So I'm rolling a Circle of Stars Druid for an upcoming Curse of Strahd campaign. I'll be a female half elf, I've already fleshed out the backstory and already rolled stats, which ended with 12 STR, 12 DEX, 12 INT, 12 CON, 18 WIS, 4 CHA.
We have a 5 member party consisting of a barbarian, a paladin, bladesinger wizard and a ranged artificer, and then me. Since we'll have 3 front liners in melee, I'm planning on being almost exclusively a back-line caster that'll do healing/support/battlefield control.
This will be the first druid I play, and I'm having problems selecting my cantrips and spells. Right now I have the cantrips Produce Flame and Thorn Whip selected. I'm not picking Guidance because Circle of Stars gives it for free. The other cantrips I've looked at are Frostbite or Shillelagh, but with being a back-line caster I'm thinking Shillelagh may not be as useful.
My prepared spells aren't a huge concern since I can change them every day and I'll get free Guiding Bolt but right now I have Healing Word, Absorb Elements, Ice Knife, Thunderwave, Entangle prepared. I've thought about dropping Thunderwave for either Faerie Fire or Cure Wounds but Thunderwave seems like a good panic move if I do get ambushed in melee.
I'm wide open to suggestions or any tips/tricks. If you have any questions then feel free to ask.
I currently have a lvl 5 Circle of Stars and love the character. I'd say two things about spells:
Thunderwave is pretty nice. I use it sometimes to push enemies back into spike growth or say moonbeam, continually forcing foes into my damaging concentration based AOE. Thorn whip can do the same thing of course just a single enemy. Don't underestimate being able to combo with yourself and your party members using this spell but be careful catching your 3 frontline members in the wave.
Faerie fire is great. I like to play my druid as a sort of tanky controller and faerie fire is right up my alley. I would try and get your CON up as a lot of your spells will be concentration and you will find that you are really versatile and can take a lot of punishment, allowing you to move between back line and front as needed. Absorb Elements will help with this, I've made the wizard in my party jealous with smart use of absorb elements in combination with shillelagh. If you don't take shillelagh you might want to take primal savagery as absorb elements requires a melee attack to unleash the absorbed power (as I understand it).
If you are wanting to stay in the backline your Archer Starry Shape will give you consistent increased damage per round. I find it my go to whenever I'm in the back with Dragon whenever I get surrounded. I haven't got much use out of Chalice, it seems like the party has to be in A LOT of trouble before I even consider switching to it and I can only think of once or twice where I had to jump from my current form to it.
I would lean on Archer Starry Shape and the fistful of guiding bolts to build an unconventional archer. Considering your party composition and lack of constitution proficiency, I would definitely stay in the back to get the most out of your powerful concentration spells.
I'll reiterate the faerie fire love. It's an excellent spell. It may seem redundant with entangle, but I think it's very strong to have both at the ready. There are situations that will favor one or the other. The druid's main strength as a spellcaster is controlling spells. Lean into that and back it up with better ranged damage than your average druid. Produce Flame is an unexciting but solid role player to fill out your ranged routine. Generally I would be looking to lay down entangle or faerie fire round one, followed by spamming guiding bolts and produce flame along with the starry shape attack. This tactic will carry over to higher levels when you get access to stuff like moonbeam, spike growth, and call lightning.
I think thunderwave is fine but unexciting. I would take it and see how often it makes a difference. It's nice to have melee options in general, but especially at level one when no one has enough HP to really be a front line. To that effect, I think you should replace thorn whip with Shillelagh at level one. It will be really nice to be able to smack people that get in your face. Not having to move will end up saving a lot of damage. You can always swap it out at a later level when the team is better at keeping enemies off you. The new cantrip versatility is a really cool feature.
I don't think thorn whip will be that good on a build this frail. You'll want to be further than 30 feet away from the enemy most of the time. Investing in the Spell Sniper feat could change that though. I love combining a 60 foot thorn whip with spike growth as it can now reach across the radius and pull someone in.
That's a really good point about Thorn Whip. Obviously the point was mostly to pull people into area control effects but yeah, I'm likely going to want to be further than 30 feet away from enemies. To that effect, would it even be worth taking Shillelagh, since I don't want to be in melee? Or should I take a utility cantrip? Shape Water could be great if I get creative.
