So, I need help on min-maxing this Hexblade Character concept without loosing it's theme. It is a mediocre warrior who found a cursed weapon and made a deal selling his soul to be really powerfull. This makes him almost like a villain or an anti-hero character. In other words, I have a concept I'm bound to, with some none negotiable variables, but want to min-max its potential in all the other variables. So, first of all, the concept:
Theme:
A dark, violent, cursed, mysterious, intimidating warrior that is deadly and frightening. On the battlefield, he apears next to his enemy (victim/prey) and sudenly is engolfed in an impenetrable darkness. Screams of deispair, horrible and agonizing sounds of flesh being cut and torn apart are heard outside of the darkness, followed by a complete silence. When the darkness fades, the victim's body lay on the floor, torn and mutilated, with parts of the body separated from the rest and terror in its eyes. Standing beside it, alone, is the Abyss Warrior, bathed in the blood of its victim that is also driping from his blackened metal Greatsword.
How does it work Mechanicaly:
The idea is to create a Half-Drow Hexblade melee warrior using Elven Accuracy and Darkness+Devil's Sight, combined with Great Weapon Mastery. Elven Accuracy's triple advantage + hexblade's crit on 19-20 would fish for crits to use Eldritch Smite. So the whole turn narrated above would go something like this, mechanicaly:
(assuming the enemy is already Cursed by us) - Relentless Hex (to teleport to the enemy) > Uncover Pendant/Object for Darkness (this will be explained later on) > Atack with Elven Accuracy + GWM (using Eldritch Smite on crits) > Cover Pendant/Object to fade Darkness (this will be explained later on).
None Negotiable Characteristics:
- Needs to be Greatsword wielder (no glaive, even if it is better min max wise)
- Needs to use darkness/devil's sight (even if there are other ways to get advantage. And no, it won't hinder the rest of the group - see below -)
- Needs to have high burst melee oriented dmg. Highest possible.
- Can`t be based or reliant in ranged/caster dmg. This is a melee concept. The less caster/ranged stuff, the better.
- Can't multiclass in anything but fighter. No rogue, barbarian, bard, etc. It just doesn`t fit the story of this one.
Negotiable Characteristics:
- Doesn't need to be crti based if it has high burst dmg, specially if the possible dmg from the non crit concept surpasses this one.
- It's not resricted to Hexblade main, it can have only a dip in Hexblade if the theme stays the same and the outcome dmg is higher.
- Doesn`t need to be BM Fighter, can be any other (samurai?) if it does more dmg. I thought of BM because of the cool maneuvers and the sup dices realy being good on crits.
Ok, so that's the idea. Having a drow greatsword wielder using darkness + devil's sight in melee for triple advantage crit fishing build. The darkness would not be a pain for the rest of the party because it would be casted in a pendant or object held by our character. He will keep it covered by his clothes and uncover it in the begining of his turn, do his thing, and cover it again at the end of his turn.
What do I need help with:
I am going for a burst crit-fishing build with Greatsword+GWM+Elven Acc+EldSmite. The questions are:
- In a min/maxing perspective do I get more value from multiclassing fighter (BM) for action surge and sup dice (more dices for crit)?
- If yes, do I get more value just dipping the 3 lvls for action surge and sup dice (Lock 17 Fighter 3) or do I go fighter all the way (Warlock 5 Fighter 15)?
The reason I ask this is I don't know if I get more value (min/max dmg wise) from a crit fishing build having more atacks and more/higher sup dices from BM, which would also give me more ASIs from 15 lvls of Fighter. Or if I get more value from going more indepth in Warlock and getting Lifedrinker and higher spellslots for EldSmite. So, for me, it seems like a matter between less atacks (only 2 if I go pure Lock, 4 if I dip 3lvls of Fighter with Action Surge) with more riders V.S. more atacks (3 normal, 6 with action surge) with less riders. Which one does more dmg in a crit fishing build?
Besides that, is there any input to my concept (keeping the unchangable variables intact) that would make it work better? Thank you in advance for any help :)
Public Mod Note
(MellieDM):
Merged duplicate threads.
If you're applying Hexblade's Curse (a non-spell), and casting Darkness, that only leaves one spell slot for Smiting until you get your third spell slot at level 11 - or unless you multiclass as an Edlritch Knight (given your non-negotiable limitation, above).
If you're applying Hexblade's Curse (a non-spell), and casting Darkness, that only leaves one spell slot for Smiting until you get your third spell slot at level 11 - or unless you multiclass as an Edlritch Knight (given your non-negotiable limitation, above).
Half-Drow has one use of Darkness for free per long rest. So at level 10 I could smite using a 5th lvl spell twice. At level 11, three times. That is 6d8 of dmg per smite, but will use only in crits, so 12d8.
