I just don't get this 5th edition obsession with having the perfect build for level 20.
Is there an MMO style level cap? A secret trove of 'end-game content' that is only revealed to people who have achieved level 20? Are all characters below level 20 irrelevant and yet somehow immortal?
Should I blame deck building games like MTG for this trend?
As much as I see the intent of this, I will indulge you.
This “trend”, which is relevant only for a portion of the players, seems important simply because this minority is the typical “loud” one, and find fertile ground in forums. Not that it is something negative, although it’s something I do not really find interesting myself.
To be honest, though, this is hardly something that came to be in 5ed, as this kind of “search for the perfect build” was present all the way back since the 3rd edition. I am pretty sure a quick search in any other RPG forum will unearth hundreds of similar posts.
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Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
As much as I see the intent of this, I will indulge you.
Now that's hardly fair! Probably insightful, but still.......
I think the quiet majority should speak up occasionally, or newcomers will believe the vocal minority to be the only viewpoint.
The quest for the perfect twenty is probably just a small part of the character development for many people, and I am not against min-maxing ("A certain amount of min-maxing is desirable" - In the 4th edition book I think!)
I am, as always, interested in other people's thoughts on this. And maybe a little bored in the office.... :D
Personally, I quite like the idea of an extended level 20 campaign, where you are 'stuck' with your build.
So long as there is a level hard cap, a goal to reach, there will be someone trying to get there faster or get their stronger. It's the nature of competition to be the best, and while D&D is a cooperative game in most aspects, we cannot deny the thrill of throwing weapon dice plus a fistful of D6's for a sneak attack that crit. The important takeaway is of course fun, if you don't have fun then why are you playing the game. I used to love spending all my D&D time finding that perfect build as well, and I still find it fun to read others journeys, however now I feel more connected to the game when I have a character who fits the storyline, and struggles like everyone else (not that min maxing and roleplaying are mutually exclusive).
For me, what is the weirdest about the phenomenon of seeking the best level 20 build is that a very large portion of the folks doing that are also convinced that level 20 is an unattainable goal that no campaign ever even gets close to.
And then you end up with folks like my group, where we will actually get to 20th level and even play for a while after that (utilizing magic items and epic boons from the DMG to keep some sense of character progression alongside the story progression), but don't really pre-plan a build in any more depth than "I think I'll play a [sub-class] [class] this time. Probably going to be [player's favorite race] as usual."
I have thought about this question and searched for the answer for like whats the meaning of life to a god in dnd or would a god start at level 1? Well what i discovered is that dnd 4.0 explains this by at level 30 players enter their path to reaching god hood. And i believe that the science of this is itself the meaning of life to a god wherein at level 1 their level is worth three mortal levels that way at level 5 they have found a truth of their life but in dnd 4.0 perhaps that happens at level 10 why not its just adding a 0 after 1 and perhaps instead of saying that to a god 1 level is worth three lets just say its worth 5 so just add a 0 and at level 10 they have found there true path and at level 20 there able to have a paragon of that and at 30 a epic what i think the difference between the gods and the mortals is that the god would already start with all of that knowledge at level 1 because it would count as three regardless of if every level is ment to show the truth or not.
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I just don't get this 5th edition obsession with having the perfect build for level 20.
Is there an MMO style level cap?
A secret trove of 'end-game content' that is only revealed to people who have achieved level 20?
Are all characters below level 20 irrelevant and yet somehow immortal?
Should I blame deck building games like MTG for this trend?
Roleplaying since Runequest.
As much as I see the intent of this, I will indulge you.
This “trend”, which is relevant only for a portion of the players, seems important simply because this minority is the typical “loud” one, and find fertile ground in forums. Not that it is something negative, although it’s something I do not really find interesting myself.
To be honest, though, this is hardly something that came to be in 5ed, as this kind of “search for the perfect build” was present all the way back since the 3rd edition. I am pretty sure a quick search in any other RPG forum will unearth hundreds of similar posts.
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
Probably insightful, but still.......
Roleplaying since Runequest.
So long as there is a level hard cap, a goal to reach, there will be someone trying to get there faster or get their stronger. It's the nature of competition to be the best, and while D&D is a cooperative game in most aspects, we cannot deny the thrill of throwing weapon dice plus a fistful of D6's for a sneak attack that crit. The important takeaway is of course fun, if you don't have fun then why are you playing the game. I used to love spending all my D&D time finding that perfect build as well, and I still find it fun to read others journeys, however now I feel more connected to the game when I have a character who fits the storyline, and struggles like everyone else (not that min maxing and roleplaying are mutually exclusive).
Born in Italy, moved a bunch, living in Spain, my heart always belonged to Roleplaying Games
For me, what is the weirdest about the phenomenon of seeking the best level 20 build is that a very large portion of the folks doing that are also convinced that level 20 is an unattainable goal that no campaign ever even gets close to.
And then you end up with folks like my group, where we will actually get to 20th level and even play for a while after that (utilizing magic items and epic boons from the DMG to keep some sense of character progression alongside the story progression), but don't really pre-plan a build in any more depth than "I think I'll play a [sub-class] [class] this time. Probably going to be [player's favorite race] as usual."
I have thought about this question and searched for the answer for like whats the meaning of life to a god in dnd or would a god start at level 1? Well what i discovered is that dnd 4.0 explains this by at level 30 players enter their path to reaching god hood. And i believe that the science of this is itself the meaning of life to a god wherein at level 1 their level is worth three mortal levels that way at level 5 they have found a truth of their life but in dnd 4.0 perhaps that happens at level 10 why not its just adding a 0 after 1 and perhaps instead of saying that to a god 1 level is worth three lets just say its worth 5 so just add a 0 and at level 10 they have found there true path and at level 20 there able to have a paragon of that and at 30 a epic what i think the difference between the gods and the mortals is that the god would already start with all of that knowledge at level 1 because it would count as three regardless of if every level is ment to show the truth or not.