Shillelagh is... okay if you get pulled into melee against your wishes so you have a melee range attack. Before level 5, its better than a cantrip at melee ranger, but after? Its on par with any save-based cantrip you might want to use.
I love shape water and mold earth. I would be looking to have both on your build eventually. It's so fun to have minor bending powers. I do think Shillelagh is worth it at level one though. Again, no one can really claim to be a front line yet. With only 1 level under your belt even the barbarian and paladin are in danger of going down in one two two unlucky hits, and the bladesinger is just a level one wizard. In level one situations it is useful for every character to have melee and ranged options so that everyone can fight and fill in where needed. Level one is really like a different game and playing from 1 creates some different concerns you don't often see theorized builds address. I would absolutely take Shillelagh and then look to swap it out for shape water or mold earth at level 4 once your barbarian/paladin/bladesinger are capable of holding a front line.
I'm not a fan of Ice Knife. It is much worse than guiding bolt. The small aoe damage does not make up for it. Even at level one when you don't have guiding bolt yet I believe your few spells are better spent on AOE concentration spells with multi round benefits. I'm also not a huge fan of absorb elements at level one. It's a great spell, but you don't face that much energy damage at early levels and spending a precious spell slot on a little bit of damage mitigation isn't worth the resource. Absorb elements gets good once it's used to resist big hits and there are fewer impactful uses for your first level spells.
For replacements I would choose goodberry and fog cloud.
Goodberry is awesome and easy to underrate. It's not an efficient healing spell, but is especially good at lower levels. Cast it at the beginning of the day and hand a couple to each party member. Now everyone has 2-3 uses of an improved spare the dying, capable of stabilizing someone at one hp. Now everyone can act as a spot healer when the need arises, leaving your actions free to do other things when necessary. You also take care of all food needs every day. This usually isn't a concern, but is a nice additional benefit.
Fog Cloud probably seems like overkill alongside faerie fire and entangle, but this is all about building the best suite of control effects. Between faerie fire, fog cloud and entangle you will have an excellent control spell for nearly any situation. Circle of Stars really helps you focus your spell choices, as once you get to second level you have access to one of the best 1st level blasts in the game that you can cast whenever your concentration spells aren't needed. Nothing the druid gets at level one is better than Guiding Bolt when it comes to blasting. I would take advantage of that and build your spell suite knowing your first level blasting is covered. Fog Cloud is also excellent at avoiding encounters, which can be super important at low levels.
I'd be looking to use every spell slot on faerie fire, fog cloud or entangle at level one with the exception of maybe a casting of goodberry. The overall benefit from a well implemented control spell will be much greater than a small burst of damage or spot healing spell. Having them on deck for extreme situations is important, but low levels is about squeezing as much as you can about your limited resources.
Ice Knife was one that I was going back and forth between anyways so I think you've talked me out of it. Fog Cloud does seem like a good use of the spell slot though, so I'll definitely think about that. I'm still waffling between Shillelagh and Shape Water but I do think I've narrowed it down between those two.
You know I always forget primal savagery is a thing. I would actually look at that for your melee option if you end up wanting one. Shillelagh conflicts with your bonus action and deals less damage. I'm so used to thinking about ranger shillelagh builds right now I forgot it's much less enticing without extra attack. I wouldn't fault you for taking a utility cantrip instead though. Like I said, I would be looking to have both shape water and mold earth eventually. They're very fun to have access to.
And I can't hype up fog cloud enough. Elite tier 1st level spell. It can do so much when played well. Entangle, faerie fire and fog cloud is a really satisfying trio to play with.
What are your thoughts on race? I've been set on Half-Elf because it allows me to get to 18 WIS and even out the two 11s to 12s and extra skills are always nice. But now I'm looking at High Elf because the extra cantrip would be really nice. Any big thoughts one way or another?
If race options are still on the table I'll put all my money on variant human instead of any elf. Using the feat to pick up resilient (con) goes a long way to solidifying your concentration saves which are the crux of any druid. The new custom lineage even lets you keep your 18 wisdom. Then you can pick up warcaster at level 4 and be set for the rest of your career. I think prioritizing rock solid concentration saves over raw wisdom pays off on a druid. Even with your improved blasting game your control spells are what allow you to change the course of battle.
