Dragon Slaying Ammunition says that it can affect creatures that are in a "group associated with the ammunition"
An arrow of slaying is a magic weapon meant to slay a particular kind of creature. Some are more focused than others; for example, there are both arrows of dragon slaying and arrows of blue dragon slaying. If a creature belonging to the type, race, or group associated with an arrow of slayingtakes damage from the arrow, the creature must make a DC 17 Constitution saving throw, taking an extra 6d10 piercing damage on a failed save, or half as much extra damage on a successful one.
Once an arrow of slaying deals its extra damage to a creature, it becomes a nonmagical arrow.
Other types of magic ammunition of this kind exist, such as bolts of slaying meant for a crossbow, though arrows are most common.
So from the red text I want to say it can affect creatures that are working for a dragon.
Do you have any opinions/input onto this ruling?
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A deck of playing cards are a great way to randomise encounters
Are you DMing some players who want to try this? You should 100% say no. Otherwise these things will work on almost everyone. For example, anyone who slays a dragon is forevermore associated with dragons, and it's absurd for an arrow of dragon-slaying to be extra good at murdering dragon-slayers.
Dragon Slaying Ammunition says that it can affect creatures that are in a "group associated with the ammunition"
An arrow of slaying is a magic weapon meant to slay a particular kind of creature. Some are more focused than others; for example, there are both arrows of dragon slaying and arrows of blue dragon slaying. If a creature belonging to the type, race, or group associated with an arrow of slayingtakes damage from the arrow, the creature must make a DC 17 Constitution saving throw, taking an extra 6d10 piercing damage on a failed save, or half as much extra damage on a successful one.
Once an arrow of slaying deals its extra damage to a creature, it becomes a nonmagical arrow.
Other types of magic ammunition of this kind exist, such as bolts of slaying meant for a crossbow, though arrows are most common.
So from the red text I want to say it can affect creatures that are working for a dragon.
Do you have any opinions/input onto this ruling?
Your idea does not work with the dragon slaying ammunition RAW. A “group associated with an arrow of slaying” refers to the group said in the arrow’s text, referenced directly. Now, if you were to make a homebrew item called something like “Arrow of Dragon Cult Slaying” then I believe it would work.
What arrow of slaying means by "group associated with [the arrow]" ties back to the sentence immediately preceding it about how the arrow could be for more or less specific categorizations of creatures.
So an arrow of Dragon slaying would not work on dragon worshipers that do not fall into the group: "dragon", but an arrow of Dragon worshiper slaying would (but would not work on the dragon being worshiped, unless it worshipped another dragon... You get it).
Dragon is clearly a type, not a race. You would be attempting to claim that the Dragon slaying arrow was NOT for the "Type" but was instead for a group. That is a hard sell when it specifically used the "Type" word Dragon. Even "Red Dragon Slaying" would be a race.
But an arrow of "Evil Dragon Slaying", that should be a group associated. It should get any evil Dragonborn, evil dragonbait, evil dragonbone golem, and even anyone that is working for an evil dragon.
An arrow of dragon slaying wouldn't work. What you want is an arrow of dragon cultist slaying. I'm not being facetious, that would be a legitimate item. Maybe an arrow of this one particular dragon's cult slaying. Kinda wordy. Maybe the cult has a shorter name you can use.
"Kind" was used in the text as "Type" has a specific meaning in the rules. Kind is much more general.
An arrow of Blue Dragon Slaying gives extra damage against Blue Dragons (of any size)but acts as a normal arrow on anything else
An arrow of Dragon Slaying gives extra damage against any Dragon (it would be up to the DM whether this includes creature creatures of dragon type that are not actually dragons such as Greatwyrms, Wyverns and Drakes)
An arrow of stone giant slaying works only on stone giants
An arrow of Humanoid Slaying would work on any any humanoid but would be immensely powerful
It is entirely up to the DM what arrows are exist or can be crafted. the rules give a couple of examples to show it does not need to be type. I think ithat "kind" should be limited by biology rather than action. If there wasan "Arrow of Dragon Cult slaying" does that work against a mercenary working for the "cult of the dragon" but not a member. It is debatable whether initiates of the cult of the dragon are members, what about people who are trying to infiltrate the cult? Why does such an arrow work on a creature one day and not another? An arrow of Red-Headed Mountain Dwarf Slaying avoids such issues (it is based on biology so it depends on the natural color of the hair if it is dyed).
RAW the DM can define "kind" however they want.
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Dragon Slaying Ammunition says that it can affect creatures that are in a "group associated with the ammunition"
So from the red text I want to say it can affect creatures that are working for a dragon.
Do you have any opinions/input onto this ruling?
A deck of playing cards are a great way to randomise encounters
Are you DMing some players who want to try this? You should 100% say no. Otherwise these things will work on almost everyone. For example, anyone who slays a dragon is forevermore associated with dragons, and it's absurd for an arrow of dragon-slaying to be extra good at murdering dragon-slayers.
Your idea does not work with the dragon slaying ammunition RAW. A “group associated with an arrow of slaying” refers to the group said in the arrow’s text, referenced directly. Now, if you were to make a homebrew item called something like “Arrow of Dragon Cult Slaying” then I believe it would work.
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What arrow of slaying means by "group associated with [the arrow]" ties back to the sentence immediately preceding it about how the arrow could be for more or less specific categorizations of creatures.
So an arrow of Dragon slaying would not work on dragon worshipers that do not fall into the group: "dragon", but an arrow of Dragon worshiper slaying would (but would not work on the dragon being worshiped, unless it worshipped another dragon... You get it).
Dragon is clearly a type, not a race. You would be attempting to claim that the Dragon slaying arrow was NOT for the "Type" but was instead for a group. That is a hard sell when it specifically used the "Type" word Dragon. Even "Red Dragon Slaying" would be a race.
But an arrow of "Evil Dragon Slaying", that should be a group associated. It should get any evil Dragonborn, evil dragonbait, evil dragonbone golem, and even anyone that is working for an evil dragon.
Okay so what you guys are saying is the Slaying Ammunition uses the word "Group" in a more physical sense than social, right?
A deck of playing cards are a great way to randomise encounters
No? Just that "dragon" is not a group, it is a type.
An arrow of dragon slaying wouldn't work. What you want is an arrow of dragon cultist slaying. I'm not being facetious, that would be a legitimate item. Maybe an arrow of this one particular dragon's cult slaying. Kinda wordy. Maybe the cult has a shorter name you can use.
"Kind" was used in the text as "Type" has a specific meaning in the rules. Kind is much more general.
It is entirely up to the DM what arrows are exist or can be crafted. the rules give a couple of examples to show it does not need to be type. I think ithat "kind" should be limited by biology rather than action. If there wasan "Arrow of Dragon Cult slaying" does that work against a mercenary working for the "cult of the dragon" but not a member. It is debatable whether initiates of the cult of the dragon are members, what about people who are trying to infiltrate the cult? Why does such an arrow work on a creature one day and not another? An arrow of Red-Headed Mountain Dwarf Slaying avoids such issues (it is based on biology so it depends on the natural color of the hair if it is dyed).
RAW the DM can define "kind" however they want.