Alright, so I'm pretty new to DnD (roughly half a campaign). I thoroughly enjoy reading up on the classes and trying to find fun builds, but not necessarily broken or full on min/max. That doesn't mean I want them to be ineffective or potentially hamper the party though.
Anyway, I really like the idea of the Circle of Spores and the fact that the extra Symbiotic Entity damage applies to every weapon attack. Naturally, to me, that means trying to figure out ways to maximize that damage. I recognize that it could also play well into improving tank builds with some extra oomph too though. As such, I have two approaches to this, both of which are sort of slow burns.
Tanky Build
Playstyle:
Mainly looking to gain additional hit points via Symbiotic Entity and some boosts to overall damage. This is done by multiclassing 3 lvls into Barbarian and take Path of the Beast to use claws. This gets you an extra attack, while still being able to use a shield and get the resistance from rage. Could dump another two lvls in Barbarian for the actual Extra Attack (3 total per action). The Druid spellcasting basically becomes out of combat utility in this version, but additional lvls probably still need to go into Druid for the boost to Symbiotic Entity temporary hit points. The downside is that this is pretty clunky due to Symbiotic Entity taking an action. If you can get it off before combat starts, then it's not too big of a deal but otherwise you're basically losing your first turn.
Race options:
Tortle: This helps with the MADness a bit by reducing the need for Dex, due to Natural Armor. Basically going to have 19AC right off the bat, but not much opportunity to improve that outside of magic items.
Goliath: Additional damage reduction to help maintain Symbiotic Entity.
Damage Build
Playstyle:
We're looking for the most extra damage possible here. The initial thought is to multiclass into Ranger up to lvl 5 and take Hunter w/ Colossus Slayer. This gives a Fighting Style, some added spell utility, an additional 1d6 per attack when running Hunter's Mark, a pretty reliable extra 1d8 per turn, and an Extra Attack. Survivability becomes a bit of a concern though, as I'll likely want to either TWF w/ Dual Wield or GWM w/ a two-handed weapon. The other option would be to sacrifice a little damage and go with a reach weapon and use Polearm Master. Ultimately though, we'll need either a way to avoid opportunity attacks and move away after attacking or boost defense to avoid getting hit while staying on the front line. I think the best bet for this is through racial abilities below. Also, this one definitely takes a while to come together. Maybe a little too long to be honest. I'm thinking two lvls in Druid to start, then go 5 straight in Ranger, the pump Druid up after that. Symbiotic Entity becomes pretty fragile for a while in this case, but you could modify your tactics if/when it goes down and play more like a typical ranger. Could also be pretty MAD if going with anything but TWF.
Races:
Harengon: Racial abilities help with getting out of danger
Goliath: Again, damage reduction to help keep Symbiotic Entity up
Earth Genasi (MotM): Blade Ward cantrip as a BA helps with survivability
Goblin: Nimble Escape to get out of danger, but this basically has to be a TWF build
Shadar Kai (MotM): Fey Step to escape danger
Questions
Does thisconcept just generally take too long to come online?
Which version is more viable? The tanky version feels like it falls too much in the middle of trying to do two things to do either of them particularly well, but the damage version might be a little too squishy to work.
Other options to improve on each concept? I could see going with Fighter Echo Knight for the damage version to help stay out of direct danger and provide some extra range for the attacks, plus the flavor would be fun. Fighter Rune Knight might also work to boost the damage with Giant's Might and gain some additional utility. Could also see Warlock Hexblade playing into the concept. For the tanky build, Barbarian Path of the Ancestral Guardian might push it more towards the typical tank role and could offer flavor. Not sure what else would really work well here.
Is the necrotic damage from Symbiotic Entity at risk of being resisted/negated in a lot of campaigns? I'm sure there are some where it's worse than others, but overall is it a bad damage type?
Any other races with abilities that fit well into either playstyle that I'm overlooking?
I currently am playing a tortle 5 spore druid /4 swarmkeeper ranger and I have a lot of fun with it. It's not "optimized" by any means but it's fun. Went shield and shelleleigh quarterstaff w/ PAM for a weaponized bonus action, max Wis, and the swarmkeeper provides some flexibility beyond just damage. (Can even add the swarm effects on ranged cantrips since it's on an attack roll, not a weapon attack roll, which is nice). For leveling I started at 5 so began as 3 druid 2 ranger, leveled druid up to 5, and will be taking ranger up to 5 next for extra attack. After that, will be taking all levels in druid.