"Dark Elf Magic. You know the dancing lights cantrip and can cast it at will. Starting from 3rd level, you can cast the faerie fire spell once. Starting from 5th level, you can cast the darkness spell once. Charisma is your spellcasting ability for these spells. You regain expended uses of this trait when you complete a long rest."
The pendant covering/uncovering would be up to DM discretion. And with how you have it detailed... as a DM, it would not be reasonable to have the darkness there cause you to have advantage unless you are specifically moving around after unleashing your pendant of darkness and with rolling stealth to try and hide where you move to.
otherwise you’re essentially trying to use it like you’re exploiting object permanence and playing peekaboo with a baby. So that would be a hell of a hard sell on anything with an int >5
But general rule of thumb. More attacks “typically” is more damage. And in a “crit fishing” more attacks = more odds of crits.
The pendant covering/uncovering would be up to DM discretion. And with how you have it detailed... as a DM, it would not be reasonable to have the darkness there cause you to have advantage unless you are specifically moving around after unleashing your pendant of darkness and with rolling stealth to try and hide where you move to.
otherwise you’re essentially trying to use it like you’re exploiting object permanence and playing peekaboo with a baby. So that would be a hell of a hard sell on anything with an int >5
Darkness:
"Magical darkness spreads from a point you choose within range to fill a 15-foot-radius sphere for the duration. The darkness spreads around corners. A creature with darkvision can't see through this darkness, and nonmagical light can't illuminate it.
If the point you choose is on an object you are holding or one that isn't being worn or carried, the darkness emanates from the object and moves with it. Completely covering the source of the darkness with an opaque object, such as a bowl or a helm, blocks the darkness.
If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled."
I mean, I'm not even reaching here. I hardly think it would be seen as an exploit since I am using it 100% as it's worded on the spell text. About the "only on stupid enemies" argument, I don't see it that way. The fact is that you, being my foe, might see me moving my hands around my chest and sudenly everything goes dark, you can't see shit. When the dark goes out I am there, you understand that I am doing something to make the darkness apear but you can't do shit about it cause you are blind. You can be the smartest dude outhere, if you can not see in magical darkness, it makes no diference. You would still have disatvantage cause you are 100% blind and I am not.
Let us put it this way. Me and you are in a room. I am next to the light switch, wearing a night-vision goggle. I have a knife in my hand. I turn off the lights. You are not wearing night-vision goggles. The room goes completel dark. You saw that i turned off the light. You understand what happened even, but this will not stop you from getting fked up cause you are blind in the dark and I can see, and I have a knife. It is hardly a matter of inteligence, but the sheer fact that the victims (if they dont have a way to see/feel through magic darkness) are in disatvantage.
And in this example I am even considering you are completely aware of how a light switch works and you even see me turning it off. In the case of my character this would't be that obvious, specially cause I would roleplay him doing it discretely.
Maybe a slight of hand roll to spice things up to make sure no one on the battlefield saw me playing with the pendant/object?
The pendant covering/uncovering would be up to DM discretion. And with how you have it detailed... as a DM, it would not be reasonable to have the darkness there cause you to have advantage unless you are specifically moving around after unleashing your pendant of darkness and with rolling stealth to try and hide where you move to.
otherwise you’re essentially trying to use it like you’re exploiting object permanence and playing peekaboo with a baby. So that would be a hell of a hard sell on anything with an int >5
Darkness:
"Magical darkness spreads from a point you choose within range to fill a 15-foot-radius sphere for the duration. The darkness spreads around corners. A creature with darkvision can't see through this darkness, and nonmagical light can't illuminate it.
If the point you choose is on an object you are holding or one that isn't being worn or carried, the darkness emanates from the object and moves with it. Completely covering the source of the darkness with an opaque object, such as a bowl or a helm, blocks the darkness.
If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled."
I mean, I'm not even reaching here. I hardly think it would be seen as an exploit since I am using it 100% as it's worded on the spell text. About the "only on stupid enemies" argument, I don't see it that way. The fact is that you, being my foe, might see me moving my hands around my chest and sudenly everything goes dark, you can't see shit. When the dark goes out I am there, you understand that I am doing something to make the darkness apear but you can't do shit about it cause you are blind. You can be the smartest dude outhere, if you can not see in magical darkness, it makes no diference. You would still have disatvantage cause you are 100% blind and I am not.
Let us put it this way. Me and you are in a room. I am next to the light switch, wearing a night-vision goggle. I have a knife in my hand. I turn off the lights. You are not wearing night-vision goggles. The room goes completel dark. You saw that i turned off the light. You understand what happened even, but this will not stop you from getting fked up cause you are blind in the dark and I can see, and I have a knife. It is hardly a matter of inteligence, but the sheer fact that the victims (if they dont have a way to see/feel through magic darkness) are in disatvantage.
