I really like the Draconic Bloodline Sorcerer but it lags behind to the other subclass because its an older PHB subclass, I believe it has good potential at being the Gish subclass of Sorcerer. I've seen other do similar things, but what i think it really needs over the other additions I wrote, is an additional spells list.
Dragon Ancestor
At 1st level, you choose one type of dragon as your ancestor. You know theDragon's Ire (Hellish Rebuke) spell, the damage type dealt is associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Ancestry
Dragon Color
Damage Type
Black
Acid
Blue
Lightning
Brass
Fire
Bronze
Lightning
Copper
Acid
Gold
Fire
Green
Poison
Red
Fire
Silver
Cold
White
Amethyst
Crystal
Emerald
Sapphire
Topaz
Cold
Force
Radiant
Psychic
Thunder
Necrotic
You can speak, read, and write Draconic. Additionally, whenever you make a Charisma check when interacting with dragons, your proficiency bonus is doubled if it applies to the check.
Draconic Resilience
As magic flows through your body, it causes physical traits of your dragon ancestors to emerge. At 1st level, your hit point maximum increases by 1 and increases by 1 again whenever you gain a level in this class.Additionally, parts of your skin are covered by a thin sheen of dragon-like scales. When you aren't wearing armor, your AC equals 13 + your Dexterity modifier. You gain resistance to the damage type associated with your draconic ancestry at 6th level if you don't have it already.
You know the Primal Savagery cantrip, the damage type dealt is associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Magic
You learn additional spells when you reach certain levels in this class, as shown on the Draconic Spells table. Each spell counts as a sorcerer spell for you, but it doesn’t count against the number of sorcerer spells you know. These spells can’t be replaced when you gain a level in this class.
Whenever you gain a sorcerer level, you can replace one spell you gained from this feature with another spell of the same level. The new spell must be a conjuration or a transmutation spell from the sorcerer, warlock, or wizard spell list, or have the damage type associated with your dragon ancestor.
Starting at 6th level, when you cast a spell that deals damage of the type associated with your draconic ancestry, add your Charisma modifier to that damage. You can make an addtional melee or melee spell attack cantrip only when it deals damage of the type associated with your draconic ancestry.
If you cast Primal Savagery or Attack as an action, then you may cast Primal Savageryas a Bonus Action(metamagic cannot be used during the bonus action) in the same turn.
Dragon Wings
At 14th level, you gain the ability to sprout a pair of dragon wings from your back, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create these wings as a bonus action on your turn. They last until you dismiss them as a bonus action on your turn. You can't manifest your wings while wearing armor unless the armor is made to accommodate them, and clothing not made to accommodate your wings might be destroyed when you manifest them.
Draconic Presence
Beginning at 18th level, you can channel the dread presence of your dragon ancestor, causing those around you to become awestruck or frightened. As an action, you can spend 5 sorcery points to draw on this power and exude an aura of awe or fear (your choice) to a distance of 60 feet. For 1 minute or until you lose your concentration (as if you were casting a concentration spell)consciousness, each hostile creature that starts its turn in this aura must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed (if you chose awe) or frightened (if you chose fear) until the aura ends. A creature that succeeds on this saving throw is immune to your aura for 24 hours.
Edits
Added gem dragons,made the resistance be from the start and specified that the melee spell attack be a cantrip, The conditional Extra should work with the UA Draconic Options breath weapon attack replacment.
Made a 5th Level additional spells list that matches more to the avaliable additional spells lists that the other subclasses have.
Changed it so its Hellish Rebukethat does the damage type dealt is associated with the dragon ancestor, made sense as protection given by the ancestor.
Interesting. I don't have any advice for balancing (But you should be careful), but rather, a small note: There has been a new Draconic Options UA, which revises the Dragonborn and Kobold races. One of the bigger changes is the addition of the gem dragon ancestries. Perhaps you could add them to the subclass? Another large change is the ability to use a breath weapon in place of an attack. Maybe this subclass could do with an extra attack?
You have point I should add the gem dragon ancestries., because it does seem like something that would be added to a Revised version of the subclass. I did add a conditional extra attack and I worded it in away that its supposed trigger with an Elemental infused weapon,attack from the Elemental Weapon spell and/or Primal Savagery Dragon's Ire cantrip.