If you're set on picking an elf race then I would definitely switch to high elf for the extra cantrip. I completely forgot about the stat boost switching options from Tasha's.
Yeah the stat switching options are really nice. The issue with V. Human is that I couldn't get my WIS to an 18. I rolled a 16 so I need a +2 to get 18. And you're saying you'd take a feat at Level 4, rather than getting my WIS to 20? I understand the concentration argument but getting my WIS to 20 also helps the save DCs for those area effects.
I would take custom lineage over variant human. It gives you a +2 to put into wisdom and the feat.
I'm a big believer in picking up resilient (con) and warcaster on a druid by level 4. Most of your concentration spells have some kind of effect even if they make the save. Spike Growth, Conjure Animals and Conjure Woodland Beings don't require enemy saves at all. Enemies being 5% more likely to fail their saves is great, but means much less if you're going to drop concentration on said spells whenever you get targeted. And trust me, just because you're on the back line doesn't mean the DM won't try to mess you up. Resilient (con) and Warcaster is a quality of life thing. Relying on concentration spells only to drop them all the time will feel awful. The fact that custom lineage exists now to keep your starting wisdom at 18 makes this a no brainer to me.
Also, before custom lineage was a thing, every class other than fighters using point buy waited until level 8 to max out their main stat. The bounded math system of the game was based around character's starting with a maximum of 15 in a stat before racial modifiers. Being in line with point buy builds has you in line with the balance of the game.
You know I always forget primal savagery is a thing. I would actually look at that for your melee option if you end up wanting one. Shillelagh conflicts with your bonus action and deals less damage. I'm so used to thinking about ranger shillelagh builds right now I forgot it's much less enticing without extra attack. I wouldn't fault you for taking a utility cantrip instead though. Like I said, I would be looking to have both shape water and mold earth eventually. They're very fun to have access to.
And I can't hype up fog cloud enough. Elite tier 1st level spell. It can do so much when played well. Entangle, faerie fire and fog cloud is a really satisfying trio to play with.
Shillelagh is a bonus action to cast but then lasts for a minute (no concentration) and you use your regular action to attack. Primal Savagery has to be cast every round as your action, so you could potentially use a bonus action spell and hit with your club in the same round. It is better than Primal Savagery at low levels, but it doesn't scale so at 5th level it is slightly worse -1d8+4 with an 18 wisdom against 2d10 and goes downhill from there.
I know it's only one bonus action. I'm just not a fan of shillelagh disrupting even one turn of Starry Form attack. Either one will be fine as a backup melee option at level 1.
You aren't casting a spell, so the part about doubling the range wouldn't apply. But the second part about ignoring cover just says "your ranged spell attack" which is what you are using, so it would apply.
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So I'm rolling a Circle of Stars Druid for an upcoming Curse of Strahd campaign. I'll be a female half elf, I've already fleshed out the backstory and already rolled stats, which ended with 12 STR, 12 DEX, 12 INT, 12 CON, 18 WIS, 4 CHA.
We have a 5 member party consisting of a barbarian, a paladin, bladesinger wizard and a ranged artificer, and then me. Since we'll have 3 front liners in melee, I'm planning on being almost exclusively a back-line caster that'll do healing/support/battlefield control.
This will be the first druid I play, and I'm having problems selecting my cantrips and spells. Right now I have the cantrips Produce Flame and Thorn Whip selected. I'm not picking Guidance because Circle of Stars gives it for free. The other cantrips I've looked at are Frostbite or Shillelagh, but with being a back-line caster I'm thinking Shillelagh may not be as useful.
My prepared spells aren't a huge concern since I can change them every day and I'll get free Guiding Bolt but right now I have Healing Word, Absorb Elements, Ice Knife, Thunderwave, Entangle prepared. I've thought about dropping Thunderwave for either Faerie Fire or Cure Wounds but Thunderwave seems like a good panic move if I do get ambushed in melee.
I'm wide open to suggestions or any tips/tricks. If you have any questions then feel free to ask.
