Monstrous Compendium Vol. 1: Spelljammer Creatures
Frozen Sick
D&D Beyond Basic Rules
Basic Rules (2014)
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Monstrous Compendium Vol. 1: Spelljammer CreaturesFrozen SickD&D Beyond Basic RulesBasic Rules (2014)Sign in to view your library & saved favorites.
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When you either cast shapechange or use the transformation granted by the boon of fluid form can you use your existing armor for AC calculations or do you have to use the AC of the new form?
Both features have this paragraph.
"Your game statistics are replaced by the stat block of the chosen form, but you retain your creature type; alignment; personality; Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma scores; Hit Points; Hit Point Dice; proficiencies; and ability to communicate. If you have the Spellcasting or Pact Magic feature, you retain it too. Upon shape-shifting, you determine whether your equipment drops to the ground or changes in size and shape to fit the new form while you’re in it."
So would you retain your armor proficiency because you retain your proficiencies? When you transform you decide if the equipment drops to the ground or changes size and shape to fit the new form. That sounds to me like a druid with +2 half-plate and a +2 shield should have them change in shape and size to fit the form of a dragon and since you retain your proficiencies you should be able use it. Since your dex would likely change it may not be as effective but without a dex mod those would give an AC of 21. That's likely better than whatever form you transform into.
Thoughts? It seems like this would be correct but counterintuitive. It also has implications for the humanoid forms and the hydra you would use with fluid forms.
While you retain your proficiencies and armor training alike, that doesn't mean your new shape can don such armor.
I assume the creature's AC is yours unless you can don an armor and calculate it differently.
The armor changes size and shape to fit the new form. It is by definition already donned since you had donned it before changing shape and it changes size and shape to accommodate your new form. For it to be doffed you either have to take the time it lists or have it fall to the ground when you shapechange. More importantly there is precedent for creatures using armor in the barding part of the mount section of the phb. Creatures that can be used as mounts would be able to use armor in the form of barding. Since the armor changes size and shape it makes sense to become some form of barding.
While magic items that are meant to be worn tend to magically adjust themselves to the wearer, if it's not made for its anatomy it doesn't mean ithe new shape can wear it. DM discretion is advised.
So it'd be up to DM to determine if a +2 Half-Plate can fit a Dragon's anatomy.
Personally i don't think so due to body shape, wings etc... A Large or Huge Humanoid shape such as a Giant or Ogre sure!
The problem with what you quoted is that it's about putting on magic armor. This is armor that is already being worn and changes size and shape to fit your new form as per the spell description. There is no question of whether you can wear it on or not because it's already being worn. Also you aren't addressing that there is half-plate that a dragon could wear without a spell changing it's size and shape. It's the barding form of half-plate. The anatomy argument makes no sense it's already being worn and there's a mechanic already in the game for strange anatomy to use armor. If the armor changes size and shape to fit the new form it would therefore fit whatever strange anatomy that form has. To add even more the strange anatomy rules are the general rule, shapechange/fluid forms are the specific rule and specific beats general.
If I understand your response, you asked a question then argued against the answers given? Why ask a question then?
Would you accept an answer that cites a rule that doesn't apply? If I asked you why can't I cast fireball twice in a turn using spell slots and quicken meta magic it would be silly if you said it's because you only have one action. That doesn't address the question and incorrectly cites a rule that doesn't apply.
You have clearly already decided that based on the paragraph you posted you can wear your armour thus keep your AC. So why are you asking the question? You clearly believe the rules are very clear and self-explanatory there.
I'll ask my question again. If the armor changes size and shape to fit your new form shouldn't you be able to use it? There's no issue with being able to don it because it's already donned so shouldn't you be able to use it for your AC? I'm asking to try to understand this interaction better. Also what are the implications of the new form wearing armor? What if you're in heavy armor and the new form doesn't have the strength requirement? Can you even cast spells in the new form with the armor on?
Rules as written I don't see a reason why you shouldn't be able to use it for your AC. The strange anatomy rule doesn't apply because the spell says the armor changes size and shape to fit the new form. The more I look at it the more I think it's a trap though. The spell and boon say you retain proficiencies but the wording for armor is armor training not armor proficiency. With the strictest reading of the rules you shouldn't retain armor training. When you wear armor you lack training in you have disadvantage on d20 tests that use strength and dex and can't cast spell. It seems to me that's how the interaction should play out with a strict reading of the rules.
Yeah considering equipment change shape as well it may supercede this rule but its best to validate with your DM anyway.
Unfortunately for this plan, armor training is not a proficiency and is not included in either ability description, and thus choosing to have your armor change shape with you will incur the standard penalties for wearing armor you are not proficient with.