And in this example I am even considering you are completely aware of how a light switch works and you even see me turning it off. In the case of my character this would't be that obvious, specially cause I would roleplay him doing it discretely.
Maybe a slight of hand roll to spice things up to make sure no one on the battlefield saw me playing with the pendant/object?
Blind.
not deaf. Not stupid. If you are literally right in front of me. You would make sounds of movement, or lack there of.
are you wearing armor? Armor makes sounds when you move in it.
are you using a heavy weapon? A light weapon? A weapon with a chain? A weapon that causes wind when you swing it since it’s slashing/bludgeoning.
the loss of 1 sense doesn’t effect the other 4.
also...you have the misconception when you say “blinded” darkness doesn’t cause blindness. There’s a mechanical difference between the 2. And they are separated out exactly because of that mechanical difference.
Sure you still have advantage because they can’t see you. But that is different than the “blinded” condition.
unless you secure yourself a Knaves eyepatch at some point. Or your campaign takes entirely place underground or at night time. Eventually your sunlight sensitivity can become a problem.
just a cloak wouldn’t cover and cancel the darkness effect. As a cloak isn’t an object that is opaque enough like the helm or bowl examples it uses.
you can see light through a cloak if you take a candle or flashlight or other light source and hold on one side vs the other. This can vary based on thread count. But I doubt they have sophisticated enough looms making the cloaks that have a thread count great enough to block out the light.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Blank
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Hi, fellows!
So, I need help on min-maxing this Hexblade Character concept without loosing it's theme. It is a mediocre warrior who found a cursed weapon and made a deal selling his soul to be really powerfull. This makes him almost like a villain or an anti-hero character. In other words, I have a concept I'm bound to, with some none negotiable variables, but want to min-max its potential in all the other variables. So, first of all, the concept:
Theme:
A dark, violent, cursed, mysterious, intimidating warrior that is deadly and frightening. On the battlefield, he apears next to his enemy (victim/prey) and sudenly is engolfed in an impenetrable darkness. Screams of deispair, horrible and agonizing sounds of flesh being cut and torn apart are heard outside of the darkness, followed by a complete silence. When the darkness fades, the victim's body lay on the floor, torn and mutilated, with parts of the body separated from the rest and terror in its eyes. Standing beside it, alone, is the Abyss Warrior, bathed in the blood of its victim that is also driping from his blackened metal Greatsword.
How does it work Mechanicaly:
The idea is to create a Half-Drow Hexblade melee warrior using Elven Accuracy and Darkness+Devil's Sight, combined with Great Weapon Mastery. Elven Accuracy's triple advantage + hexblade's crit on 19-20 would fish for crits to use Eldritch Smite. So the whole turn narrated above would go something like this, mechanicaly:
(assuming the enemy is already Cursed by us) - Relentless Hex (to teleport to the enemy) > Uncover Pendant/Object for Darkness (this will be explained later on) > Atack with Elven Accuracy + GWM (using Eldritch Smite on crits) > Cover Pendant/Object to fade Darkness (this will be explained later on).
None Negotiable Characteristics:
- Needs to be Greatsword wielder (no glaive, even if it is better min max wise)
- Needs to use darkness/devil's sight (even if there are other ways to get advantage. And no, it won't hinder the rest of the group - see below -)
- Needs to have high burst melee oriented dmg. Highest possible.
- Can`t be based or reliant in ranged/caster dmg. This is a melee concept. The less caster/ranged stuff, the better.
- Can't multiclass in anything but fighter. No rogue, barbarian, bard, etc. It just doesn`t fit the story of this one.
Negotiable Characteristics:
- Doesn't need to be crti based if it has high burst dmg, specially if the possible dmg from the non crit concept surpasses this one.
- It's not resricted to Hexblade main, it can have only a dip in Hexblade if the theme stays the same and the outcome dmg is higher.
- Doesn`t need to be BM Fighter, can be any other (samurai?) if it does more dmg. I thought of BM because of the cool maneuvers and the sup dices realy being good on crits.
Ok, so that's the idea. Having a drow greatsword wielder using darkness + devil's sight in melee for triple advantage crit fishing build. The darkness would not be a pain for the rest of the party because it would be casted in a pendant or object held by our character. He will keep it covered by his clothes and uncover it in the begining of his turn, do his thing, and cover it again at the end of his turn.
What do I need help with:
I am going for a burst crit-fishing build with Greatsword+GWM+Elven Acc+EldSmite. The questions are:
- In a min/maxing perspective do I get more value from multiclassing fighter (BM) for action surge and sup dice (more dices for crit)?