I agree but its also very on theme for the subclass,besides adding it without counting towards spells known is quite useful,If somebody were allowed to use this by their DM but didnt want the UA they can just leave it.
Thank you, I tried to make it work as both a Gish and Blaster,but I really hope the choices and tweaks I made are balanced well enough and not game breaking.
It'll probably come as no surprise that I agree with a lot of these changes 😉
A few quick points though:
All other sub-class spell lists only seem to extend up to 5th level, though I'm not really sure if there's a specific reason for that or not so it's probably fine as you're giving more of a long-term change rather than more in the earlier levels.
Have I missed Dragon's Ire somewhere? You give it as a 1st level spell but I can't seem to find it defined anywhere?
I'm undecided about the free elemental resistance; 1st level draconic sorcerer is actually quite good already, and an interesting option for multiclassing with a Bard or Warlock, as you basically get unarmored defence as good as Mage Armor and better than Studded Leather, plus the spellcasting, and unlike other sorcerer dips there's no loss of HP (as it's d6+1 vs. d8). An elemental resistance of your choice on top of that might be a bit much? Hard to say for sure but it feels like it might be too much for the 1st level.
The addition to Elemental Affinity probably needs clarified; it doesn't really specify when you get the extra attack/cantrip. For example, if you intend it to be like a Bladesinger's Extra Attack feature, then that would be something like "You can attack twice, instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn. In addition, you can cast a cantrip dealing damage of your dragon ancestor's type in place of one of these attacks", and probably might as well be under it's own Extra Attack feature.
Otherwise you could do something similar to what I did and make it a Bonus Action when you trigger Elemental Affinity? In my case I opted to make it one sorcery point, because sorcerers can already do basically this (attack or cantrip as an action, quicken a spell as a bonus action) for two points. It depends which form you're going for; attack after cast gives paladin-like nova damage so should have a similar resource cost (for short term damage), whereas Bladesinger style gives long-term melee potential. Unless maybe I've misunderstood how this feature works (maybe it's intended as a double cast of a melee cantrip)?
Making Draconic Presence a non-concentration effect definitely makes it a lot more useful as a feature!
Yeah I wasnt sure if it was required to do the 10 spells over 5 spell levels, but alot of the elemental and dragony stuff are higher levels so I just went with the staggred long term additional spells.
Its a modded primal savegery cantrip that does damage associated with the dragon ancestor.
Yeah idk if giving away free resistence is broken but I think it works since some races come with extra resistance.
I tried to word it in a way that it can be a double cast of the primal savagery(up to three attacks with quicken) and two attacks with an elemental infused weapon attack or elemental weapon spell(up tp three attacks with extra attack from another source) or a combo of both, I kinda wanted this feature to interact with Extra attack(giving up to three to four attacks, if multiclassed fighter) with it, like I want to that to work but that might trully be broken,IDK....
Yeah idk if giving away free resistence is broken but I think it works since some races come with extra resistance.
Where it could get exploitative is when you add it onto a racial bonus; for example, one of the reasons I've been homebrewing changes to the draconic ancestry class myself is because what I really want to play is a dragonborn whose ancestor is a black shadow dragon, so black chromatic dragonborn for the race gives me acid resistance, then I'd take topaz as the sorcerer ancestry for the necrotic element. Under the current style rule I would only have acid resistance until 6th level sorcerer, after which I can spend a sorcery point to gain necrotic resistance for an hour (which kind of mirrors the superior acid immunity and necrotic resistance of an actual black shadow dragon).
With resistance from both though I could have two different resistances from 1st level which is probably a bit much. I think full resistance is fine as a feature, but maybe it should be delayed to 6th level as part of Elemental Affinity?
I tried to word it in a way that it can be a double cast of the primal savagery(up to three attacks with quicken) and two attacks with an elemental infused weapon attack or elemental weapon spell(up tp three attacks with extra attack from another source) or a combo of both, I kinda wanted this feature to interact with Extra attack(giving up to three to four attacks, if multiclassed fighter) with it, like I want to that to work but that might trully be broken,IDK....
Ah yeah, too many cantrips per turn too easily can be OP, since cantrip damage scales by character level, and we can already bonus action cantrip with quicken for two per turn unlike other casters. Are you picturing this as a feature specifically for primal savagery/dragon's ire? It might make sense just to make it something like:
So this gives you two uses of primal savagery as standard, or extra attack + primal savagery if you get it. If you get your extra attack from Fighter then you still have Action Surge for three uses of primal surgery in a turn once per short rest, or four attacks, plus one savagery, or two of each.
