"Perhaps," says Hareld, "but as he hasn't visited the School for a very long time, and I don't see why he would go there—the School is just as much against the worship of Arion as the Temple is."

"Yes, I had heard that Arion worshippers were anathema as well; and the School has always been against them. Do you know why that is? It's not like Set worship, after all."

[[ Does the empire suppress local religions in general, or absorb local ones when compatible, as the Romans did? ]]

Quote from AlaricBrand >>

"Yes, I had heard that Arion worshippers were anathema as well; and the School has always been against them. Do you know why that is? It's not like Set worship, after all."

[[ Does the empire suppress local religions in general, or absorb local ones when compatible, as the Romans did? ]]

[[The Empire suppresses all other religions.]]

Despite recent events, Minton is a devout Mithran, he gives Brand a friendly reminder of Mithran doctrine in which all other deities are considered ungodly; demons praying on the fallibility of man.

He then goes on to describe how the worship of Arion, the so-called First Sorcerer, as a means to gain magical power is considered by the School as taking a lesser path; one where true  knowledge about magick is kept hidden from the practitioner, who must perform strange rites to keep their god placated and their power intact.

"Interesting, yet such worship is obviously popular -- if dangerous -- among innate sorcerors?"

[[ I know this, Brand knows this, but he's interested in Minton's take]]

[[ Edit: It looks like a whole bunch of people have disappeared from World Anvil (eg. Koric Brand) ]]

Quote from AlaricBrand>>

"Interesting, yet such worship is obviously popular -- if dangerous -- among innate sorcerors?"

[[ I know this, Brand knows this, but he's interested in Minton's take]]

[[ Edit: It looks like a whole bunch of people have disappeared from World Anvil (eg. Koric Brand) ]]

[[Not gone, just moved. I am moving people from the 'Miscellaneous people' category to the appropriate part of the 'Locations and nations' category. If you can't find someone, start typing their name into the Search field in the upper left corner.]]

"And I never understood why," Minton says, sounding exasperated. "Arion's magic is all violence. Hardly the sort of thing you would want if you wanted to take a proper place in society. Take for example the 'Arion's Arrow' spell (my version of Magic Missile, which only available to followers of Arion in this world), which all the brash youngsters get lured into Arion's clutches by. Unless you plan to spend your life in the army, or as a mass murderer, how often are you going to be using that spell?"

Brand smiles, "You say this to the man carrying three visible daggers, and several hidden ones, along with sundry other items designed for murder and mayhem?"

He picks up his glass, and stares at the wine, his brow furrowed. "I was brought up a devout Mithran, and I see around me all the good things that the faithful do daily. But I have also seen more than my fair share evil things is my life: many were evil things that were done by 'good' men -- some, seemingly, beyond reproach. And I have seen good things done by men who would be deemed 'evil'. It seems to me that the Gods give us all tools to use as we see fit. It is how we use those tools that delineates good and evil."

He takes a sip from his glass and sets it down. "That is probably the limit of my philosophical understanding though."

"Don't get me wrong," says Hareld. "I understand the need for security, but really how many ways to hurt and kill people do you need? ... So many people get lured into Arion's clutches by the thought of personal power, when the very use of it will most likely get them into trouble they wouldn't get into if they had stayed on the straight and narrow."

Brand tilts his head to one side and smiles, "How many ways do I need? More than my enemies possess."

"But you are right...power calls to people, whether that be arms, magick, or wealth. And power that is easily achieved often has a hidden price."

His hand involuntarily grasps his bandolier where he keeps the stones. "It would seem that by this logic, money itself should be kept only for those who know how to wisely spend it, for fear that others would use it unwisely, or hurt someone with it."

"I do not follow," says Hareld. "Money can be used to get things built,  buy food... and it can be used by anyone. Arion's arrows can only be used for violence, and only by a select few."

"It could also be used to hunt food, strike down evil, and protect the innocent." Glancing at the now vacant table, "Money on the other hand can be used to corrupt morals, and encourage others into acts that are even more evil."

Reflecting on the previous night, he adds "The mere promise of money can lead men down an evil path. The fact it can be used by anyone makes it, potentially, a greater corrupting influence."

Then he shrugs and smiles, "In honesty, I like money and would hate for it to be replaced or taken from me! But I do believe that evil lies in the hearts and actions of men and women, not so much in what or whom they know. Otherwise what I have seen of the world can not be reconciled."

"You, of all people, must have some sense of what I am speaking about."

[[  I've pretty much covered all I wanted to in the Inn...if you like we con continue/finish meal and the conversation can happen in streets? ]]

Hareld smiles and then gets serious, "Bad thoughts can occur to the best of us," he says, "It is those that act on them that are the dangerous ones."

Then, after a moment, he adds, "What I find is reprehensible in the adherents of Arion is that they promote personal power over using magic for the common good... It was not Arion who gave man the knowledge to use magick for good. It was the first prophets of Mithra and Aieda who taught us how to do the rituals of magick that purified our water and detected disease when our people first came to this world. Rituals that anyone can do with the proper training. Meanwhile, Arion just panders to sorcerers, giving them more power when they already have more than normal people."

