Everyone loves conjure animals, but Giant Insect is far superior under the following very common criteria. 1) You're fighting enemies that don't have poison immunity or resistance and 2) Your DM chooses the conjured animals and doesn't always pick the most optimal beasts.
Beasts that have a poison attack do significantly more damage than those that don't. Ballparking the averages, cr 1/4 beasts without poison do around 7 damage on a hit compared to around 15 (probably 12 factoring in saves) for those with poison. By using Giant Insect, you can guarantee that you are getting beasts that output this higher class of damage. Not only that, but you can also guarantee that you get flying beasts (giant wasp) with 50 ft. flying speed or an attack that restrains the target (Giant spider) if either of those features are desirable.
Giant Centipedes have the highest damage potential since you can create 10 of them, each one doing 1d4+2 piercing and 3d6 poison [dc 11] damage. However, the poison does NOT do half damage on a save. So unless you're fighting something with a terrible con save, I think you're better off going with giant wasps which do get half damage on a save. According to my math, ~4.3 Con is the breaking point where the wasps do more poison damage. The wasps also have the flying speed and 13 HP compared to a paltry 4 for the centipedes, so they are all around fantastic.
Something else that is often overlooked is the role of initiative. When you cast conjure animals, you roll their initiative as a group. Often times there is a good chance that, at the very least, some enemies will go before your beasts can act. And when your beasts get placed right above you in initiative, there is practically an entire round where they do nothing. Giant Insects, on the other hand, share your turn. So not only does that guarantee that they will act immediately, it allows you to coordinate your actions with them. In play, I have seen centipedes and wasps straight up MELT enemies.
And lastly, if you are playing as a Circle of Spores druid, Giant Insect has some additional usage. The spore feature Fungal Infestation can be difficult to take advantage of due to the requirement of having your reaction as well as needing a small or medium beast or humanoid to die within 10 feet of you. There are two ways that Giant Insect can enable you to activate Fungal Infestation. First, when the poison damage brings a target to 0 HP, they don't die. They just go unconscious and are stable for 1 hour. So if they take down a valid target for Fungal Infestation, you can finish off the enemy after the fight and immediately bring them back as a zombie. You can even wait until after a short rest to do this, which is nice since zombies created in this way only last for 1 hour! But what about when you aren't fighting humanoids or beasts? If you cast Giant Insect on centipedes or wasps, they would qualify for Fungal Infestation if they die while the spell is ongoing. Turning these insects into giant creatures then turning them into zombie insects when they die is pretty damn cool IMO. I should point out that a picky DM might make a stink about the order of events. The bugs shrink back when they hit 0 HP. Fungal Infestation works when something dies. So your GM could say that they shrink before they die... I donno. Seems very ticky-tack, especially when you're just trying to get some use out of a class feature.
Giant Insect doesn't roll initiative, they go on your turn. Giant Wasps have higher dpr at a constitution save of +8 but not poison immune, and you probably want conjure animals in that case anyway.
Giant Centipedes: damage potential 45 physical, 0 poison, +105 poison on failed save. At +0 save 97.5, at +8 save, 55.5
Giant Spiders: damage potential 22.5 physical, 13.5 automatic poison, +13.5 poison on failed saves. At +0 save 42, at +8 save, 37.3
Giant Wasps: damage potential 27.5 physical, 26 poison, +26 poison on failed save. At +0 save 66.5, at +8 save, 56.1
Giant Scorpion: damage potential 20.5 physical, 11 poison, +11 poison on failed save. At +0 save 37.5, at +8 save 33.1
The only reason for using anything but giant centipedes is presence of area damage or need to attack aerial opponents (giant wasps can fly, giant spiders can restrain creatures).
Do these insects gain the benefits of a shepherd druid's subclass features? This spell says no M components, but says you transform insects. Does this have any mechanical requirements? Do you have to find those specific insects and transform them? does the DM decide what insects are in the area? Or do you just get to pick?
Giant Insect doesn't roll initiative, they go on your turn. Giant Wasps have higher dpr at a constitution save of +8 but not poison immune, and you probably want conjure animals in that case anyway.
Giant Centipedes: damage potential 45 physical, 0 poison, +105 poison on failed save. At +0 save 97.5, at +8 save, 55.5
Giant Spiders: damage potential 22.5 physical, 13.5 automatic poison, +13.5 poison on failed saves. At +0 save 42, at +8 save, 37.3
Giant Wasps: damage potential 27.5 physical, 26 poison, +26 poison on failed save. At +0 save 66.5, at +8 save, 56.1
Giant Scorpion: damage potential 20.5 physical, 11 poison, +11 poison on failed save. At +0 save 37.5, at +8 save 33.1
The only reason for using anything but giant centipedes is presence of area damage or need to attack aerial opponents (giant wasps can fly, giant spiders can restrain creatures).