That way it's basically just a free version of quicken because it only applies to a specific cantrip, and only after a certain trigger; so you're gaining the ability to do more sustained melee damage than a sorcerer can normally do, but spending points to quicken isn't made redundant because it can still be used for ranged damage, and be combined with close range spells (Burning Hands + fire savagery, or Blight + necrotic savagery etc.).
I just reailzed with the new edits added, the Revised Draconic Sorcerer is functionally a monk now.
I mean not really, there's a lot of other stuff Monks can do. 😝
That said, I just realised I hadn't considered Twinned Spell at all with this feature, and I have the same issue with the bonus action attack on my own take on the sub-class, and it's quite an OP loophole. On mine it allows up to three high damage melee attacks in a single turn, while yours could allow up to four uses of primal savagery (bonus action then twin twice). Granted half of those need to go for a different target but it's still very powerful considering fighters can only attack four times once per short rest at the same level, and they're only doing regular old martial weapon damage which doesn't scale up (or have elemental damage) as cantrips do.
In my case I'm fixing it by having the ability to attack after casting count as an extra metamagic option, this way it can't be stacked (due to the one per spell limit). For your twin savagery version it might be easier to just say metamagic options can't be used at the same time?
Can't believe I forgot about Twinned Spell, as it's key to balancing sorcerer changes! Since your feature is essentially (in the double savagery use of it) twinned spell for a specific cantrip it shouldn't stack, as the big bonus is that it costs nothing but a bonus action so you can do it as much as you want.
Simple quick fix to run past your DM for any campaign:
At level one you learn the Chromatic Orb spell which doesn't count against the number of known spells you have. You can cast this spell without using any material or somatic components if the element chosen matches your ancestry.
Optional: Also if you cast this spell matching your ancestry you can also cast without expending a spell slot a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus, and you regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest (Ala Star Druid & Guiding Bolt).
Nothing new, all official material and not OP, whilst letting you flavour your draconic sorcerer to you element, not matter your chosen play style (Even Melee/spellsword).
I kinda wanna do something similar to that but to Elemental Weapon instead, where if you cast this spell with the element that matches your ancestry, you can use it without concentration either once per long rest or like your suggestion a number of times equal to either Proficiency or Charisma bonus.
That might be too much with my revised version, it might work better if it was one that followed Homebrew rules.
If you want to make a Gish sub-class, make a gish sub class rather than tinker the the Draconic (Genuinely, its lacking for the sorc), elemental weapon is of no use to other play styles. Same with the primal savagery really. I am tired though so might be mis-reading.
Post fifth level extra spells hasn't been done for anything re extra spells, so probably balancing issues there. I threw the Cromo Orb thing as something you can ask of any DM as it just adds flavour, with a small boast overall, nothing new to worry about.
Watch out for the Force damage thing, has huge OP potential.
If you want to make a Gish sub-class, make a gish sub class rather than tinker the the Draconic (Genuinely, its lacking for the sorc),
Why not both? Draconic Sorcerer has great gish qualities but like I said it lags behind to the newer Sorcerer Subclasses and that includes its lack of additional spells known.
elemental weapon is of no use to other play styles. Same with the primal savagery really.
You answered the question by that statement,Only this subclass could benifit from Elemental Weapon, and primal savegery thamatically works very well.
Post fifth level extra spells hasn't been done for anything re extra spells, so probably balancing issues there.
Yeah I've already been working on a new additional spell list after seeing Haravikk's by the books version of updated Draconic Sorcerer
I made a by the books Homebrew version that uses Basic Rules and Elemental Evil Player's Companion only inspired by Haravikk's version, I mainly focused on gishyfying the subclass with spell choices and minor edits to accomodate that.
I call this version of Draconic Sorcerer the Drac Knight.
Dragon Ancestor
At 1st level, you choose one type of dragon as your ancestor. You know theHellish Rebukespell, the damage type dealt is associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Ancestry
Dragon Color
Damage Type
Black
Acid
Blue
Lightning
Brass
Fire
Bronze
Lightning
Copper
Acid
Gold
Fire
Green
Poison
Red
Fire
Silver
Cold
White
Amethyst
Crystal
Emerald
Sapphire
Topaz
Cold
Force
Radiant
Psychic
Thunder
Necrotic
You can speak, read, and write Draconic. Additionally, whenever you make a Charisma check when interacting with dragons, your proficiency bonus is doubled if it applies to the check.