"I think we can agree that promoting personal power over the common good is something that is damaging in all walks of life; I think you agreed yesterday that every group contains bad eggs -- you were speaking of Seekers at the time. The evils are committed by people."

"Perhaps you are right: if Arion actively attracts such people, then the worship should indeed be stamped out. It's not been my experience of those of his followers I have met, but I have only met a small number."

"What of religions like Azura? They are healers, and I, and several of my friends, owe our lives to their ministrations. Not to mention the numerous guards who fought alongside Wamzut and the rest of us killing the High Priest of Set and his undead minions. They most certainly were a force for good."

[[ Brand is exaggerating a little here: I think he was uninjured, but Dworkin was, soldiers were, and Dai San died. The priestess of Azura did heal Brand another time, IIRC...but it's hazy. ]]

[[ Edit: I could also be mistaken. There were two ex-PCs : Hugh Hanghop and Issatyx(sp?); Hugh was the one we killed. Issatyx was nowhere in sight. There was the possibility Hugh made it *look* like we succeeded in killing him. I *think* he was a priest of Set, but it could have been Arion. ]]

[[ Edit 2: Just browsing World Anvil. Previously you had (and still have) Bank of Engle as the local bank, located in the Mercantile District. You now also have the Bank of Constantine which seems to be the same thing, but in Temple district.

Am I correct in assuming that's the Bank of Srendon (Constantine Branch)?]]

Quote from AlaricBrand >>

"I think we can agree that promoting personal power over the common good is something that is damaging in all walks of life; I think you agreed yesterday that every group contains bad eggs -- you were speaking of Seekers at the time. The evils are committed by people."

"Perhaps you are right: if Arion actively attracts such people, then the worship should indeed be stamped out. It's not been my experience of those of his followers I have met, but I have only met a small number."

"What of religions like Azura? They are healers, and I, and several of my friends, owe our lives to their ministrations. Not to mention the numerous guards who fought alongside Wamzut and the rest of us killing the High Priest of Set and his undead minions. They most certainly were a force for good."

[[ Brand is exaggerating a little here: I think he was uninjured, but Dworkin was, soldiers were, and Dai San died. The priestess of Azura did heal Brand another time, IIRC...but it's hazy. ]]

[[ Edit: I could also be mistaken. There were two ex-PCs : Hugh Hanghop and Issatyx(sp?); Hugh was the one we killed. Issatyx was nowhere in sight. There was the possibility Hugh made it *look* like we succeeded in killing him. I *think* he was a priest of Set, but it could have been Arion. ]]

[[Hugh Hanghop was definitely a priest of Set. Isatics was something else. Make a Wisdom check to see if Brand remembers/ever found out.]]

[[ Edit 2: Just browsing World Anvil. Previously you had (and still have) Bank of Engle as the local bank, located in the Mercantile District. You now also have the Bank of Constantine which seems to be the same thing, but in Temple district.

Am I correct in assuming that's the Bank of Srendon (Constantine Branch)?]]

[[My fault, which I have now fixed—I think. Partly caused by the Bank of Sorenden needing an article for both it branch and it as an entity. The bank in the Temple Ward was the Constantine branch of the Bank of Sorenden.]]

"Priests of Asura?" says Hareld, frowning. "I've never heard of an Asura?"

"I don't know much, but they were peaceful, gentle and generous to the people of Ilbaris, and seemed capable of miraculous healing abilities. I would have sworn a friend would lose his arm, but with Wamzut's help, the priestess was able to restore his arm to full function."

"They saved many lives."

Wisdom re Isatics : 12

[[ What does Brand know about Asura...he would be circumspect due to Minton's bigotry...is this Warlock Territory? ]]

Quote from AlaricBrand >>

"I don't know much, but they were peaceful, gentle and generous to the people of Ilbaris, and seemed capable of miraculous healing abilities. I would have sworn a friend would lose his arm, but with Wamzut's help, the priestess was able to restore his arm to full function."

"They saved many lives."

Wisdom re Isatics : 15

[[This is Phill making up player character motivations retrospectively from the distant past and finagling them into the current setting: Isatics and Hugh Hanghop were collaborators. Hugh Hanghop was trying to revive worship of the snake god Set and called himself a priest of that dark god. They came into contact with Brand and the others on a joint mission to the temple of Set high on the Lonely Mountain. In retrospect, it seems likely to Brand that Isatics was in Hanghop's employ providing advice and magical assistance, but he is also sure that Isatics was not a follower of Hanghop, which would explain why he disappeared so suddenly when things started to go bad for Hanghop. Therefore, Brand probably knows that Isatics is an arcane magic user of some type, but not which type.]]

[[ What does Brand know about Asura...he would be circumspect due to Minton's bigotry...is this Warlock Territory? ]]

[[There are no publicly known temples to Asura. You will need to make a History check for Brand for anything more.]]