Yea, those numbers look right (I was only looking at the break even point for the poison damage).
But I will say that the flight speed of the wasps is useful for more than attacking aerial opponents. In many cases you will fight things that can move quickly or teleport. Or they might need to cover a good distance to reach a different target. Being able to move 50 ft or dash 100 is very nice.
Do these insects gain the benefits of a shepherd druid's subclass features? This spell says no M components, but says you transform insects. Does this have any mechanical requirements? Do you have to find those specific insects and transform them? does the DM decide what insects are in the area? Or do you just get to pick?
No, these don't benefit from shepherd druid features (they aren't conjured, they are simply transformed). However, resistance to non-magical damage does not affect them a great deal due to their poison (or web effect for spiders). Obviously resistance to poison damage would hurt the spell.
It's best to not rely on hoping to have some insects nearby. You should actively seek out insects that you can use for the spell and build up a colony. It also helps to have a bunch of jars that you can put some in to throw as part of the spell. Something else to keep in mind is that the spell says "The GM might allow you to choose different targets. For example, if you transform a bee, its giant version might have the same statistics as a giant wasp."
Building up your insect colonies is IMO a pretty fun opportunity for some nice RP.
So, I see your point with this spell. It offers some advantages over conjure animals.
But it still brings some issues. If the DM is choosing animals for you, then they certainly still will be with this spell, just less directly. Your DM has to allow you to find these insects either in the battlefield itself or beforehand and keep them with you, which still requires finding them and also keeping them alive. It doesn't eliminate the DM fiat of choosing animals at all.
You could also in theory get any of theses creatures with conjure animals except the giant scorpion.
And again, if you took the subclass to buff your conjures you lose out on some stuff. If you didn't then conjures aren't always your best use of spell slots anyway. It is also a higher level slot. Overall, it is ok.
Sure, if your DM is being a hardass and blocking you from keeping insects, then the spell is less useful. But I consider that a different situation than your DM just running conjure animals RAW and choosing okay but not optimal beasts such as a panther or lizard. Blocking you from finding/keeping insects is more akin to them choosing the "or lower" option when you pick the number/CR. Technically, the DM could say you summon a bunch of flies with conjure animals.
Keep in mind that Locate Animals or Plants is a 2nd level ritual spell that you can use to find the nearest insect of your choice within 5 miles. For a druid, finding/befriending insects shouldn't be a very difficult task given a bit of down time with your ability to leverage speak with animals, animal friendship, enhance ability, etc.
I am not saying that it doesn't have advantages, just that they're relatively minor and come at an expense (you could be polymorphing or bringing fey with innate spellcasting (and choosing from a much smaller list of options where you can be much more certain of the creatures and number you'll get -- don't forget that the spell says "up to," probably, again, on DM discretion) or confusing your enemies, for example.
I don't think how many insects you transform is up to the DM. "Up to" is referencing that you don't need the full amount of insects in order to use the spell. If the insects are within range, then the spell says you can transform them according the the parameters of the spell. That's a different situation from conjure animals where you summon "X creatures of CR Y or lower" and the DM picks the creatures.
I'm not as much a fan of Conjure Woodland Beings. Most of those summons have niche abilities, and RAW you don't choose which one you get. Dryads are pretty nice in general for CR 1, but Quicklings are also CR 1 and there are a few other CR 1 fey that have been added from other sources that aren't quite as good. Conjure Woodland Beings just seems like rolling the dice.
Polymorph is a very strong spell, no argument there. I still think Giant Insect is competitive with it, and if you're a Spore druid it's really hard to beat for the interaction with Fungal Infestation.
3rd level spells are also very strong, so I don't find the 4th lvl vs 3rd lvl is a big deal aside from limited slots.
I don't think how many insects you transform is up to the DM. "Up to" is referencing that you don't need the full amount of insects in order to use the spell. If the insects are within range, then the spell says you can transform them according the the parameters of the spell.
Again, I will slightly disagree here. Who decides what and how many insects are in range?
