I was curious how the Paladins Oath of Devotion ability "Sacred Weapon" interacts with the "Darkness" spell. I'm planning on playing a Sorcadin that mixes Oath of Devotion and the Shadow Sorcerer subclasses. I was hoping to use Darkness on my weapon in a pinch while still relying on my Sacred Weapon feature. The DM ruled that the Darkness spell would completely dispel the Oath of Devotion feature, but that I could reach out for advice and see where it leads. How does everyone else work this? RAW /RAI?
The sacred weapon would illuminate the area of darkness within the weapon's radius of light.
Here's why:
Darkness cannot be illuminated by non-magical light, but the sacred weapon is a magical source of light
Darkness can dispel a light-producing spell of level 2 or lower that overlaps with it, but sacred weapon is not a spell--it's a channel divinity feature.
See i would rule the same way as the DM of the OP since the light isnt magical it never says the light is magical in nature. RAW from the text
Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. For 1 minute, you add your Charisma modifier to attack rolls made with that weapon (with a minimum bonus of +1). The weapon also emits bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light 20 feet beyond that. If the weapon is not already magical, it becomes magical for the duration.
The weapon is magical but the light effect isnt by RAW. IMO it just clarifies that the weapon is magical for resistance purposes.
Regardless of the interaction between darkness and the light from the oath feature, there is no RAW reason why any other aspect of the Oath feature would be dispelled. The CHA mod effect and magical weapon effect don’t come from the light, they come from the channeled divine energy. There is nothing in the effect of Darkness that affects that at all.
With respect to whether the light is magical or not, note that all Oath effects from Channel Divinity are magical. Here’s the line from the rules re Channel Divinity:
”Your oath allows you to channel divine energy to fuel magical effects.”
So barring some exception that I’m not seeing, that would appear to apply in this case.
To me, darkness darkens exactly two kinds of light:
Light created by spells of level 2 or lower because it dispels them. This does not apply, since we can all agree sacred weapon is not a spell.
Non-magical light. To me, this would include light from non-magical sources like candles, torches, and campfires, but not from magical sources like flame tongue or the sacred weapon channel divinity feature.
Any light that does not fall into one of those two categories is not darkened by darkness, per its spell description.
He is saying that because the Darkness spell would remove the light, then it would remove the rest of the effects associated with the ability. As per this statement "If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled." Thanks for all your help everyone!
He is saying that because the Darkness spell would remove the light, then it would remove the rest of the effects associated with the ability. As per this statement "If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled." Thanks for all your help everyone!
Sacred Weapon is not a spell of 2nd level or lower and Darkness has no effect on it because of that. It isn't a spell at all and cannot even be "dispelled".
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I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Thanks for everyone's help! I've forwarded this thread and a pile of research along to him so I think I'm in the clear. Appreciate it!
Depends on what you mean by in the clear tbh. The darkness spell creates a 15ft radius of darkness while Sacred Weapon makes light in a 20+20ft radius so there really wouldn't be any area of darkness left. Of course darkness is up for 10 minutes while Sacred Weapon is only going for 1 minute so you could still get the benefits of darkness for the other 9 minutes. Just remember you'll still need to do concentration checks (if needed) while Sacred Weapon is going.
DARKNESS: "Magical darkness spreads from a point you choose within range to fill a 15-foot-radius sphere for the duration. The darkness spreads around corners. A creature with darkvision can't see through this darkness, and nonmagical light can't illuminate it. If the point you choose is on an object you are holding or one that isn't being worn or carried, the darkness emanates from the object and moves with it. Completely covering the source of the darkness with an opaque object, such as a bowl or a helm, blocks the darkness. If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled."
1) Darkness specifies that "nonmagical" light can not illuminate it. The corollary of this is that magical light CAN illuminate it.
2) If the magical light coming from an area of light provided by a spell of 2nd level or lower overlaps an area of magical darkness then that magical light source is dispelled.
That is all darkness says.
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Is Sacred Weapon a spell? No. Sacred Weapon is a Channel Divinity. Is Sacred Weapon magical? Yes because all Channel Divinity effects are magical.
CHANNEL DIVINITY: "Your oath allows you to channel divine energy to fuel magical effects"
SACRED WEAPON: "Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. For 1 minute, you add your Charisma modifier to attack rolls made with that weapon (with a minimum bonus of +1). The weapon also emits bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light 20 feet beyond that. If the weapon is not already magical, it becomes magical for the duration."
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So how do these interact?
Does Darkness prevent the light from Sacred Weapon? No - because it is magical light and it is not produced by a spell of second level or lower. The light from sacred weapon illuminates the Darkness.
Does Sacred Weapon dispel the Darkness spell? No - nothing in the rules indicates that this would happen.
If the character casts Darkness on their sword they are surrounded by a 15' radius sphere of darkness. If they then use Sacred Weapon on the same weapon, the magical light from the weapon illuminates the area filled with magical Darkness (20' radius bright light and an extra 20' of dim light). The Darkness spell is still running (as long as concentration is maintained) and when the Sacred Weapon channel divinity ends the character will again be in an area of 15' radius magical darkness but while the Sacred Weapon effect is up, the Darkness is suppressed or over written by the effect of the magical illumination. While Sacred Weapon is in use, there is no more magical Darkness.