I currently have a lvl 5 Circle of Stars and love the character. I'd say two things about spells:
Thunderwave is pretty nice. I use it sometimes to push enemies back into spike growth or say moonbeam, continually forcing foes into my damaging concentration based AOE. Thorn whip can do the same thing of course just a single enemy. Don't underestimate being able to combo with yourself and your party members using this spell but be careful catching your 3 frontline members in the wave.
Faerie fire is great. I like to play my druid as a sort of tanky controller and faerie fire is right up my alley. I would try and get your CON up as a lot of your spells will be concentration and you will find that you are really versatile and can take a lot of punishment, allowing you to move between back line and front as needed. Absorb Elements will help with this, I've made the wizard in my party jealous with smart use of absorb elements in combination with shillelagh. If you don't take shillelagh you might want to take primal savagery as absorb elements requires a melee attack to unleash the absorbed power (as I understand it).
If you are wanting to stay in the backline your Archer Starry Shape will give you consistent increased damage per round. I find it my go to whenever I'm in the back with Dragon whenever I get surrounded. I haven't got much use out of Chalice, it seems like the party has to be in A LOT of trouble before I even consider switching to it and I can only think of once or twice where I had to jump from my current form to it.
I would lean on Archer Starry Shape and the fistful of guiding bolts to build an unconventional archer. Considering your party composition and lack of constitution proficiency, I would definitely stay in the back to get the most out of your powerful concentration spells.
I'll reiterate the faerie fire love. It's an excellent spell. It may seem redundant with entangle, but I think it's very strong to have both at the ready. There are situations that will favor one or the other. The druid's main strength as a spellcaster is controlling spells. Lean into that and back it up with better ranged damage than your average druid. Produce Flame is an unexciting but solid role player to fill out your ranged routine. Generally I would be looking to lay down entangle or faerie fire round one, followed by spamming guiding bolts and produce flame along with the starry shape attack. This tactic will carry over to higher levels when you get access to stuff like moonbeam, spike growth, and call lightning.
I think thunderwave is fine but unexciting. I would take it and see how often it makes a difference. It's nice to have melee options in general, but especially at level one when no one has enough HP to really be a front line. To that effect, I think you should replace thorn whip with Shillelagh at level one. It will be really nice to be able to smack people that get in your face. Not having to move will end up saving a lot of damage. You can always swap it out at a later level when the team is better at keeping enemies off you. The new cantrip versatility is a really cool feature.
I don't think thorn whip will be that good on a build this frail. You'll want to be further than 30 feet away from the enemy most of the time. Investing in the Spell Sniper feat could change that though. I love combining a 60 foot thorn whip with spike growth as it can now reach across the radius and pull someone in.
That's a really good point about Thorn Whip. Obviously the point was mostly to pull people into area control effects but yeah, I'm likely going to want to be further than 30 feet away from enemies. To that effect, would it even be worth taking Shillelagh, since I don't want to be in melee? Or should I take a utility cantrip? Shape Water could be great if I get creative.
Shillelagh is... okay if you get pulled into melee against your wishes so you have a melee range attack. Before level 5, its better than a cantrip at melee ranger, but after? Its on par with any save-based cantrip you might want to use.
I love shape water and mold earth. I would be looking to have both on your build eventually. It's so fun to have minor bending powers. I do think Shillelagh is worth it at level one though. Again, no one can really claim to be a front line yet. With only 1 level under your belt even the barbarian and paladin are in danger of going down in one two two unlucky hits, and the bladesinger is just a level one wizard. In level one situations it is useful for every character to have melee and ranged options so that everyone can fight and fill in where needed. Level one is really like a different game and playing from 1 creates some different concerns you don't often see theorized builds address. I would absolutely take Shillelagh and then look to swap it out for shape water or mold earth at level 4 once your barbarian/paladin/bladesinger are capable of holding a front line.
I'm not a fan of Ice Knife. It is much worse than guiding bolt. The small aoe damage does not make up for it. Even at level one when you don't have guiding bolt yet I believe your few spells are better spent on AOE concentration spells with multi round benefits. I'm also not a huge fan of absorb elements at level one. It's a great spell, but you don't face that much energy damage at early levels and spending a precious spell slot on a little bit of damage mitigation isn't worth the resource. Absorb elements gets good once it's used to resist big hits and there are fewer impactful uses for your first level spells.