If you don't prepare and just cast the spell just hoping that there are some insects around, then yea what you're talking about is more applicable. Spiders are so common that it's not hard to reasonably be able to have 3 around somewhere in most environments. Scorpions/wasps/centipedes are more of a stretch, but you could potentially substitute ants for centipedes or bees for wasps. Obviously that's subject to DM whim.
I prefer to treat Giant Insect like a spell with material components and take steps to procure/keep the insects. And my point was that if you have the insects available, there is nothing in the spell that allows the DM to limit how many you transform aside from the limits the spell states. But like any spell with material components, a DM can block you from acquiring the components if they want. IMO it's pretty bad DM'ing to just do that for no reason, but obviously some environments will be more difficult than others to find the insects.
Anyway, ultimately a reasonable DM playing things by the book is going to pick the animals you summon with conjure animals, sometimes giving you better ones, sometimes giving you worse ones. And IMO a reasonable DM playing by the book is probably going to let you spend a bit of time/resources to keep some insects around for the Giant Insect spell. IMO this gives a significant edge to Giant Insect, as the insects are reliably better than the average beast.
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Everyone loves conjure animals, but Giant Insect is far superior under the following very common criteria. 1) You're fighting enemies that don't have poison immunity or resistance and 2) Your DM chooses the conjured animals and doesn't always pick the most optimal beasts.
Beasts that have a poison attack do significantly more damage than those that don't. Ballparking the averages, cr 1/4 beasts without poison do around 7 damage on a hit compared to around 15 (probably 12 factoring in saves) for those with poison. By using Giant Insect, you can guarantee that you are getting beasts that output this higher class of damage. Not only that, but you can also guarantee that you get flying beasts (giant wasp) with 50 ft. flying speed or an attack that restrains the target (Giant spider) if either of those features are desirable.
Giant Centipedes have the highest damage potential since you can create 10 of them, each one doing 1d4+2 piercing and 3d6 poison [dc 11] damage. However, the poison does NOT do half damage on a save. So unless you're fighting something with a terrible con save, I think you're better off going with giant wasps which do get half damage on a save. According to my math, ~4.3 Con is the breaking point where the wasps do more poison damage. The wasps also have the flying speed and 13 HP compared to a paltry 4 for the centipedes, so they are all around fantastic.
Something else that is often overlooked is the role of initiative. When you cast conjure animals, you roll their initiative as a group. Often times there is a good chance that, at the very least, some enemies will go before your beasts can act. And when your beasts get placed right above you in initiative, there is practically an entire round where they do nothing. Giant Insects, on the other hand, share your turn. So not only does that guarantee that they will act immediately, it allows you to coordinate your actions with them. In play, I have seen centipedes and wasps straight up MELT enemies.
And lastly, if you are playing as a Circle of Spores druid, Giant Insect has some additional usage. The spore feature Fungal Infestation can be difficult to take advantage of due to the requirement of having your reaction as well as needing a small or medium beast or humanoid to die within 10 feet of you. There are two ways that Giant Insect can enable you to activate Fungal Infestation. First, when the poison damage brings a target to 0 HP, they don't die. They just go unconscious and are stable for 1 hour. So if they take down a valid target for Fungal Infestation, you can finish off the enemy after the fight and immediately bring them back as a zombie. You can even wait until after a short rest to do this, which is nice since zombies created in this way only last for 1 hour! But what about when you aren't fighting humanoids or beasts? If you cast Giant Insect on centipedes or wasps, they would qualify for Fungal Infestation if they die while the spell is ongoing. Turning these insects into giant creatures then turning them into zombie insects when they die is pretty damn cool IMO. I should point out that a picky DM might make a stink about the order of events. The bugs shrink back when they hit 0 HP. Fungal Infestation works when something dies. So your GM could say that they shrink before they die... I donno. Seems very ticky-tack, especially when you're just trying to get some use out of a class feature.
Giant Insect doesn't roll initiative, they go on your turn. Giant Wasps have higher dpr at a constitution save of +8 but not poison immune, and you probably want conjure animals in that case anyway.
The only reason for using anything but giant centipedes is presence of area damage or need to attack aerial opponents (giant wasps can fly, giant spiders can restrain creatures).
Do these insects gain the benefits of a shepherd druid's subclass features? This spell says no M components, but says you transform insects. Does this have any mechanical requirements? Do you have to find those specific insects and transform them? does the DM decide what insects are in the area? Or do you just get to pick?
Yea, those numbers look right (I was only looking at the break even point for the poison damage).
