I'm a DM who loves players messing with physics, and I'd like to know if theres rules regarding/how y'all handle a size reduction spell (reduce/polymorph/wildshape) being cancelled while the subject is inside a container too small to contain the subjects new size. for example: wildshape into a bug> get eaten > cancel wildshape - or: reduce person > lock subject in a steel box > cancel reduce person
How you want it to work is entirely up to you because it is magic and not physics.
There are spells that remove you from a location on the current plane which then return you to the nearest unoccupied space when the effect ends. They do this because of magic. Similarly, releasing a spell keeping a creature small could result in it regrowing in the nearest space capable of containing it.
Personally, I think that is likely better than polymorphing an opponent into a mouse, putting the mouse in a small reinforced steel box, sealed with chains, and then releasing the polymorph. The formerly polymorphed (or wildshaped) creature would find itself in a space too small to contain it which would likely kill it instantly.
Part of how you interpret how the spell might work depends on how you decide it works. Does the spell cause the creature to shrink or grow as part of a process or is it instantly replaced with a creature of a different size. In the latter case, if it is an instantaneous substitution, you could decide that the "rules of magic" prevent one object from occupying the same space as another - so in that case, the instantaneous increase in size is handled by displacement to the nearest volume capable of holding the creature.
This problem comes up all the time for spells that might result in one creature occupying the same spatial volume as another creature or an object. In terms of physics, the results would be pretty catastrophic to both creatures involved ... in terms of magic, these situations could either be allowed or prevented - your call.
I, personally, tend to go with the non lethal approach for these interactions since I would prefer if the players didn't use it on the NPCs and the NPCs didn't use it on the players since players tend to get upset when one of their characters instantly dies by implosion.
The first thing to remember, a creature's space is the area in feet that it effectively controls in combat, not an expression of its physical dimensions.
When a creature size change and is too small for it's surrounding, you can rule that it's Squeezing into a Smaller Space or even deal some Improvising Damage if you judge it's too constricted and should be injured in the process.
I'm a DM who loves players messing with physics, and I'd like to know if theres rules regarding/how y'all handle a size reduction spell (reduce/polymorph/wildshape) being cancelled while the subject is inside a container too small to contain the subjects new size. for example: wildshape into a bug> get eaten > cancel wildshape - or: reduce person > lock subject in a steel box > cancel reduce person
no hard written rules on the matter, maybe because like it was said elsewhere, the general rules just shove a creature that can’t fit a space into an unoccupied space nearby.
Real world physics wise, DM call on size of container vs previous creature size, and whether or not it is an instant trash compactor.
This is one of the unresolved issues that a good DM has to house rule around and should do so in a manner to discourage people from trying to do this on purpose.
It is a bad idea to say the spell has infinite strength, breaking any container you are in- among other things the spell does not list any strength. Similarly it is is a bad idea to say the spell's duration is extended - you do not want something as simple a set of full plate armor allowing you to extend the duration of Reduce spell to an infinite time.
A dex save to get a free move out of the bad situation is often a good idea for the DM to allow. If that fails, I usually let the player use their strength to attempt to break the container via a full rounds worth of attacks. If they succeed, great. If they fail, they are squeezed into the container with some rather nasty consequences.
If the container is clearly too small (i.e. you are a Medium sized person in a Medium or small person's stomach) to contain them, then I rule they and the container take equal damage until one of them breaks/dies. Medium person in a large person's stomach I just say you barely squeeze fit.
Worst case scenario, I rule they are squeezed into a container too small for them - i.e. a Larger sized person is totally acceptable to be stuck in a 5 ft x 5ft locked room, unable to get out, and trapped till they die or someone casts polymorph or reduce on them. I do let them cast spells with a Sleight of Hand/Dex check, etc. etc.
Another alternative is to use the "shunting" affect from spells like Etherealness and other features that let you walk through objects. If you grow inside of another creature, you could argue that both take half off the damage as the growing creature is shunted out of the other. For being inside of a box, I would rule that the growing creature takes half of the shunting damage up to the HP of the container (as you would break the container and continue to grow once the HP was exceeded, or shunt out if it is not).
I've a simple view of this: Does the spell indicate that you can use it in combat to burst dragons or purple worms from within? No? Then it cannot. When you cancel Reduce Person, the target grows to fill it's existing boundaries, with no damage to either creature or surroundings. When the target escapes whatever confine it's in, it regains the rest of it's size.