Draconic Resilience
As magic flows through your body, it causes physical traits of your dragon ancestors to emerge. At 1st level, your hit point maximum increases by 1 and increases by 1 again whenever you gain a level in this class.Additionally, parts of your skin are covered by a thin sheen of dragon-like scales. When you aren't wearing armor, your AC equals 13 + your Dexterity modifier. You gain resistance to the damage type associated with your draconic ancestry at 6th level if you don't have it already.
Draconic Magic
You learn additional spells when you reach certain levels in this class, as shown on the Draconic Spells table. Each spell counts as a sorcerer spell for you, but it doesn’t count against the number of sorcerer spells you know. These spells can’t be replaced when you gain a level in this class.
Whenever you gain a sorcerer level, you can replace one spell you gained from this feature with another spell of the same level. The new spell must be a conjuration or a transmutation spell from the sorcerer, warlock, or wizard spell list, or have the damage type associated with your dragon ancestor.
Starting at 6th level, when you cast a spell that deals damage of the type associated with your draconic ancestry, add your Charisma modifier to that damage. Additionally when you cast Elemental Weaponat a 3rd level spell slot you can spend 3 sorcery points to use it without concentration, at 5th or 6th level spell slots you spend 5 sorcery points, at a 7th level spell slot you spend 7 sorcery points .
Dragon Wings
At 14th level, you gain the ability to sprout a pair of dragon wings from your back, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create these wings as a bonus action on your turn. They last until you dismiss them as a bonus action on your turn. You can't manifest your wings while wearing armor unless the armor is made to accommodate them, and clothing not made to accommodate your wings might be destroyed when you manifest them.
Draconic Presence
Beginning at 18th level, you can channel the dread presence of your dragon ancestor, causing those around you to become awestruck or frightened. As an action, you can spend 5 sorcery points to draw on this power and exude an aura of awe or fear (your choice) to a distance of 60 feet. For 1 minute or until you lose consciousness, each hostile creature that starts its turn in this aura must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed (if you chose awe) or frightened (if you chose fear) until the aura ends. A creature that succeeds on this saving throw is immune to your aura for 24 hours.
Notes
Luckily I managed to keep most of the elemental based spell choices I had, including Longstrider which is a very useful spell. I reflavored Hellish Rebuke in the same manner I did Primal Savagery, because its a reaction, it doesnt require concentration,its quite Gish oriented, I found it thematically appropriate and I like it. I added Shillelagh because it gets the gish ball rolling from the begninng and to not force the player to pick up a weapon proficiency for a D8 weapon. You can still multiclass or pick a race with the exact weapon proficiency you want, this is there for the players with no weapon proficiencies. Command and Fly felt like cool foreshadowing spells for the later features of the subclass. I was torn between Destructive Wave and Conjure Volley for the 5th level spell, as Destructive Wave evoked that dragon strangth that stems from the bloodline but it doesnt allow for elemental picking and didnt thematically match a weapon wielding Sorcerer as Conjure Volley which doesnt have a specific damage type.
Made the elemental resistance be part of Draconic Resilience and free since I added a diffrent feature to spend sorcery points on. I didnt want to outright just give Extra attack and call it a day for this subclass,because Tasha's Otherworldly Guise provides that on top of having Shillelagh's function built into it, so I went with the move of removing the concentration from Elemental Weapon by spending sorcery points on it, so it can benefit from the elemental affinity feature more often,be viable at all levels and combined with other concentration spells.
I didnt change the Dragon wings because theyre already pretty good.
I removed the concentration from Draconic Presence to make it actually function like a Paladin's aura.
What do you think of this version?
Edits:
Removed Fly as it didnt sit right with me to add an existing Sorcerer spell to the list, added Mordenkainen's Faithful Hound in its place, which kinda makes it a little rangery and adds a bit more survivabilty.
I really like the Draconic Bloodline Sorcerer but it lags behind to the other subclass because its an older PHB subclass, I believe it has good potential at being the Gish subclass of Sorcerer. I've seen other do similar things, but what i think it really needs over the other additions I wrote, is an additional spells list.