Hello all,
I was curious how the Paladins Oath of Devotion ability "Sacred Weapon" interacts with the "Darkness" spell. I'm planning on playing a Sorcadin that mixes Oath of Devotion and the Shadow Sorcerer subclasses. I was hoping to use Darkness on my weapon in a pinch while still relying on my Sacred Weapon feature. The DM ruled that the Darkness spell would completely dispel the Oath of Devotion feature, but that I could reach out for advice and see where it leads. How does everyone else work this? RAW /RAI?
Thanks!
The sacred weapon would illuminate the area of darkness within the weapon's radius of light.
Here's why:
"Not all those who wander are lost"
See i would rule the same way as the DM of the OP since the light isnt magical it never says the light is magical in nature. RAW from the text
Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. For 1 minute, you add your Charisma modifier to attack rolls made with that weapon (with a minimum bonus of +1). The weapon also emits bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light 20 feet beyond that. If the weapon is not already magical, it becomes magical for the duration.
The weapon is magical but the light effect isnt by RAW. IMO it just clarifies that the weapon is magical for resistance purposes.
Regardless of the interaction between darkness and the light from the oath feature, there is no RAW reason why any other aspect of the Oath feature would be dispelled. The CHA mod effect and magical weapon effect don’t come from the light, they come from the channeled divine energy. There is nothing in the effect of Darkness that affects that at all.
With respect to whether the light is magical or not, note that all Oath effects from Channel Divinity are magical. Here’s the line from the rules re Channel Divinity:
”Your oath allows you to channel divine energy to fuel magical effects.”
So barring some exception that I’m not seeing, that would appear to apply in this case.
To me, darkness darkens exactly two kinds of light:
Any light that does not fall into one of those two categories is not darkened by darkness, per its spell description.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
He is saying that because the Darkness spell would remove the light, then it would remove the rest of the effects associated with the ability. As per this statement "If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled." Thanks for all your help everyone!
Sacred Weapon is not a spell of 2nd level or lower and Darkness has no effect on it because of that. It isn't a spell at all and cannot even be "dispelled".
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Thanks for everyone's help! I've forwarded this thread and a pile of research along to him so I think I'm in the clear. Appreciate it!
Depends on what you mean by in the clear tbh. The darkness spell creates a 15ft radius of darkness while Sacred Weapon makes light in a 20+20ft radius so there really wouldn't be any area of darkness left. Of course darkness is up for 10 minutes while Sacred Weapon is only going for 1 minute so you could still get the benefits of darkness for the other 9 minutes. Just remember you'll still need to do concentration checks (if needed) while Sacred Weapon is going.
DARKNESS: "Magical darkness spreads from a point you choose within range to fill a 15-foot-radius sphere for the duration. The darkness spreads around corners. A creature with darkvision can't see through this darkness, and nonmagical light can't illuminate it. If the point you choose is on an object you are holding or one that isn't being worn or carried, the darkness emanates from the object and moves with it. Completely covering the source of the darkness with an opaque object, such as a bowl or a helm, blocks the darkness. If any of this spell's area overlaps with an area of light created by a spell of 2nd level or lower, the spell that created the light is dispelled."
1) Darkness specifies that "nonmagical" light can not illuminate it. The corollary of this is that magical light CAN illuminate it.
2) If the magical light coming from an area of light provided by a spell of 2nd level or lower overlaps an area of magical darkness then that magical light source is dispelled.
That is all darkness says.
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Is Sacred Weapon a spell? No. Sacred Weapon is a Channel Divinity. Is Sacred Weapon magical? Yes because all Channel Divinity effects are magical.
CHANNEL DIVINITY: "Your oath allows you to channel divine energy to fuel magical effects"
SACRED WEAPON: "Sacred Weapon. As an action, you can imbue one weapon that you are holding with positive energy, using your Channel Divinity. For 1 minute, you add your Charisma modifier to attack rolls made with that weapon (with a minimum bonus of +1). The weapon also emits bright light in a 20-foot radius and dim light 20 feet beyond that. If the weapon is not already magical, it becomes magical for the duration."
---
So how do these interact?
Does Darkness prevent the light from Sacred Weapon? No - because it is magical light and it is not produced by a spell of second level or lower. The light from sacred weapon illuminates the Darkness.
Does Sacred Weapon dispel the Darkness spell? No - nothing in the rules indicates that this would happen.
If the character casts Darkness on their sword they are surrounded by a 15' radius sphere of darkness. If they then use Sacred Weapon on the same weapon, the magical light from the weapon illuminates the area filled with magical Darkness (20' radius bright light and an extra 20' of dim light). The Darkness spell is still running (as long as concentration is maintained) and when the Sacred Weapon channel divinity ends the character will again be in an area of 15' radius magical darkness but while the Sacred Weapon effect is up, the Darkness is suppressed or over written by the effect of the magical illumination. While Sacred Weapon is in use, there is no more magical Darkness.
All the darkness spell cares is if it's nonmagical light or if it's light spell of 2nd level or lower.
A Sacred Weapon being neither of these do in fact illuminate an area of darkness normally.