But I will say that the flight speed of the wasps is useful for more than attacking aerial opponents. In many cases you will fight things that can move quickly or teleport. Or they might need to cover a good distance to reach a different target. Being able to move 50 ft or dash 100 is very nice.
No, these don't benefit from shepherd druid features (they aren't conjured, they are simply transformed). However, resistance to non-magical damage does not affect them a great deal due to their poison (or web effect for spiders). Obviously resistance to poison damage would hurt the spell.
It's best to not rely on hoping to have some insects nearby. You should actively seek out insects that you can use for the spell and build up a colony. It also helps to have a bunch of jars that you can put some in to throw as part of the spell. Something else to keep in mind is that the spell says "The GM might allow you to choose different targets. For example, if you transform a bee, its giant version might have the same statistics as a giant wasp."
Building up your insect colonies is IMO a pretty fun opportunity for some nice RP.
So, I see your point with this spell. It offers some advantages over conjure animals.
But it still brings some issues. If the DM is choosing animals for you, then they certainly still will be with this spell, just less directly. Your DM has to allow you to find these insects either in the battlefield itself or beforehand and keep them with you, which still requires finding them and also keeping them alive. It doesn't eliminate the DM fiat of choosing animals at all.
You could also in theory get any of theses creatures with conjure animals except the giant scorpion.
And again, if you took the subclass to buff your conjures you lose out on some stuff. If you didn't then conjures aren't always your best use of spell slots anyway. It is also a higher level slot. Overall, it is ok.
Sure, if your DM is being a hardass and blocking you from keeping insects, then the spell is less useful. But I consider that a different situation than your DM just running conjure animals RAW and choosing okay but not optimal beasts such as a panther or lizard. Blocking you from finding/keeping insects is more akin to them choosing the "or lower" option when you pick the number/CR. Technically, the DM could say you summon a bunch of flies with conjure animals.
Keep in mind that Locate Animals or Plants is a 2nd level ritual spell that you can use to find the nearest insect of your choice within 5 miles. For a druid, finding/befriending insects shouldn't be a very difficult task given a bit of down time with your ability to leverage speak with animals, animal friendship, enhance ability, etc.
I am not saying that it doesn't have advantages, just that they're relatively minor and come at an expense (you could be polymorphing or bringing fey with innate spellcasting (and choosing from a much smaller list of options where you can be much more certain of the creatures and number you'll get -- don't forget that the spell says "up to," probably, again, on DM discretion) or confusing your enemies, for example.
I don't think how many insects you transform is up to the DM. "Up to" is referencing that you don't need the full amount of insects in order to use the spell. If the insects are within range, then the spell says you can transform them according the the parameters of the spell. That's a different situation from conjure animals where you summon "X creatures of CR Y or lower" and the DM picks the creatures.
I'm not as much a fan of Conjure Woodland Beings. Most of those summons have niche abilities, and RAW you don't choose which one you get. Dryads are pretty nice in general for CR 1, but Quicklings are also CR 1 and there are a few other CR 1 fey that have been added from other sources that aren't quite as good. Conjure Woodland Beings just seems like rolling the dice.
Polymorph is a very strong spell, no argument there. I still think Giant Insect is competitive with it, and if you're a Spore druid it's really hard to beat for the interaction with Fungal Infestation.
3rd level spells are also very strong, so I don't find the 4th lvl vs 3rd lvl is a big deal aside from limited slots.
Again, I will slightly disagree here. Who decides what and how many insects are in range?
If you don't prepare and just cast the spell just hoping that there are some insects around, then yea what you're talking about is more applicable. Spiders are so common that it's not hard to reasonably be able to have 3 around somewhere in most environments. Scorpions/wasps/centipedes are more of a stretch, but you could potentially substitute ants for centipedes or bees for wasps. Obviously that's subject to DM whim.
I prefer to treat Giant Insect like a spell with material components and take steps to procure/keep the insects. And my point was that if you have the insects available, there is nothing in the spell that allows the DM to limit how many you transform aside from the limits the spell states. But like any spell with material components, a DM can block you from acquiring the components if they want. IMO it's pretty bad DM'ing to just do that for no reason, but obviously some environments will be more difficult than others to find the insects.
Anyway, ultimately a reasonable DM playing things by the book is going to pick the animals you summon with conjure animals, sometimes giving you better ones, sometimes giving you worse ones. And IMO a reasonable DM playing by the book is probably going to let you spend a bit of time/resources to keep some insects around for the Giant Insect spell. IMO this gives a significant edge to Giant Insect, as the insects are reliably better than the average beast.