Hey guys. Just curious about why tigers, panthers and cats don't have dark vision.. I mean realistically shouldn't they? I've always found this odd in the beastiary. If someone polymorph /beast shapes into it I usually add that on as a perk. But what are your guesses? Is there an errata I missed? Let me know!
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It'd be nice if the rules represented reality a bit better, but it's not something I stress over because it is very easy for me as a DM to just say "Of course it doesn't have any trouble seeing in dim light, it's a cat" or the like while playing.
Concur with others, the natural animals that are nocturnal or at least tend to hunt at night or in the darkness should at least have low light vision. There are only so many times a DM can over-ride the books without giving up on using the books.
Description of Darkvision: "A monster with darkvision can see in the dark within a specific radius. The monster can see in dim light within the radius as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light. The monster can't discern color in darkness, only shades of gray."
A quick search of any reputable source on felines will corroborate that cats need only 1/6 of the light that humans do in order to see. They are quite nearsighted though, having somewhere in the neighborhood of 20/100 vision. (They can see at 20 ft what humans can see at 100 ft) Cats also have a wider peripheral vision than we do.
Plausible Darkvision update for feline in 5e: Cats have darkvision and can see in dim light up to 40 feet as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light.
I suspect that the reason has to do with game balance. Wizards is much more concerned with balance than with real world accuracy. For starters, Fireball doesn't really exist.
Darkvision is LowLight vision. They stopped having multiple "types of vision" after 3.5e, and just collapsed them.
As for why cats don't have it when "eyes like a cat" is the metaphorical definition of seeing in the dark. Heck, the cat-people have Darkvision! The description in the text is literally "You have a cat’s keen senses, especially in the dark."
Tiger *do* have Darkvision, other cats don't... I assume it was just forgotten rather then came balance. Cats are mostly nocturnal and have a tapetum lucidum, anything with a tapetum lucidum would have Darkvision. Yes, tapetum lucidum does need light can doesn't work in a lightless environment, but 5e is designed for streamlined modelling not accuracy.
You could also argue they could have 5' of blindsense with whiskers and smell, but then you have to think about the sense of every animal real and mythic.
I suspect that the reason has to do with game balance. Wizards is much more concerned with balance than with real world accuracy. For starters, Fireball doesn't really exist.
But there's a difference for a fantasy game between the 'things that aren't real' like fireball, and 'things that aren't real' like cats not having nightvision. It would be like adding "Owls are fantastic swimmers" to the Owl description. :) There are certain parts of the standard D&D world are that supposed to be just like the things in the real world. I have a hard time envisioning the designers doing something like specifically taking away night vision for cats for balance reasons. "Man, these panthers are good beasts...but maybe a bit overpowered. Let's say they can't see in the dark." :D
The most baffling thing is that normal housecats don't have darkvision, but tressyms do... I recognize tressyms are more magical, but? Statistically they're basically awakened housecats with wings and poison immunity tacked on.
And then normal big cats (except tigers?) not having darkvision, but tabaxi do... and tabaxis are clearly more like humanoid leopards/panthers than humanoid tigers.
Honestly, I wonder if they just realized how dumb it was to not give all the cats darkvision after making the PHB/MM/etc, but felt they couldn't errata it in for some reason...
The most baffling thing is that normal housecats don't have darkvision, but tressyms do... I recognize tressyms are more magical, but? Statistically they're basically awakened housecats with wings and poison immunity tacked on.
And then normal big cats (except tigers?) not having darkvision, but tabaxi do... and tabaxis are clearly more like humanoid leopards/panthers than humanoid tigers.
Honestly, I wonder if they just realized how dumb it was to not give all the cats darkvision after making the PHB/MM/etc, but felt they couldn't errata it in for some reason...
They are the game designers. They post an annual errata... I'm pretty sure if they wanted to they could/would. I just don't think it really is even on a list of priorities. It's why I really don't have any forgiveness for how they handled the "IF THEN" statements of Shield Master, Polearm Master, and Two Weapon Fighting. Years later they decided to change their ruling to fit with a rules as written instead of how they meant it, and they could have just... rewritten those rules to not make them stupid. They don't.
