Monstrous Compendium Vol. 1: Spelljammer Creatures
Frozen Sick
D&D Beyond Basic Rules
Basic Rules (2014)
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The adventure I'm working on has an OC Demon Lord as our Big Bad, and I've pulled in EVERY in universe book that covers demons the best. Including the Demonomicon of Iggwilv. But I doubt Tasha will let just anyone read her book free of charge. For this adventure, she contacts the PC's because she has a vested interest in stopping the OC Demon Lord, and sees the PC's as allies for this. But requires them to do something for her in return for allowing them to read her book.
That being said, I have every known Demon Lord as an option for PC's who are Warlocks and I'm curious about what Tasha would do or react to a PC who has her lover as a patron. I've even decided that if I have a Warlock PC with Graz'zt as their patron, Graz'zt is the one who instructs them to find Tasha.
To answer your question, it is entirely up to you as the DM. A lot of that will be driven by how you want to play the characters.
Personally, I think she might be bemused - her and Graz’zt’s relationship is typically seen as… let us just say they both know exactly what they’re looking for out of the liaison, and it is not romance. Theirs is a relationship of competition - often ripe with forced imprisonment and some pretty twisted dynamics that work for them, but are not exactly what most folks would consider healthy in a relationship. Some little tiny warlock plaything that does not know what they’re getting into and is never going to be any real threat to the Witch Queen? A trifling amusement at best.
But the real answer to your question is this: Do not bother speculating on what might happen. If a player never picks this option, it does not matter. And if a player does, you’re going to have to rewrite the answer to frame it in terms of how the player envisions their backstory anyway. This kind of advance speculation is a waste of time at best and, at worst, gives the DM preconceptions they then try to force on a player, interfering with the player’s agency in creating their own backstory.
That would be a fun development, especially depending on which era of Tasha's history you're drawing from.
If she's still operating as a witch, she might view the PC as an asset, either working alongside them or leveraging them to gather information and power. If you're in her demon lord period, she and Graz'zt could treat the PC like a plaything between them, assigning strange arcane tasks that amount to petty digs at each other, or thinly veiled attempts at flirting. And if you're playing with her fey incarnation, she might look at the warlock with outright pity.
Either way, the tension between former lovers and the PC caught in the middle creates some roleplay opportunities.
Probably it will depend a lot on if he's been remembering to put the toilet seat back down lately.
Seriously though, if one considers the sardonic quips in TCoE as canon, that might be a line she would use if you decide they are currently on the outs. My head canon always had them in a sort of make-up/break-up situationship. But as always, make it what you want. You can always decide they don't mean anything to each other and never have if you don't want the complication. Or have them have kids. What version of them will make the story more interesting without getting in the way and sucking up too much time from the PCs?
Oh, they have a shit ton of kids and cambions together already. Iuz the Destroyer being one of them.
"You're not chaotic evil! You're just chaotic SHIT!"
This is probably better in the Story & Lore subforum, lots of theorycrafting in there.
Thanks.
As I have said in a related post on the Warlock discussion forum, regarding warlocks and their choice of patrons, a devil will be willing to dine with a warlock with the goal of gradually guiding the warlock down a very slippery slope into eventual, terminal and fatal damnation. A demon, on the other hand, will be bored by the long term temptation and simply devour the warlock, body, mind and soul in a few minutes.
I mean, not every demon is all crazy attention defici- MURDER!!!!! all the time. A lot of the big names can play a long game, although they're still more prone to be swayed by a passing whim or feeling.
Okay. My point was that a devil usually has a sufficiently patient temperament to savor the thought of eventually dining on your soul after it has been sufficiently sullied and defiled by a life time of ignoble deeds, so that no denizen of the Upper Planes will have any thing to do with your soul after you die.
A demon, though, usually does not want to wait that long to devour your soul.
A devil is willing to wait for a medium rare filet mignon, with a baked Yukon Gold potato dripping with chilled sour cream and a nice glass or two of merlot style wine. A demon wants a couple McDonald's Quarter Pounders, a large bag of fries and a jumbo Coke, to go........NOW!
This is a great idea and great campaign. I would use the PC as the in-between in some petty will-they-won't-they high school lovers drama. Make them carry love notes or maybe Tasha pretends to cheat on the Demon Lord with the PC or vice versa setting up the other as a temporary villain. I hope it works out for you.
On a side note Tasha is ridiculously evil. She turns every potion into a spell rather than turning spells into potions. It is insanity! My rivalry is a professional one as she could have truly been the best of the best when it comes to Alchemy but her desire to do away with apothecary altogether is an out right curse to the profession. What a pity all that wasted talent is.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
Interesting view point. So, would that be the idea behind the Level 6 spell in the 2024 PHB, that is entitled "Tasha's Bubbling Cauldron"? My warlock PC really loves that spell because it permits him to conjure each day about five(5) potions of greater healing. (My warlock has a Charisma score of 20, which has a modifier of 5, which is how he conjures five(5) potions each time). Normally, a potion of greater healing costs about 250 gold, so five such potions would cost 250 x 5, or about 1250 gold.
Ah, yes, this is the same warlock who is on very extended trip through the Feywild, serving as one of the prime examples of why, (as that great sage, Puck, once remarked), "What fools these mortals be".
Ah, but you see you are using magic to produce a potion not Alchemy. This would put you under the thumb of Mystra who could prevent the spell from working all together. Pure Alchemy on the other hand is something that operates outside all that. The only time magic is involved is when you brew the potion and even then Mystra cannot stop you from brewing the potion. All she can do is know you are going to brew a potion six months before you brew it and then afterwards she has no idea when, by whom, or where that potion will be used, and she can only do this with potions that replicate an Arcane spell. If Tasha had gone pure Alchemist she wouldn't be subject to Mystra's magical restrictions.