For replacements I would choose goodberry and fog cloud.
I'd be looking to use every spell slot on faerie fire, fog cloud or entangle at level one with the exception of maybe a casting of goodberry. The overall benefit from a well implemented control spell will be much greater than a small burst of damage or spot healing spell. Having them on deck for extreme situations is important, but low levels is about squeezing as much as you can about your limited resources.
Ice Knife was one that I was going back and forth between anyways so I think you've talked me out of it. Fog Cloud does seem like a good use of the spell slot though, so I'll definitely think about that. I'm still waffling between Shillelagh and Shape Water but I do think I've narrowed it down between those two.
You know I always forget primal savagery is a thing. I would actually look at that for your melee option if you end up wanting one. Shillelagh conflicts with your bonus action and deals less damage. I'm so used to thinking about ranger shillelagh builds right now I forgot it's much less enticing without extra attack. I wouldn't fault you for taking a utility cantrip instead though. Like I said, I would be looking to have both shape water and mold earth eventually. They're very fun to have access to.
And I can't hype up fog cloud enough. Elite tier 1st level spell. It can do so much when played well. Entangle, faerie fire and fog cloud is a really satisfying trio to play with.
What are your thoughts on race? I've been set on Half-Elf because it allows me to get to 18 WIS and even out the two 11s to 12s and extra skills are always nice. But now I'm looking at High Elf because the extra cantrip would be really nice. Any big thoughts one way or another?
If race options are still on the table I'll put all my money on variant human instead of any elf. Using the feat to pick up resilient (con) goes a long way to solidifying your concentration saves which are the crux of any druid. The new custom lineage even lets you keep your 18 wisdom. Then you can pick up warcaster at level 4 and be set for the rest of your career. I think prioritizing rock solid concentration saves over raw wisdom pays off on a druid. Even with your improved blasting game your control spells are what allow you to change the course of battle.
If you're set on picking an elf race then I would definitely switch to high elf for the extra cantrip. I completely forgot about the stat boost switching options from Tasha's.
Yeah the stat switching options are really nice. The issue with V. Human is that I couldn't get my WIS to an 18. I rolled a 16 so I need a +2 to get 18. And you're saying you'd take a feat at Level 4, rather than getting my WIS to 20? I understand the concentration argument but getting my WIS to 20 also helps the save DCs for those area effects.
I would take custom lineage over variant human. It gives you a +2 to put into wisdom and the feat.
I'm a big believer in picking up resilient (con) and warcaster on a druid by level 4. Most of your concentration spells have some kind of effect even if they make the save. Spike Growth, Conjure Animals and Conjure Woodland Beings don't require enemy saves at all. Enemies being 5% more likely to fail their saves is great, but means much less if you're going to drop concentration on said spells whenever you get targeted. And trust me, just because you're on the back line doesn't mean the DM won't try to mess you up. Resilient (con) and Warcaster is a quality of life thing. Relying on concentration spells only to drop them all the time will feel awful. The fact that custom lineage exists now to keep your starting wisdom at 18 makes this a no brainer to me.
Also, before custom lineage was a thing, every class other than fighters using point buy waited until level 8 to max out their main stat. The bounded math system of the game was based around character's starting with a maximum of 15 in a stat before racial modifiers. Being in line with point buy builds has you in line with the balance of the game.
Shillelagh is a bonus action to cast but then lasts for a minute (no concentration) and you use your regular action to attack. Primal Savagery has to be cast every round as your action, so you could potentially use a bonus action spell and hit with your club in the same round. It is better than Primal Savagery at low levels, but it doesn't scale so at 5th level it is slightly worse -1d8+4 with an 18 wisdom against 2d10 and goes downhill from there.
I know it's only one bonus action. I'm just not a fan of shillelagh disrupting even one turn of Starry Form attack. Either one will be fine as a backup melee option at level 1.
Question, would starry form’s Archer attack work with Spell Sniper feat? Since it is attack roll and ranged spell attack?
I would say it partially does.
You aren't casting a spell, so the part about doubling the range wouldn't apply. But the second part about ignoring cover just says "your ranged spell attack" which is what you are using, so it would apply.