- If yes, do I get more value just dipping the 3 lvls for action surge and sup dice (Lock 17 Fighter 3) or do I go fighter all the way (Warlock 5 Fighter 15)?
The reason I ask this is I don't know if I get more value (min/max dmg wise) from a crit fishing build having more atacks and more/higher sup dices from BM, which would also give me more ASIs from 15 lvls of Fighter. Or if I get more value from going more indepth in Warlock and getting Lifedrinker and higher spellslots for EldSmite. So, for me, it seems like a matter between less atacks (only 2 if I go pure Lock, 4 if I dip 3lvls of Fighter with Action Surge) with more riders V.S. more atacks (3 normal, 6 with action surge) with less riders. Which one does more dmg in a crit fishing build?
Besides that, is there any input to my concept (keeping the unchangable variables intact) that would make it work better? Thank you in advance for any help :)
If you're applying Hexblade's Curse (a non-spell), and casting Darkness, that only leaves one spell slot for Smiting until you get your third spell slot at level 11 - or unless you multiclass as an Edlritch Knight (given your non-negotiable limitation, above).
Half-Drow has one use of Darkness for free per long rest. So at level 10 I could smite using a 5th lvl spell twice. At level 11, three times. That is 6d8 of dmg per smite, but will use only in crits, so 12d8.
"Dark Elf Magic. You know the dancing lights cantrip and can cast it at will. Starting from 3rd level, you can cast the faerie fire spell once. Starting from 5th level, you can cast the darkness spell once. Charisma is your spellcasting ability for these spells. You regain expended uses of this trait when you complete a long rest."
Ah, right. I haven't played the new half-elf types yet. That'll work once per long rest.
But besides that, any input on the "multiclass or not" thingy?
Also if yes to MC, how?
But general rule of thumb. More attacks “typically” is more damage. And in a “crit fishing” more attacks = more odds of crits.
Blank
Quote from EightPackKilla >>
Darkness:
"Magical darkness spreads from a point you choose within range to fill a 15-foot-radius sphere for the duration. The darkness spreads around corners. A creature with darkvision can't see through this darkness, and nonmagical light can't illuminate it.
If the point you choose is on an object you are holding or one that isn't being worn or carried, the darkness emanates from the object and moves with it. Completely covering the source of the darkness with an opaque object, such as a bowl or a helm, blocks the darkness.
If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled."
I mean, I'm not even reaching here. I hardly think it would be seen as an exploit since I am using it 100% as it's worded on the spell text. About the "only on stupid enemies" argument, I don't see it that way. The fact is that you, being my foe, might see me moving my hands around my chest and sudenly everything goes dark, you can't see shit. When the dark goes out I am there, you understand that I am doing something to make the darkness apear but you can't do shit about it cause you are blind. You can be the smartest dude outhere, if you can not see in magical darkness, it makes no diference. You would still have disatvantage cause you are 100% blind and I am not.
Let us put it this way. Me and you are in a room. I am next to the light switch, wearing a night-vision goggle. I have a knife in my hand. I turn off the lights. You are not wearing night-vision goggles. The room goes completel dark. You saw that i turned off the light. You understand what happened even, but this will not stop you from getting fked up cause you are blind in the dark and I can see, and I have a knife. It is hardly a matter of inteligence, but the sheer fact that the victims (if they dont have a way to see/feel through magic darkness) are in disatvantage.
And in this example I am even considering you are completely aware of how a light switch works and you even see me turning it off. In the case of my character this would't be that obvious, specially cause I would roleplay him doing it discretely.
Maybe a slight of hand roll to spice things up to make sure no one on the battlefield saw me playing with the pendant/object?
Blind.
not deaf. Not stupid. If you are literally right in front of me. You would make sounds of movement, or lack there of.
are you wearing armor? Armor makes sounds when you move in it.
are you using a heavy weapon? A light weapon? A weapon with a chain? A weapon that causes wind when you swing it since it’s slashing/bludgeoning.
the loss of 1 sense doesn’t effect the other 4.
also...you have the misconception when you say “blinded” darkness doesn’t cause blindness. There’s a mechanical difference between the 2. And they are separated out exactly because of that mechanical difference.
Sure you still have advantage because they can’t see you. But that is different than the “blinded” condition.
Blank
That all said...
unless you secure yourself a Knaves eyepatch at some point. Or your campaign takes entirely place underground or at night time. Eventually your sunlight sensitivity can become a problem.
Blank
Another slight tweak.
just a cloak wouldn’t cover and cancel the darkness effect. As a cloak isn’t an object that is opaque enough like the helm or bowl examples it uses.
you can see light through a cloak if you take a candle or flashlight or other light source and hold on one side vs the other. This can vary based on thread count. But I doubt they have sophisticated enough looms making the cloaks that have a thread count great enough to block out the light.
Blank