If I take the PolearmMaster feat and cast Shillelagh while wielding a quarterstaff, what damage die is used for the weapon during the bonus action: "pole strike"?
Pole Strike. Immediately after you take the Attack action and attack with a Quarterstaff, a Spear, or a weapon that has the Heavy and Reach properties, you can use a Bonus Action to make a melee attack with the opposite end of the weapon. The weapon deals Bludgeoning damage, and the weapon’s damage die for this attack is a d4.
... A Club or Quarterstaff you are holding is imbued with nature’s power. For the duration, you can use your spellcasting ability instead of Strength for the attack and damage rolls of melee attacks using that weapon, and the weapon’s damage die becomes a d8.
The issue is neither rule specifies which one overrides the other.
So, does player get to choose the highest damage of the two?
The only rules related thing that might have some influence on the outcome is :
PHB: Chapter 1: Playing the Game -> Rhythm of Play -> Exceptions Supersede General Rules.
which says:
The game also includes elements—class features, feats, weapon properties, spells, magic items, monster abilities, and the like—that sometimes contradict a general rule. When an exception and a general rule disagree, the exception wins.
From there, it would seem that Shillelagh is more of a general rule saying "attacks" lower case increase weapon damage to 1d8, and PolearmMaster seems much more specific, describing a specific "Pole Strike" that the player can do as a bonus action, immediately following a action:attack and that it does 1d4 weapon damage.
I'd say that PAM is more specific than Shillelagh. Also, PAM is already a powerful feat, no need to boost it further by allowing a character to get a better damage die with it.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
The benefit from Polearm Master applies to the opposite end of the weapon and always uses a d4 for damage rather than the weapon’s normal damage die. This is true for a Quarterstaff enhanced with Shillelagh just as it is for a normal one.
I think RAI the damage die should remain a 1d4 for the bonus action attack.
However, RAW, I don't really get how people are saying one is "more specific" than the other. PAM says "the weapon's damage die for this attack is a d4", which is exactly as specific as the weapon itself (Quarterstaff) saying it does 1d6 bludgeoning damage. These are both specific values, and specified as "the weapon's damage die".
Shillelagh states that it specifically changes the "weapon's damage die" to a d8. The weapon you have is a quarterstaff, and it has two weapon dice: a d6 and a d4 depending on the attack (if you have PAM). As they are BOTH explicitly the weapon die of the quarterstaff, then the reading of Shillelagh would change both of them, as it does not specify "normal weapon die" or anything like that.
When the game says "specific beats general" it mostly seems to be saying that specific rules from spells and feats override the general rules that you would follow without the spell or feat taking effect. In the case of a spell versus a feat, I think they are both equally as "specific", so I guess at that point it is up to the DM to decide.
Normal quarterstaff does 1d6 dmg with one hand
If I take the PolearmMaster feat and cast Shillelagh while wielding a quarterstaff, what damage die is used for the weapon during the bonus action: "pole strike"?
The issue is neither rule specifies which one overrides the other.
So, does player get to choose the highest damage of the two?
The only rules related thing that might have some influence on the outcome is :
PHB: Chapter 1: Playing the Game -> Rhythm of Play ->
Exceptions Supersede General Rules.
which says:
From there, it would seem that Shillelagh is more of a general rule saying "attacks" lower case increase weapon damage to 1d8, and PolearmMaster seems much more specific, describing a specific "Pole Strike" that the player can do as a bonus action, immediately following a action:attack and that it does 1d4 weapon damage.
I'd say that PAM is more specific than Shillelagh. Also, PAM is already a powerful feat, no need to boost it further by allowing a character to get a better damage die with it.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Is not this question the same as the one you are discussing here? Shillelagh and Pole-Master, do work together according to RAW
Both the 2014 and 2024 SAC give the same answer:
I think RAI the damage die should remain a 1d4 for the bonus action attack.
However, RAW, I don't really get how people are saying one is "more specific" than the other. PAM says "the weapon's damage die for this attack is a d4", which is exactly as specific as the weapon itself (Quarterstaff) saying it does 1d6 bludgeoning damage. These are both specific values, and specified as "the weapon's damage die".
Shillelagh states that it specifically changes the "weapon's damage die" to a d8. The weapon you have is a quarterstaff, and it has two weapon dice: a d6 and a d4 depending on the attack (if you have PAM). As they are BOTH explicitly the weapon die of the quarterstaff, then the reading of Shillelagh would change both of them, as it does not specify "normal weapon die" or anything like that.
When the game says "specific beats general" it mostly seems to be saying that specific rules from spells and feats override the general rules that you would follow without the spell or feat taking effect. In the case of a spell versus a feat, I think they are both equally as "specific", so I guess at that point it is up to the DM to decide.
PAM invents something called a Pole Strike
Shillelagh says it applies to all "attacks".
They are both vaguely worded, and would be improved by clarifying language.