and then buy products as they learn. I’m a long time player, but DNDB was extremely helpful in both helping me learn the newest version and playing on line.
Another member of the group told a new player NOT to buy from DNDB because when One D&D drops next year, all accounts must have mandatory paid subscriptions even to access sources that we have bought the licenses to use.
I recall this being discussed a few months back. But I thought WOTC walked back that kind of talk. Does anyone know if this is Indeed the way it will go down? (the other person called it FACT that it would happen). Knowing the answer will help me in deciding whether to continue to endorse this site to new players and likely affect my personal buying habits.
I am a Master subscriber now, and don’t see that changing. But there is a big difference between me wanting to do it and being forced to do it. The idea that I could lose access to several books I bought here rather than in hard cover format rattles me a bit.
Thanks for any clarification.
There is exactly zero evidence to support such an assertion.
That’s what I thought. I couldn’t find such evidence either. Thank you for your time.
It should be noted, there is also no evidence this was discussed a few months back, as you stated. This was a rumour spread during the OGL fiasco by a social media influencer who had “sources inside Wizards” providing him information—basically the equivalent of “my uncle works for Nintendo.”
He made a number of claims about Wizards - such as their plans to make subscriptions mandatory and more expensive and “leaks” about upcoming announcements - all of which failed to pan out. It was very, very clear he has no inside source and was just looking to post incendiary content, truth be darned, to take advantage against widespread anti-Wizards sentiment and increase his own viewership. Then, like so many falsehoods on the internet, it took on a life of its own—the bad information was repeated and reposted so many times that, by the time it became clear its originator was a hack, no one remembered this was another of his fabrications.
The fact that folks still think this was ever truly on the table is a perfect example of a lie getting halfway around the world before the truth can get its pants on.
All that is to say, this is really not something you should be overly concerned about—not only has Wizards been pretty clear this is not part of their current plan, the evidence seems to indicate any claims that it once was planned were made up.
This is exactly how I was feeling about it. But feelings aren’t facts, and when this guy said it was a fact…a fact that my own independent searches could not verify, I knew I could get the straight story from you guys. I think that any such move would have been detrimental to the industry, the community and the bottom line. But as you said, the rumors took on life. So when I said I was remembering talk about it, I in no way meant to imply “official” talk. But I guess when I mentioned “walking it back”, I was conflating this issue with that other issue you mentioned.
Thanks so much for spelling it out, complete with the events as they unfolded in this tale of gossip trying to pass as news.
I think this was before OGL. There were slides being passed around forums etc that "leaked" that they were going to do a subscription-only model. One of the regulars here posted it alongside a rather long and nasty rant. Anyways, turns out the slides were fake (the person posting it genuinely thought they were real until they were proven otherwise).
Really disappointing that people go to such lengths and nastiness to fake such things.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
The absurd slide deck both preceded and was also part of the allegations in the leak that included the OGL fiasco.
End of the day, no one* knows what, if at all, changes will occur to DDB's business model when the post One D&D product line rolls through. There are a lot of folks with varying levels of investment, both emotionally and materially, who really want said roll out to crap the bed. Anyone claiming to have facts about the future of One D&D outside of what's been documented at say the Content Creators Summit is either misinformed or misinforming.
As to the OP's opposition on Facebook. Even if the hater was right in the long run, so what? A free account limits someone to 6 characters anyway. That's not hard to export if the subscription pricing changes or otherwise become prohibitive. We've got the better part of a year** most likely before we see anything from it, and that's plenty of time for a new player to decide whether D&D or DDB is something you want to further invest in.
*Yes there are probably a handful of folks who do know what things might look like, but they're all under NDAs and no one's officially announced anything.
**I doubt the world is going to suddenly change Jan 2024. My guess is we'll see the new PHB out at GenCon or thereabouts the earliest, with the MM and DMGs ending the year, _IF_ they don't hold off on the PHB till the end of 2024 as a holiday sales driver (more PHBs being sold more than any other D&D book, though having all three out by Christmas may make for
a boxed set missing a side,slipcase set).Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Remember, the burden of proof is on the person making the claim, and as the late Chris Hitchens liked to say, that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Going to a subscription-only model would be a giant PR fiasco and likely lawsuit bait, and probably wouldn't even make them money; while stupidity is by no means unheard of, given the general trends in gaming models I would consider it far more likely that they'll eliminate subscriptions entirely and make things like additional character slots microtransactions (not that I have any information about that either).
Further, it's already a "Pay for anything not OGL" model. They are making money in that manner.
I don't find it crazy that a business seeks profit in exchange for their product. They just need to make one we want (and a VTT that's 100% D&D Beyond meshed is what I want).
I am most looking forward to that VTT. There are other fun game play aspects that they may be Introducing soon according to a survey I took. But I can’t recall if I signed an NDA on that, so I will leave it there.