In reply, Hareld says, "It is strange that I have never heard of these people. What country do they come from?"

[[ If it helps, my recollection is that Isatics was nowhere in sight, and the fight was with Hugh. IIRC, Isatics was Arioch priest. BUT...and bug but...the history of these two was before MY time, and only related to Brand though "the party"...so happy to go with any interpretation. My best recollection of his personal involvement is as above: Hugh/Set/Undead Lizard men/snakes and VERY big fight. Formative event for Brand: he accidentally killed a "friendly" soldier (fumble with bow) and paid family 50e in compensation, which I *think* some was left with Veade because it would have made them targets of robbery. This experience is part of my basis for his current attitudes. ]]

History: (just wait for the roll in the 1-5 range): 18

[[ Edit: OMFG -- A roll I care about and it succeeded!!! ]]

[[ I assume the history rolls is for Minton's question....he *did* have dealings with them...wasn't there a temple in Ilbarsis??? ]]

Quote from AlaricBrand >>

[[ If it helps, my recollection is that Isatics was nowhere in sight, and the fight was with Hugh. IIRC, Isatics was Arioch priest. BUT...and bug but...the history of these two was before MY time, and only related to Brand though "the party"...so happy to go with any interpretation. My best recollection of his personal involvement is as above: Hugh/Set/Undead Lizard men/snakes and VERY big fight. Formative event for Brand: he accidentally killed a "friendly" soldier (fumble with bow) and paid family 50e in compensation, which I *think* some was left with Veade because it would have made them targets of robbery. This experience is part of my basis for his current attitudes. ]]y 

[[You remember this, but Brand doesn't. Isatics was indeed an Arioch/Arion priest.]]

History: (just wait for the roll in the 1-5 range): 24

[[ Edit: OMFG -- A roll I care about and it succeeded!!! ]]

[[ I assume the history rolls is for Minton's question....he *did* have dealings with them...wasn't there a temple in Ilbarsis??? ]]

[[Obviously Brand paid attention when this mother taught him the history of Sorenden, which is also in many ways the history of the Mithran faith, though I suspect that what she taught is not what he would have learned in Temple School. According to Brand's mother, Asura was a real person that existed in the time shortly after the original Sorendenese tribes came to this world. It is said that he was a very wise man and also one of the first priests of Mithra. However, he was later branded a heretic by the Temple and sent into exile, after which he was more or less written out of the formal history of the religion.

His heretical teachings, however, did have some adherents, and throughout Sorendenese history there have been rumours of a group or cult that acts in his name. This group's goal is to study the world and use their knowledge to help society in secret. Some people say that it is these followers of Asura's teaching who really developed the magical rituals that are used throughout Sorendenese society.  

With regard to a temple in Ilbarsis: there may have been a chapter of Asurans in Ilbarsis, but in the new setting, there would not have been an openly acknowledged temple.

And that's me for the night. Ciao.]] 

[[ Well, thanks mum! ]]

[[ This leads to the second part of the original question: ]]

[[ What does Brand know about Asura...he would be circumspect due to Minton's bigotry...is this Warlock Territory? ]]

 In reply, Hareld says, "It is strange that I have never heard of these people. What country do they come from?"

[[ Assuming that they were in Ilbarsis, and that they did do healing as per MY recollection: ]]

"I'm a little surprised that Wamzut never mentioned them? Did he really never do so?"

Quote from AlaricBrand >>

[[ Well, thanks mum! ]]

[[ This leads to the second part of the original question: ]]

[[ What does Brand know about Asura...he would be circumspect due to Minton's bigotry...is this Warlock Territory? ]]

[[How would Brand know? The 'priests' would have used magic or performed miracles to do what they did, but Brand would have no idea as to where this power was coming from.]]

---

 In reply, Hareld says, "It is strange that I have never heard of these people. What country do they come from?"

[[ Assuming that they were in Ilbarsis, and that they did do healing as per MY recollection: ]]

"I'm a little surprised that Wamzut never mentioned them? Did he really never do so?"

Hareld shakes his head. "No. Did you see these people in Ilbarsis?"

"Thisbwas many months ago. I'm not sure where they were from, nor where they were going, though I suspect that they were heading north to escape persecution. But we were lucky that that came by when they did. My point is that they are an example of what I was talking about: people who followed other ways, yet  did great good for the people as they passed through."

Brand looks around the restaurant, perhaps delaying his words if others are listening, then lowers his voice. "Have you asked yourself to what extent the current purge us driven by someone's desire to increase their power, rather than the desire to help the people?"

[[How would Brand know? The 'priests' would have used magic or performed miracles to do what they did, but Brand would have no idea as to where this power was coming from.]]

[[ It is i suppose a question about rules as much as anything else, IIRC warlocks are about pacts with extra planar beings. Could that include humans? Given what he knows about planes etc and what he has learnt from Nathaniel, would an extra planar human count? ]]