Dragon Ancestor
At 1st level, you choose one type of dragon as your ancestor. You know the Dragon's Ire (Hellish Rebuke) spell, the damage type dealt is associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Ancestry
Dragon Color
Damage Type
Black
Acid
Blue
Lightning
Brass
Fire
Bronze
Lightning
Copper
Acid
Gold
Fire
Green
Poison
Red
Fire
Silver
Cold
White
Amethyst
Crystal
Emerald
Sapphire
Topaz
Cold
Force
Radiant
Psychic
Thunder
Necrotic
You can speak, read, and write Draconic. Additionally, whenever you make a Charisma check when interacting with dragons, your proficiency bonus is doubled if it applies to the check.
Draconic Resilience
As magic flows through your body, it causes physical traits of your dragon ancestors to emerge. At 1st level, your hit point maximum increases by 1 and increases by 1 again whenever you gain a level in this class.Additionally, parts of your skin are covered by a thin sheen of dragon-like scales. When you aren't wearing armor, your AC equals 13 + your Dexterity modifier. You gain resistance to the damage type associated with your draconic ancestry at 6th level if you don't have it already.
You know the Primal Savagery cantrip
, the damage type dealt is associated with your dragon ancestor.Draconic Magic
You learn additional spells when you reach certain levels in this class, as shown on the Draconic Spells table. Each spell counts as a sorcerer spell for you, but it doesn’t count against the number of sorcerer spells you know. These spells can’t be replaced when you gain a level in this class.
Whenever you gain a sorcerer level, you can replace one spell you gained from this feature with another spell of the same level. The new spell must be a conjuration or a transmutation spell from the sorcerer, warlock, or wizard spell list, or have the damage type associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Spells (any source)
Sorcerer Level
Spells
1st
Hellish Rebuke, Longstrider, Primal Savagery
3rd
Dragon's Breath, Ray of Enfeeblement
5th
Elemental Weapon, Glyph of Warding
7th
Elemental Bane, Summon Elemental
9th
Destructive Wave, Summon Draconic Spirit (UA)
Option 1 ^
Draconic Spells
Sorcerer Level
Spells
1st
Longstrider,
Primal SavageryDragon's Ire3rd
Dragon's Breath
5th
Elemental Weapon, Glyph of Warding
7th
Elemental Bane
9th
Summon Draconic Spirit (UA)
11th
Tasha's Otherworldly Guise
13th
Prismatic Spray
15th
Illusory Dragon
17th
Prismatic Wall
Option 2 ^
Elemental Affinity
Starting at 6th level, when you cast a spell that deals damage of the type associated with your draconic ancestry, add your Charisma modifier to that damage.
You can make an addtional melee or melee spell attack cantrip only when it deals damage of the type associated with your draconic ancestry.If you cast Primal Savagery or Attack as an action, then you may cast Primal Savagery as a Bonus Action(metamagic cannot be used during the bonus action) in the same turn.
Dragon Wings
At 14th level, you gain the ability to sprout a pair of dragon wings from your back, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create these wings as a bonus action on your turn. They last until you dismiss them as a bonus action on your turn. You can't manifest your wings while wearing armor unless the armor is made to accommodate them, and clothing not made to accommodate your wings might be destroyed when you manifest them.
Draconic Presence
Beginning at 18th level, you can channel the dread presence of your dragon ancestor, causing those around you to become awestruck or frightened. As an action, you can spend 5 sorcery points to draw on this power and exude an aura of awe or fear (your choice) to a distance of 60 feet. For 1 minute or until you lose
your concentration (as if you were casting a concentration spell)consciousness, each hostile creature that starts its turn in this aura must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed (if you chose awe) or frightened (if you chose fear) until the aura ends. A creature that succeeds on this saving throw is immune to your aura for 24 hours.Edits
Interesting. I don't have any advice for balancing (But you should be careful), but rather, a small note: There has been a new Draconic Options UA, which revises the Dragonborn and Kobold races. One of the bigger changes is the addition of the gem dragon ancestries. Perhaps you could add them to the subclass? Another large change is the ability to use a breath weapon in place of an attack. Maybe this subclass could do with an extra attack?
You have point I should add the gem dragon ancestries., because it does seem like something that would be added to a Revised version of the subclass. I did add a conditional extra attack and I worded it in away that its supposed trigger with an Elemental infused weapon,attack from the Elemental Weapon spell and/or
Primal SavageryDragon's Ire cantrip.All of the spells from the Draconic Options UA are sorcerer spells. No need to add them to the additional spell list.