For getting out of melee when you need to, the swarmkeeper helps a lot with it, since it can move you 5 ft without taking an Op attack or push your enemy away from you which can be a lot more valuable than a little extra damage. And tortle helps keep ac decent.
Nectrotic damage is generally pretty good. Some undead resist it but not as many undead actually have resistance as you may think. In the UA version symbiotic entity was poison damage which was not good at all.
Overall, in combat you'll probably find yourself being less effective than a full marshal at melee damage and less effective a caster than a full druid. But doesn't mean it's not fun and it's certainly not unplayable, at least in my experience.
I currently am playing a tortle 5 spore druid /4 swarmkeeper ranger and I have a lot of fun with it. It's not "optimized" by any means but it's fun. Went shield and shelleleigh quarterstaff w/ PAM for a weaponized bonus action, max Wis, and the swarmkeeper provides some flexibility beyond just damage. (Can even add the swarm effects on ranged cantrips since it's on an attack roll, not a weapon attack roll, which is nice). For leveling I started at 5 so began as 3 druid 2 ranger, leveled druid up to 5, and will be taking ranger up to 5 next for extra attack. After that, will be taking all levels in druid.
For getting out of melee when you need to, the swarmkeeper helps a lot with it, since it can move you 5 ft without taking an Op attack or push your enemy away from you which can be a lot more valuable than a little extra damage. And tortle helps keep ac decent.
Nectrotic damage is generally pretty good. Some undead resist it but not as many undead actually have resistance as you may think. In the UA version symbiotic entity was poison damage which was not good at all.
Overall, in combat you'll probably find yourself being less effective than a full marshal at melee damage and less effective a caster than a full druid. But doesn't mean it's not fun and it's certainly not unplayable, at least in my experience.
Ah, very cool! Thanks a ton for the personal insight! Swarmkeeper was one I did briefly consider, so I might need to revisit that a bit. Good to know about the necrotic damage as well. Also, glad to hear it's been a fun build on top of staying serviceable.
Just out of curiosity, how did you flavor the backstory? Have some fun ideas for how to approach it, but always enjoy hearing other's ideas!
For me the backstory was fairly simple. In the world I play in most of the tortles native to the region are from a specific swamp with druidic elders so my character Myco was born there, was a bit of a loner, and spent a lot of time out in the swamp on his own or with his druid mentor, learning from the swamp and how death can bring new life to the world, hence learning to utilize necrotic powers for the good of the living. Since he started at lvl 5 I made him stay in the tortle community longer than most l, learning what he could while he was there, and began his adventuring career when he left the swamp.
I flavor his swarm as a byproduct of the mushroom and fungus colony he lets just live and grow on his back instead of an actual swarm of creatures. I found that worked pretty well to mesh the two subclasses together into a cohesive concept, at least for my particular character.
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Alright, so I'm pretty new to DnD (roughly half a campaign). I thoroughly enjoy reading up on the classes and trying to find fun builds, but not necessarily broken or full on min/max. That doesn't mean I want them to be ineffective or potentially hamper the party though.
Anyway, I really like the idea of the Circle of Spores and the fact that the extra Symbiotic Entity damage applies to every weapon attack. Naturally, to me, that means trying to figure out ways to maximize that damage. I recognize that it could also play well into improving tank builds with some extra oomph too though. As such, I have two approaches to this, both of which are sort of slow burns.
Tanky Build
Playstyle:
Mainly looking to gain additional hit points via Symbiotic Entity and some boosts to overall damage. This is done by multiclassing 3 lvls into Barbarian and take Path of the Beast to use claws. This gets you an extra attack, while still being able to use a shield and get the resistance from rage. Could dump another two lvls in Barbarian for the actual Extra Attack (3 total per action). The Druid spellcasting basically becomes out of combat utility in this version, but additional lvls probably still need to go into Druid for the boost to Symbiotic Entity temporary hit points. The downside is that this is pretty clunky due to Symbiotic Entity taking an action. If you can get it off before combat starts, then it's not too big of a deal but otherwise you're basically losing your first turn.
Race options:
Tortle: This helps with the MADness a bit by reducing the need for Dex, due to Natural Armor. Basically going to have 19AC right off the bat, but not much opportunity to improve that outside of magic items.
Goliath: Additional damage reduction to help maintain Symbiotic Entity.
