It’s strong enough that it’s a 7th level class feature for a battlemaster fighter. And they only get to do it 1/LR without expending a limited resource. Where here a level 1 character can do it all day long for free.
Well, someone with Keen Mind can do that all the time. It's still definitely too powerful for a cantrip (bonus action study is about 1/4 of keen mind, bonus action search is about 1/4 of observant, bonus action utilize is only with thief level 3 feature AFAIK).
Someone with keen mind is level 4+ and took a feat, which is a much steeper investment than a cantrip.
But I think we’re saying the same thing, this spell is giving away something that otherwise has a much larger resource cost.
I disagree. The spell specifically says that you can "move around in your space", which, by my reading, is the 5 ft. space you're occupying at the time of casting. There's no mention of being able to move freely or negate attacks of opportunity.
The actual rule for that in the PHB is here. If your human bard character, Gene Frenkle, wants to "explore his space", he's still not leaving the 5x5 area he controls in combat
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Active characters:
Edoumiaond Willegume "Eddie" Podslee, Vegetanian scholar (College of Spirits bard) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Peter "the Pied Piper" Hausler, human con artist/remover of vermin (Circle of the Shepherd druid) PIPA - Planar Interception/Protection Aeormaton, warforged bodyguard and ex-wizard hunter (Warrior of the Elements monk/Cartographer artificer) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
It’s strong enough that it’s a 7th level class feature for a battlemaster fighter. And they only get to do it 1/LR without expending a limited resource. Where here a level 1 character can do it all day long for free.
Well, someone with Keen Mind can do that all the time. It's still definitely too powerful for a cantrip (bonus action study is about 1/4 of keen mind, bonus action search is about 1/4 of observant, bonus action utilize is only with thief level 3 feature AFAIK).
Battlemasters can do it without a check, and you can only Utilize something on your person, so I don't think it's that powerful.
Battlemasters can do it without a check, and you can only Utilize something on your person, so I don't think it's that powerful.
It's not super powerful. It just exceeds the budget for what is reasonable to do with a cantrip, because cantrips are very low value (the effect is comparable in value to an origin feat. An origin feat can get you two cantrips and a level 1 spell).
You could make it balanced. I would probably just say
Spell: Moment to think Casting Time: 1 bonus action Range/Area: Self Components: V Duration: Instantaneous
When you cast this spell, you briefly stop time to allow yourself to think, allowing you to take the study action.
Look, even if I got them reversed, it STILL feels like this isn't that strong due to action economy.
Your BA can be used for better things & spells than a chance to pass or fail a D20 Test.
You'd have to build around the finicky rules regarding casting 2 spells per turn, and/or sacrifice using class & species features just so you can roll the dice & hope you've built around mid-battle skill checks.
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DM, player & homebrewer(Current homebrew project is an unofficial conversion of SBURB/SGRUB from Homestuck into DND 5e)
Once made Maxwell's Silver Hammer come down upon Strahd's head to make sure he was dead.
Always study & sharpen philosophical razors. They save a lot of trouble.
Look, even if I got them reversed, it STILL feels like this isn't that strong due to action economy.
It's overpowered for a cantrip because of the action economy. It turns a bonus action into a regular action. Utilize is almost certainly the part that's most concerning.
Your BA can be used for better things & spells than a chance to pass or fail a D20 Test.
You'd have to build around the finicky rules regarding casting 2 spells per turn, and/or sacrifice using class & species features just so you can roll the dice & hope you've built around mid-battle skill checks.
Most caster classes don't use their bonus action all that often.
Look, even if I got them reversed, it STILL feels like this isn't that strong due to action economy.
It's overpowered for a cantrip because of the action economy. It turns a bonus action into a regular action. Utilize is almost certainly the part that's most concerning.
Your BA can be used for better things & spells than a chance to pass or fail a D20 Test.
You'd have to build around the finicky rules regarding casting 2 spells per turn, and/or sacrifice using class & species features just so you can roll the dice & hope you've built around mid-battle skill checks.
Most caster classes don't use their bonus action all that often.
Apart from throwing Caltrops, what is that Utilize action going to let you do?
Look, even if I got them reversed, it STILL feels like this isn't that strong due to action economy.
It's overpowered for a cantrip because of the action economy. It turns a bonus action into a regular action. Utilize is almost certainly the part that's most concerning.
Apart from throwing Caltrops, what is that Utilize action going to let you do?
Honestly, I have no idea, but the others are of limited utility to repeat. If you have something to do with Utilize, you can do it every turn, while still taking a regular action. It's concerning because the space of the Utilize action is potentially very large.
Apart from throwing Caltrops, what is that Utilize action going to let you do?
The utilize action winds up with a power level that is rather variable and unpredictable. Honestly, most of the time it's going to be marginal to useless, but there's a significant risk of unexpected interactions. The ability to move around within your space is also likely to produce a lot of arguments unless the DM just decides it's meaningless flavor text.
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Someone with keen mind is level 4+ and took a feat, which is a much steeper investment than a cantrip.
But I think we’re saying the same thing, this spell is giving away something that otherwise has a much larger resource cost.
The actual rule for that in the PHB is here. If your human bard character, Gene Frenkle, wants to "explore his space", he's still not leaving the 5x5 area he controls in combat
Active characters:
Edoumiaond Willegume "Eddie" Podslee, Vegetanian scholar (College of Spirits bard)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Peter "the Pied Piper" Hausler, human con artist/remover of vermin (Circle of the Shepherd druid)
PIPA - Planar Interception/Protection Aeormaton, warforged bodyguard and ex-wizard hunter (Warrior of the Elements monk/Cartographer artificer)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
Battlemasters can do it without a check, and you can only Utilize something on your person, so I don't think it's that powerful.
It's not super powerful. It just exceeds the budget for what is reasonable to do with a cantrip, because cantrips are very low value (the effect is comparable in value to an origin feat. An origin feat can get you two cantrips and a level 1 spell).
You could make it balanced. I would probably just say
That's on the level of a reasonable cantrip.
Look, even if I got them reversed, it STILL feels like this isn't that strong due to action economy.
Your BA can be used for better things & spells than a chance to pass or fail a D20 Test.
You'd have to build around the finicky rules regarding casting 2 spells per turn, and/or sacrifice using class & species features just so you can roll the dice & hope you've built around mid-battle skill checks.
DM, player & homebrewer(Current homebrew project is an unofficial conversion of SBURB/SGRUB from Homestuck into DND 5e)
Once made Maxwell's Silver Hammer come down upon Strahd's head to make sure he was dead.
Always study & sharpen philosophical razors. They save a lot of trouble.
It's overpowered for a cantrip because of the action economy. It turns a bonus action into a regular action. Utilize is almost certainly the part that's most concerning.
Most caster classes don't use their bonus action all that often.
Apart from throwing Caltrops, what is that Utilize action going to let you do?
Honestly, I have no idea, but the others are of limited utility to repeat. If you have something to do with Utilize, you can do it every turn, while still taking a regular action. It's concerning because the space of the Utilize action is potentially very large.
The utilize action winds up with a power level that is rather variable and unpredictable. Honestly, most of the time it's going to be marginal to useless, but there's a significant risk of unexpected interactions. The ability to move around within your space is also likely to produce a lot of arguments unless the DM just decides it's meaningless flavor text.