I agree but its also very on theme for the subclass,besides adding it without counting towards spells known is quite useful,If somebody were allowed to use this by their DM but didnt want the UA they can just leave it.
This is already better than most of the other Sorcerer subclasses........and makes a fine Gish as well.
Thank you, I tried to make it work as both a Gish and Blaster,but I really hope the choices and tweaks I made are balanced well enough and not game breaking.
It'll probably come as no surprise that I agree with a lot of these changes 😉
A few quick points though:
The addition to Elemental Affinity probably needs clarified; it doesn't really specify when you get the extra attack/cantrip. For example, if you intend it to be like a Bladesinger's Extra Attack feature, then that would be something like "You can attack twice, instead of once, whenever you take the Attack action on your turn. In addition, you can cast a cantrip dealing damage of your dragon ancestor's type in place of one of these attacks", and probably might as well be under it's own Extra Attack feature.
Otherwise you could do something similar to what I did and make it a Bonus Action when you trigger Elemental Affinity? In my case I opted to make it one sorcery point, because sorcerers can already do basically this (attack or cantrip as an action, quicken a spell as a bonus action) for two points. It depends which form you're going for; attack after cast gives paladin-like nova damage so should have a similar resource cost (for short term damage), whereas Bladesinger style gives long-term melee potential. Unless maybe I've misunderstood how this feature works (maybe it's intended as a double cast of a melee cantrip)?
Making Draconic Presence a non-concentration effect definitely makes it a lot more useful as a feature!
Characters: Bullette, Chortle, Dracarys Noir, Edward Merryspell, Habard Ashery, Legion, Peregrine
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Guides: Creating Sub-Races Using Trait Options
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Yeah I wasnt sure if it was required to do the 10 spells over 5 spell levels, but alot of the elemental and dragony stuff are higher levels so I just went with the staggred long term additional spells.
Its a modded primal savegery cantrip that does damage associated with the dragon ancestor.
Yeah idk if giving away free resistence is broken but I think it works since some races come with extra resistance.
I tried to word it in a way that it can be a double cast of the primal savagery(up to three attacks with quicken) and two attacks with an elemental infused weapon attack or elemental weapon spell(up tp three attacks with extra attack from another source) or a combo of both, I kinda wanted this feature to interact with Extra attack(giving up to three to four attacks, if multiclassed fighter) with it, like I want to that to work but that might trully be broken,IDK....
Where it could get exploitative is when you add it onto a racial bonus; for example, one of the reasons I've been homebrewing changes to the draconic ancestry class myself is because what I really want to play is a dragonborn whose ancestor is a black shadow dragon, so black chromatic dragonborn for the race gives me acid resistance, then I'd take topaz as the sorcerer ancestry for the necrotic element. Under the current style rule I would only have acid resistance until 6th level sorcerer, after which I can spend a sorcery point to gain necrotic resistance for an hour (which kind of mirrors the superior acid immunity and necrotic resistance of an actual black shadow dragon).
With resistance from both though I could have two different resistances from 1st level which is probably a bit much. I think full resistance is fine as a feature, but maybe it should be delayed to 6th level as part of Elemental Affinity?
Ah yeah, too many cantrips per turn too easily can be OP, since cantrip damage scales by character level, and we can already bonus action cantrip with quicken for two per turn unlike other casters. Are you picturing this as a feature specifically for primal savagery/dragon's ire? It might make sense just to make it something like:
So this gives you two uses of primal savagery as standard, or extra attack + primal savagery if you get it. If you get your extra attack from Fighter then you still have Action Surge for three uses of primal surgery in a turn once per short rest, or four attacks, plus one savagery, or two of each.
That way it's basically just a free version of quicken because it only applies to a specific cantrip, and only after a certain trigger; so you're gaining the ability to do more sustained melee damage than a sorcerer can normally do, but spending points to quicken isn't made redundant because it can still be used for ranged damage, and be combined with close range spells (Burning Hands + fire savagery, or Blight + necrotic savagery etc.).