Damage Build
Playstyle:
We're looking for the most extra damage possible here. The initial thought is to multiclass into Ranger up to lvl 5 and take Hunter w/ Colossus Slayer. This gives a Fighting Style, some added spell utility, an additional 1d6 per attack when running Hunter's Mark, a pretty reliable extra 1d8 per turn, and an Extra Attack. Survivability becomes a bit of a concern though, as I'll likely want to either TWF w/ Dual Wield or GWM w/ a two-handed weapon. The other option would be to sacrifice a little damage and go with a reach weapon and use Polearm Master. Ultimately though, we'll need either a way to avoid opportunity attacks and move away after attacking or boost defense to avoid getting hit while staying on the front line. I think the best bet for this is through racial abilities below. Also, this one definitely takes a while to come together. Maybe a little too long to be honest. I'm thinking two lvls in Druid to start, then go 5 straight in Ranger, the pump Druid up after that. Symbiotic Entity becomes pretty fragile for a while in this case, but you could modify your tactics if/when it goes down and play more like a typical ranger. Could also be pretty MAD if going with anything but TWF.
Races:
Harengon: Racial abilities help with getting out of danger
Goliath: Again, damage reduction to help keep Symbiotic Entity up
Earth Genasi (MotM): Blade Ward cantrip as a BA helps with survivability
Goblin: Nimble Escape to get out of danger, but this basically has to be a TWF build
Shadar Kai (MotM): Fey Step to escape danger
Questions
Does this concept just generally take too long to come online?
Which version is more viable? The tanky version feels like it falls too much in the middle of trying to do two things to do either of them particularly well, but the damage version might be a little too squishy to work.
Other options to improve on each concept? I could see going with Fighter Echo Knight for the damage version to help stay out of direct danger and provide some extra range for the attacks, plus the flavor would be fun. Fighter Rune Knight might also work to boost the damage with Giant's Might and gain some additional utility. Could also see Warlock Hexblade playing into the concept. For the tanky build, Barbarian Path of the Ancestral Guardian might push it more towards the typical tank role and could offer flavor. Not sure what else would really work well here.
Is the necrotic damage from Symbiotic Entity at risk of being resisted/negated in a lot of campaigns? I'm sure there are some where it's worse than others, but overall is it a bad damage type?
Any other races with abilities that fit well into either playstyle that I'm overlooking?
I currently am playing a tortle 5 spore druid /4 swarmkeeper ranger and I have a lot of fun with it. It's not "optimized" by any means but it's fun. Went shield and shelleleigh quarterstaff w/ PAM for a weaponized bonus action, max Wis, and the swarmkeeper provides some flexibility beyond just damage. (Can even add the swarm effects on ranged cantrips since it's on an attack roll, not a weapon attack roll, which is nice). For leveling I started at 5 so began as 3 druid 2 ranger, leveled druid up to 5, and will be taking ranger up to 5 next for extra attack. After that, will be taking all levels in druid.
For getting out of melee when you need to, the swarmkeeper helps a lot with it, since it can move you 5 ft without taking an Op attack or push your enemy away from you which can be a lot more valuable than a little extra damage. And tortle helps keep ac decent.
Nectrotic damage is generally pretty good. Some undead resist it but not as many undead actually have resistance as you may think. In the UA version symbiotic entity was poison damage which was not good at all.
Overall, in combat you'll probably find yourself being less effective than a full marshal at melee damage and less effective a caster than a full druid. But doesn't mean it's not fun and it's certainly not unplayable, at least in my experience.
Ah, very cool! Thanks a ton for the personal insight! Swarmkeeper was one I did briefly consider, so I might need to revisit that a bit. Good to know about the necrotic damage as well. Also, glad to hear it's been a fun build on top of staying serviceable.
Just out of curiosity, how did you flavor the backstory? Have some fun ideas for how to approach it, but always enjoy hearing other's ideas!
For me the backstory was fairly simple. In the world I play in most of the tortles native to the region are from a specific swamp with druidic elders so my character Myco was born there, was a bit of a loner, and spent a lot of time out in the swamp on his own or with his druid mentor, learning from the swamp and how death can bring new life to the world, hence learning to utilize necrotic powers for the good of the living. Since he started at lvl 5 I made him stay in the tortle community longer than most l, learning what he could while he was there, and began his adventuring career when he left the swamp.
I flavor his swarm as a byproduct of the mushroom and fungus colony he lets just live and grow on his back instead of an actual swarm of creatures. I found that worked pretty well to mesh the two subclasses together into a cohesive concept, at least for my particular character.