I'd love some insight. I'm a Paladin (lvl 14) and Warlock (lvl 3) and we just levelled up. I was intending on returning to Paladin at level 15 but that means giving up on the ASI of Warlock at level 4. On paper though Cleansing Touch is equivalent to four free castings (18CHA) of Lesser Resto, Greater Resto, Remove Curse, or Dispel magic. But in re-reading it I'm not so sure of it's useful application. Knowing every campaign and DM is different, in your experience has the need for this come up; how regularly; and how useful has it been?
I have reservations because it has to be a spell on a player but not magical effect or a monster's class ability. If someone is already petrified, enfeebled, myself is held etc., this won't work. Being a devotion paladin I have an aura of no charm or fear so being in my presence nullifies these spell types. So I'm wondering how often it might actually be needed???
Well first off since you already have Cleansing Touch it's kind of a moot point to ask if it's worth increasing your Charisma for that specifically and instead think about what you gain and lose by going one or the other.
As a Devotion Paladin you gain a permanent Protection from Evil and Good spell. This might not seem great but it does give enemies of a large variety of types disadvantage on attacks against you and you can't be possessed which would be very bad for your party members if you could be. Next off if you continue in Paladin this level and next you'll still get an ASI at Paladin 16 and can still get 5th level Paladin spells like the powerhouse Circle of Protection. So you really don't gain much for grabbing an ASI now vs delaying it one extra level.
That said Cleansing Touch is either really good or really useless in my experience but it does vary a bunch. Generally you don't need that many uses of Cleansing Touch because in most fights where you need it one or two good uses is all you need to turn the tide, especially since your auras stop some already potent spells. You should also keep in mind that Charisma buffs your Sacred Weapon, Aura of Protection, and your spells. This isn't a huge deal but it's something to keep in mind as well. In my opinion you lose more than you gain by going 4th level into Warlock because it's hard to compare an ASI to 5th level spells.
EDIT: I’m 13 levels of Paladin and 3 levels Warlock. We’re levelling up to 17 so I would be picking up level 14 in Paladin and that’s why I was asking about how cleansing Touch works in game.
thanks Charmandenator. I definitely think level 15 and 16 in Paladin are both fantastic and worth moving towards if my character survives.
Ah I see. Well I'll say an extra speal on Cleansing Touch then
It's the type of ability that's really useful when you need it but might not get as much leverage as you'd like. Getting to 7th level Warlock could also be nice so it's partially your call. While you might not use Cleansing Touch that much it can be really good when you do, and it's a real life saver when it's needed but you probably won't find yourself using it as often as you'd like. I don't have the most experience with the ability but as a DM I can say there are a lot of times when it would have been handy for my players but it's a bit limited overall and your other features kind of accomplish a lot of what it does already.
One thing to consider about features is that many “clutch play” abilities are extremely valuable when you need them in very specific circumstances but due to their high pay out aren’t going to be called upon often and have less general application. It really is a matter of wanting to have more general use for things or bringing in a big gun on the rare circumstance you need it. Everything comes at a cost. You just need to decide which costs for what benefits you’re willing to pay.
As a side note, unless you really, really need that last ASI, you probably don't want to miss out on Paladin level 17 with great spells such as Holy Weapon and Summon Greater Steed.
As a side note, unless you really, really need that last ASI, you probably don't want to miss out on Paladin level 17 with great spells such as Holy Weapon and Summon Greater Steed.
Apologies for the necro, but I just want to point out that Summon Greater Steed is a 4th level spell, thus Paladins get it at level 13, not 17.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I'd love some insight. I'm a Paladin (lvl 14) and Warlock (lvl 3) and we just levelled up. I was intending on returning to Paladin at level 15 but that means giving up on the ASI of Warlock at level 4. On paper though Cleansing Touch is equivalent to four free castings (18CHA) of Lesser Resto, Greater Resto, Remove Curse, or Dispel magic. But in re-reading it I'm not so sure of it's useful application. Knowing every campaign and DM is different, in your experience has the need for this come up; how regularly; and how useful has it been?
I have reservations because it has to be a spell on a player but not magical effect or a monster's class ability. If someone is already petrified, enfeebled, myself is held etc., this won't work. Being a devotion paladin I have an aura of no charm or fear so being in my presence nullifies these spell types. So I'm wondering how often it might actually be needed???
Well first off since you already have Cleansing Touch it's kind of a moot point to ask if it's worth increasing your Charisma for that specifically and instead think about what you gain and lose by going one or the other.
As a Devotion Paladin you gain a permanent Protection from Evil and Good spell. This might not seem great but it does give enemies of a large variety of types disadvantage on attacks against you and you can't be possessed which would be very bad for your party members if you could be. Next off if you continue in Paladin this level and next you'll still get an ASI at Paladin 16 and can still get 5th level Paladin spells like the powerhouse Circle of Protection. So you really don't gain much for grabbing an ASI now vs delaying it one extra level.
That said Cleansing Touch is either really good or really useless in my experience but it does vary a bunch. Generally you don't need that many uses of Cleansing Touch because in most fights where you need it one or two good uses is all you need to turn the tide, especially since your auras stop some already potent spells. You should also keep in mind that Charisma buffs your Sacred Weapon, Aura of Protection, and your spells. This isn't a huge deal but it's something to keep in mind as well. In my opinion you lose more than you gain by going 4th level into Warlock because it's hard to compare an ASI to 5th level spells.
EDIT: I’m 13 levels of Paladin and 3 levels Warlock. We’re levelling up to 17 so I would be picking up level 14 in Paladin and that’s why I was asking about how cleansing Touch works in game.
thanks Charmandenator. I definitely think level 15 and 16 in Paladin are both fantastic and worth moving towards if my character survives.
Ah I see. Well I'll say an extra speal on Cleansing Touch then
It's the type of ability that's really useful when you need it but might not get as much leverage as you'd like. Getting to 7th level Warlock could also be nice so it's partially your call. While you might not use Cleansing Touch that much it can be really good when you do, and it's a real life saver when it's needed but you probably won't find yourself using it as often as you'd like. I don't have the most experience with the ability but as a DM I can say there are a lot of times when it would have been handy for my players but it's a bit limited overall and your other features kind of accomplish a lot of what it does already.
Thanks. That's what I was thinking.
One thing to consider about features is that many “clutch play” abilities are extremely valuable when you need them in very specific circumstances but due to their high pay out aren’t going to be called upon often and have less general application. It really is a matter of wanting to have more general use for things or bringing in a big gun on the rare circumstance you need it. Everything comes at a cost. You just need to decide which costs for what benefits you’re willing to pay.
As a side note, unless you really, really need that last ASI, you probably don't want to miss out on Paladin level 17 with great spells such as Holy Weapon and Summon Greater Steed.
Apologies for the necro, but I just want to point out that Summon Greater Steed is a 4th level spell, thus Paladins get it at level 13, not 17.