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
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I'm a DM who loves players messing with physics, and I'd like to know if theres rules regarding/how y'all handle a size reduction spell (reduce/polymorph/wildshape) being cancelled while the subject is inside a container too small to contain the subjects new size. for example: wildshape into a bug> get eaten > cancel wildshape - or: reduce person > lock subject in a steel box > cancel reduce person
How you want it to work is entirely up to you because it is magic and not physics.
There are spells that remove you from a location on the current plane which then return you to the nearest unoccupied space when the effect ends. They do this because of magic. Similarly, releasing a spell keeping a creature small could result in it regrowing in the nearest space capable of containing it.
Personally, I think that is likely better than polymorphing an opponent into a mouse, putting the mouse in a small reinforced steel box, sealed with chains, and then releasing the polymorph. The formerly polymorphed (or wildshaped) creature would find itself in a space too small to contain it which would likely kill it instantly.
Part of how you interpret how the spell might work depends on how you decide it works. Does the spell cause the creature to shrink or grow as part of a process or is it instantly replaced with a creature of a different size. In the latter case, if it is an instantaneous substitution, you could decide that the "rules of magic" prevent one object from occupying the same space as another - so in that case, the instantaneous increase in size is handled by displacement to the nearest volume capable of holding the creature.
This problem comes up all the time for spells that might result in one creature occupying the same spatial volume as another creature or an object. In terms of physics, the results would be pretty catastrophic to both creatures involved ... in terms of magic, these situations could either be allowed or prevented - your call.
I, personally, tend to go with the non lethal approach for these interactions since I would prefer if the players didn't use it on the NPCs and the NPCs didn't use it on the players since players tend to get upset when one of their characters instantly dies by implosion.
The first thing to remember, a creature's space is the area in feet that it effectively controls in combat, not an expression of its physical dimensions.
When a creature size change and is too small for it's surrounding, you can rule that it's Squeezing into a Smaller Space or even deal some Improvising Damage if you judge it's too constricted and should be injured in the process.
no hard written rules on the matter, maybe because like it was said elsewhere, the general rules just shove a creature that can’t fit a space into an unoccupied space nearby.
Real world physics wise, DM call on size of container vs previous creature size, and whether or not it is an instant trash compactor.
The Goddess of Magic gets mad at you and just says no. After one red card your pc can no longer cast any magic.
No Gaming is Better than Bad Gaming.
This is one of the unresolved issues that a good DM has to house rule around and should do so in a manner to discourage people from trying to do this on purpose.
It is a bad idea to say the spell has infinite strength, breaking any container you are in- among other things the spell does not list any strength. Similarly it is is a bad idea to say the spell's duration is extended - you do not want something as simple a set of full plate armor allowing you to extend the duration of Reduce spell to an infinite time.
A dex save to get a free move out of the bad situation is often a good idea for the DM to allow. If that fails, I usually let the player use their strength to attempt to break the container via a full rounds worth of attacks. If they succeed, great. If they fail, they are squeezed into the container with some rather nasty consequences.
If the container is clearly too small (i.e. you are a Medium sized person in a Medium or small person's stomach) to contain them, then I rule they and the container take equal damage until one of them breaks/dies. Medium person in a large person's stomach I just say you barely squeeze fit.
Worst case scenario, I rule they are squeezed into a container too small for them - i.e. a Larger sized person is totally acceptable to be stuck in a 5 ft x 5ft locked room, unable to get out, and trapped till they die or someone casts polymorph or reduce on them. I do let them cast spells with a Sleight of Hand/Dex check, etc. etc.
There is a line from the Enlarge/Reduce spell:
If there isn't enough room for the target to double its size, the creature or object attains the maximum possible size in the space available.
For most things that magically cause things to grow in a space too small for it this is how I would rule.
Another alternative is to use the "shunting" affect from spells like Etherealness and other features that let you walk through objects. If you grow inside of another creature, you could argue that both take half off the damage as the growing creature is shunted out of the other. For being inside of a box, I would rule that the growing creature takes half of the shunting damage up to the HP of the container (as you would break the container and continue to grow once the HP was exceeded, or shunt out if it is not).
I've a simple view of this: Does the spell indicate that you can use it in combat to burst dragons or purple worms from within? No? Then it cannot. When you cancel Reduce Person, the target grows to fill it's existing boundaries, with no damage to either creature or surroundings. When the target escapes whatever confine it's in, it regains the rest of it's size.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.