Characters: Bullette, Chortle, Dracarys Noir, Edward Merryspell, Habard Ashery, Legion, Peregrine
My Homebrew: Feats | Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Races
Guides: Creating Sub-Races Using Trait Options
WIP (feedback needed): Blood Mage, Chromatic Sorcerers, Summoner, Trickster Domain, Unlucky, Way of the Daoist (Drunken Master), Weapon Smith
Please don't reply to my posts unless you've read what they actually say.
Y'know what you've got a point! I'm going to edit it to have the suggestions you provided.
I just reailzed with the new edits added, the Revised Draconic Sorcerer is functionally a monk now.
I mean not really, there's a lot of other stuff Monks can do. 😝
That said, I just realised I hadn't considered Twinned Spell at all with this feature, and I have the same issue with the bonus action attack on my own take on the sub-class, and it's quite an OP loophole. On mine it allows up to three high damage melee attacks in a single turn, while yours could allow up to four uses of primal savagery (bonus action then twin twice). Granted half of those need to go for a different target but it's still very powerful considering fighters can only attack four times once per short rest at the same level, and they're only doing regular old martial weapon damage which doesn't scale up (or have elemental damage) as cantrips do.
In my case I'm fixing it by having the ability to attack after casting count as an extra metamagic option, this way it can't be stacked (due to the one per spell limit). For your twin savagery version it might be easier to just say metamagic options can't be used at the same time?
Can't believe I forgot about Twinned Spell, as it's key to balancing sorcerer changes! Since your feature is essentially (in the double savagery use of it) twinned spell for a specific cantrip it shouldn't stack, as the big bonus is that it costs nothing but a bonus action so you can do it as much as you want.
Characters: Bullette, Chortle, Dracarys Noir, Edward Merryspell, Habard Ashery, Legion, Peregrine
My Homebrew: Feats | Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Races
Guides: Creating Sub-Races Using Trait Options
WIP (feedback needed): Blood Mage, Chromatic Sorcerers, Summoner, Trickster Domain, Unlucky, Way of the Daoist (Drunken Master), Weapon Smith
Please don't reply to my posts unless you've read what they actually say.
That makes sense, Im gonna do that.
Simple quick fix to run past your DM for any campaign:
At level one you learn the Chromatic Orb spell which doesn't count against the number of known spells you have. You can cast this spell without using any material or somatic components if the element chosen matches your ancestry.
Optional: Also if you cast this spell matching your ancestry you can also cast without expending a spell slot a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus, and you regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest (Ala Star Druid & Guiding Bolt).
Nothing new, all official material and not OP, whilst letting you flavour your draconic sorcerer to you element, not matter your chosen play style (Even Melee/spellsword).
I kinda wanna do something similar to that but to Elemental Weapon instead, where if you cast this spell with the element that matches your ancestry, you can use it without concentration either once per long rest or like your suggestion a number of times equal to either Proficiency or Charisma bonus.
That might be too much with my revised version, it might work better if it was one that followed Homebrew rules.
If you want to make a Gish sub-class, make a gish sub class rather than tinker the the Draconic (Genuinely, its lacking for the sorc), elemental weapon is of no use to other play styles. Same with the primal savagery really. I am tired though so might be mis-reading.
Post fifth level extra spells hasn't been done for anything re extra spells, so probably balancing issues there. I threw the Cromo Orb thing as something you can ask of any DM as it just adds flavour, with a small boast overall, nothing new to worry about.
Watch out for the Force damage thing, has huge OP potential.
Why not both? Draconic Sorcerer has great gish qualities but like I said it lags behind to the newer Sorcerer Subclasses and that includes its lack of additional spells known.
You answered the question by that statement,Only this subclass could benifit from Elemental Weapon, and primal savegery thamatically works very well.
Yeah I've already been working on a new additional spell list after seeing Haravikk's by the books version of updated Draconic Sorcerer
I made a by the books Homebrew version that uses Basic Rules and Elemental Evil Player's Companion only inspired by Haravikk's version, I mainly focused on gishyfying the subclass with spell choices and minor edits to accomodate that.
I call this version of Draconic Sorcerer the Drac Knight.
Dragon Ancestor
At 1st level, you choose one type of dragon as your ancestor. You know the Hellish Rebuke spell, the damage type dealt is associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Ancestry
Dragon Color
Damage Type
Black
Acid
Blue
Lightning
Brass
Fire
Bronze
Lightning
Copper
Acid
Gold
Fire
Green
Poison
Red
Fire
Silver
Cold
White
Amethyst
Crystal
Emerald
Sapphire
Topaz
Cold
Force
Radiant
Psychic
Thunder
Necrotic
You can speak, read, and write Draconic. Additionally, whenever you make a Charisma check when interacting with dragons, your proficiency bonus is doubled if it applies to the check.