Plausible Darkvision update for feline in 5e: Cats have darkvision and can see in dim light up to 40 feet as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light.
As DM, I’m updating my Druid’s wildshape felines to use this mechanic for darkvision. Thanks!
Hey guys. Just curious about why tigers, panthers and cats don't have dark vision.. I mean realistically shouldn't they? I've always found this odd in the beastiary. If someone polymorph /beast shapes into it I usually add that on as a perk. But what are your guesses? Is there an errata I missed? Let me know!
I mean, they don't actually see in the dark-dark, though, right? Not like infrared vision (which is how I always think of Darkvision).
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Low light vision seems appropriate to me
According to this, tiger has it.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/monsters/tiger
But it is the only one.
Owls, spiders, rats also have it.
It'd be nice if the rules represented reality a bit better, but it's not something I stress over because it is very easy for me as a DM to just say "Of course it doesn't have any trouble seeing in dim light, it's a cat" or the like while playing.
Concur with others, the natural animals that are nocturnal or at least tend to hunt at night or in the darkness should at least have low light vision. There are only so many times a DM can over-ride the books without giving up on using the books.
Thanks guys! Your opinion s are great!
Description of Darkvision: "A monster with darkvision can see in the dark within a specific radius. The monster can see in dim light within the radius as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light. The monster can't discern color in darkness, only shades of gray."
A quick search of any reputable source on felines will corroborate that cats need only 1/6 of the light that humans do in order to see. They are quite nearsighted though, having somewhere in the neighborhood of 20/100 vision. (They can see at 20 ft what humans can see at 100 ft) Cats also have a wider peripheral vision than we do.
Plausible Darkvision update for feline in 5e: Cats have darkvision and can see in dim light up to 40 feet as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light.
I suspect that the reason has to do with game balance. Wizards is much more concerned with balance than with real world accuracy. For starters, Fireball doesn't really exist.
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Darkvision is LowLight vision. They stopped having multiple "types of vision" after 3.5e, and just collapsed them.
As for why cats don't have it when "eyes like a cat" is the metaphorical definition of seeing in the dark. Heck, the cat-people have Darkvision! The description in the text is literally "You have a cat’s keen senses, especially in the dark."
Tiger *do* have Darkvision, other cats don't... I assume it was just forgotten rather then came balance. Cats are mostly nocturnal and have a tapetum lucidum, anything with a tapetum lucidum would have Darkvision. Yes, tapetum lucidum does need light can doesn't work in a lightless environment, but 5e is designed for streamlined modelling not accuracy.
You could also argue they could have 5' of blindsense with whiskers and smell, but then you have to think about the sense of every animal real and mythic.
If the Owl is allowed Dark Vision 120ft then Cats should get it too to at least 60ft.
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But there's a difference for a fantasy game between the 'things that aren't real' like fireball, and 'things that aren't real' like cats not having nightvision. It would be like adding "Owls are fantastic swimmers" to the Owl description. :) There are certain parts of the standard D&D world are that supposed to be just like the things in the real world. I have a hard time envisioning the designers doing something like specifically taking away night vision for cats for balance reasons. "Man, these panthers are good beasts...but maybe a bit overpowered. Let's say they can't see in the dark." :D
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The most baffling thing is that normal housecats don't have darkvision, but tressyms do... I recognize tressyms are more magical, but? Statistically they're basically awakened housecats with wings and poison immunity tacked on.
And then normal big cats (except tigers?) not having darkvision, but tabaxi do... and tabaxis are clearly more like humanoid leopards/panthers than humanoid tigers.
Honestly, I wonder if they just realized how dumb it was to not give all the cats darkvision after making the PHB/MM/etc, but felt they couldn't errata it in for some reason...
They are the game designers. They post an annual errata... I'm pretty sure if they wanted to they could/would. I just don't think it really is even on a list of priorities.
It's why I really don't have any forgiveness for how they handled the "IF THEN" statements of Shield Master, Polearm Master, and Two Weapon Fighting. Years later they decided to change their ruling to fit with a rules as written instead of how they meant it, and they could have just... rewritten those rules to not make them stupid. They don't.
As DM, I’m updating my Druid’s wildshape felines to use this mechanic for darkvision. Thanks!