Oh, and an Alchemist can craft those at 100gp in 2.5 days or less with the right Feats and Origin.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
No, using magic to make a potion is still alchemy. That's what distinguishes alchemy from mundane chemistry.
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Ah, friend, you did not read the FULL description of that spell in the 2024 PHB. Those potions that my warlock conjures will last only until my warlock casts that spell again. A REAL alchemist can make potions that last for days, weeks and months, while these conjured potions last only until the Bubbling Cauldron is conjured into being again.
This may well be Tasha's grand scheme: to pull off a stunt that circumvents what arcane governs and what achemy governs.
As for Mystra, I suspect she might be overruled by the Grand Supreme Overseer of the Forgotten Realms, not Elminster, not Ao, but rather the Wizards of the Coast director in charge of the D&D game.
That is what I was saying. I think I just botched my communication roll.
Yes, exactly Alchemist make potions that are permanent too but mainly that the spell isn't a replacement for real Alchemy. Which is what Tasha has been doing replacing real Alchemy with spells that replicate Alchemy. This is why she is evil she is ruining the trade of Alchemy.
As for Mystra, she controls all of magic but potions are not magical. This is why there are spells that still exist as potions from 1st or 2nd edition in the game despite Mystra's restrictions. By using magic instead of learning how to be better Alchemist Tasha placed herself under the thumb of Mystra who can restrictions her magic. If she wanted to replace Mystra, whichI do think she does want to, then she would have to get Ao to determine Mystra is unfit to control the Weave and then ascend Tasha.
Now, I understand this is my character and not cannon but when I was a member of Ed Greenwood's Discord as a Protector of the Realms I told him my character was praying to Ao to ascend as the Drug Lord or patron of pharmaceuticals, synthetics, and narcotics since there isn't anyone controlling those things as part of their Domain. It seemed easier to ascend as the deity over something that currently is in game but unregulated. We spoke about it and he put out a related newsletter about drugs, diseases, and medicine in the Realms. So, I know Ao heard my prayer and I know I was the first one to realize the deities are fighting to control alchemy as well as the first to realize drugs are totally unregulated. I think that give me a leg up and I've been running a campaign (21 groups have played through it) that leads up to the ascent but not the ascent itself. I figured WotC would need to officially bestow the title of Drug Lord to me so until then I've just been capturing players to take to Maztica as slaves for the largest drug cartel the Realma has ever known. ... oh and I am not evil. I am neutral. Some drugs like aspirin or diabetes medication are good but my wife did steal my company and now makes bad drugs which is why I want to regulate it all. Although I do smoke Ginyak and use these things recreationally in game. In moderation its all good. Dosages just need to be regulated.
I am looking to run another group but I think this time I want to do a play by post. I got off Discord as part of a boycott of systematic racism in the State they are headquartered in. I just got into a play by post and I'm going to see how it feels for the next week or so. If it is Kosher then I'll run the campaign again.
"Life is Cast by Random Dice"
Burn my candle twice.
I have done my life justice
Against random dice.
It's not like there have been multiple Mystras over the course of editions or anything. With slightly different policies.
DM, player & homebrewer(Current homebrew project is an unofficial conversion of SBURB/SGRUB from Homestuck into DND 5e)
Once made Maxwell's Silver Hammer come down upon Strahd's head to make sure he was dead.
Always study & sharpen philosophical razors. They save a lot of trouble.
Potions are not magical!?
Is this now canon or simply some person's wishful thinking?
As far as there being a deity of pharmaceuticals and the like, I suspect that Chauntea (deity of agriculture), Silvanus (deity of the wild places), Gond (deity of crafters and artisans), Ilmater (deity of endurance) and Waukeen (deity of commerce), might have some thing to say about that, since pharmaceuticals and the like are derived from both cultivated and wild plants, the essential oils of each plant have to be extracted by a skilled artisan, then administered by a skilled physician and provided at a fair price. In the Real World, morphine and other potent pain relievers are collectively known as opiates because they are derived from a rather ugly looking plant known as the opium poppy. (The drugs known as heroin and hashish are also derived from the opium poppy. For a long, long time, small farms in Afghanistan supplied most of the world's opium, hashish and heroin.)
On a slightly disagreeable note, just where is Discord based? I would like to know just so I can be careful how I spend my money. If you would prefer not to respond, I do understand.
Granted, this is somewhat off topic.
A deity of pharmaceuticals would probably fall under the overall administration of Oghma (deity of knowledge) and would be part of the applied knowledge group of deities such as Gond (deity of crafters and artisans), Denier (deity of the written word and books), Milil (deity of poetry and song) and the Red Knight (deity of military strategy and tactics), as well as Mystra and Azuth, because magical study is a form of knowledge.
I would have no trouble with such a deity; it would simply increase the amount of cosmological mayhem. It would encourage the Healer background to expand to include knowledge of both beneficial and noxious plants. It would encourage the creation of a druidic circle that dealt with pharmaceutical production.
Interesting ideas. Does any one else have a comment?
California.
Dan is mad that Jewish people were labeled a race & not a religion by the state
DM, player & homebrewer(Current homebrew project is an unofficial conversion of SBURB/SGRUB from Homestuck into DND 5e)
Once made Maxwell's Silver Hammer come down upon Strahd's head to make sure he was dead.
Always study & sharpen philosophical razors. They save a lot of trouble.