Draconic Resilience
As magic flows through your body, it causes physical traits of your dragon ancestors to emerge. At 1st level, your hit point maximum increases by 1 and increases by 1 again whenever you gain a level in this class.Additionally, parts of your skin are covered by a thin sheen of dragon-like scales. When you aren't wearing armor, your AC equals 13 + your Dexterity modifier. You gain resistance to the damage type associated with your draconic ancestry at 6th level if you don't have it already.
Draconic Magic
You learn additional spells when you reach certain levels in this class, as shown on the Draconic Spells table. Each spell counts as a sorcerer spell for you, but it doesn’t count against the number of sorcerer spells you know. These spells can’t be replaced when you gain a level in this class.
Whenever you gain a sorcerer level, you can replace one spell you gained from this feature with another spell of the same level. The new spell must be a conjuration or a transmutation spell from the sorcerer, warlock, or wizard spell list, or have the damage type associated with your dragon ancestor.
Draconic Spells
Sorcerer Level
Spells
1st
Hellish Rebuke, Longstrider , Shillelagh
3rd
Command, Ray of Enfeeblement
5th
Elemental Weapon, Glyph of Warding
7th
Elemental Bane, Mordenkainen's Faithful Hound
9th
Conjure Elemental, Conjure Volley
Elemental Affinity
Starting at 6th level, when you cast a spell that deals damage of the type associated with your draconic ancestry, add your Charisma modifier to that damage. Additionally when you cast Elemental Weapon at a 3rd level spell slot you can spend 3 sorcery points to use it without concentration, at 5th or 6th level spell slots you spend 5 sorcery points, at a 7th level spell slot you spend 7 sorcery points .
Dragon Wings
At 14th level, you gain the ability to sprout a pair of dragon wings from your back, gaining a flying speed equal to your current speed. You can create these wings as a bonus action on your turn. They last until you dismiss them as a bonus action on your turn. You can't manifest your wings while wearing armor unless the armor is made to accommodate them, and clothing not made to accommodate your wings might be destroyed when you manifest them.
Draconic Presence
Beginning at 18th level, you can channel the dread presence of your dragon ancestor, causing those around you to become awestruck or frightened. As an action, you can spend 5 sorcery points to draw on this power and exude an aura of awe or fear (your choice) to a distance of 60 feet. For 1 minute or until you lose consciousness, each hostile creature that starts its turn in this aura must succeed on a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed (if you chose awe) or frightened (if you chose fear) until the aura ends. A creature that succeeds on this saving throw is immune to your aura for 24 hours.
Notes
Luckily I managed to keep most of the elemental based spell choices I had, including Longstrider which is a very useful spell. I reflavored Hellish Rebuke in the same manner I did Primal Savagery, because its a reaction, it doesnt require concentration,its quite Gish oriented, I found it thematically appropriate and I like it. I added Shillelagh because it gets the gish ball rolling from the begninng and to not force the player to pick up a weapon proficiency for a D8 weapon. You can still multiclass or pick a race with the exact weapon proficiency you want, this is there for the players with no weapon proficiencies. Command and Fly felt like cool foreshadowing spells for the later features of the subclass. I was torn between Destructive Wave and Conjure Volley for the 5th level spell, as Destructive Wave evoked that dragon strangth that stems from the bloodline but it doesnt allow for elemental picking and didnt thematically match a weapon wielding Sorcerer as Conjure Volley which doesnt have a specific damage type.
Made the elemental resistance be part of Draconic Resilience and free since I added a diffrent feature to spend sorcery points on. I didnt want to outright just give Extra attack and call it a day for this subclass,because Tasha's Otherworldly Guise provides that on top of having Shillelagh's function built into it, so I went with the move of removing the concentration from Elemental Weapon by spending sorcery points on it, so it can benefit from the elemental affinity feature more often,be viable at all levels and combined with other concentration spells.
I didnt change the Dragon wings because theyre already pretty good.
I removed the concentration from Draconic Presence to make it actually function like a Paladin's aura.
What do you think of this version?