In this scenario, the ranger wants to shoot the ghoul 40 feet in front of him, but directly in front of the ghoul,(on a battle map) is the warrior. Both the warrior and the ranger are generally the same height, so how would you go about dealing with this. Would the zombie have half-cover? Would there be a chance to hit the warrior?
May depend on DM, but since each squar of a grid gives you 5 feet to move in, I'd say the odds of hitting a friendly creature are somewhat low (maybe for a very low attack roll).
It is possible that it will have half cover, but I usually reserve that until there are more than one creature blocking.
If the warrior is a size category larger, then I would give the target cover (half or 3/4th depending on scenario).
A creature will generally take up roughly 1/4 of their area at any given time, or roughly 1/2 when viewed from the side.
With that in mind, I would say probably half cover if the target and the cover are roughly the same size and are directly in line with the shot. If the archer is able to move say 5 ft to the side for every 30 ft or so of distance, they will no longer get half cover.
It’s assumed that the warrior who is friendly with the Ranger works with him and moves to the side so the ranged attack hits it’s target.
It was that way in 4e, but no more. Any creature, be they hostile or allied, counts as cover, at least assuming they are at least the same size category.
"A target can benefit from cover only when an attack or other effect originates on the opposite side of the cover."
"A target with half cover has a +2 bonus to AC and Dexterity saving throws. A target has half cover if an obstacle blocks at least half of its body. The obstacle might be a low wall, a large piece of furniture, a narrow tree trunk, or a creature, whether that creature is an enemy or a friend."
DMG p 251
"COVER To determine whether a target has cover against an attack or other effect on a grid, choose a corner of the attacker's space or the point of origin of an area of effect. Then trace imaginary lines from that corner to every corner of any one square the target occupies. If one or two of those lines are blocked by an obstacle (including another creature), the target has half cover."
In the case of one medium size character on a grid firing at another medium size creature on a grid with a medium sized creature in between then there is a just less than 90 degree arc behind the blocking creature from the target where the target receives half cover since two lines of sight to corners of the target square will be blocked by the square containing the intervening creature based on this rule in the DMG for determining cover on grids. (It is just less than 90 degrees since the line of sights are taken from your choice of one corner of the attackers square/hex.
Basically, if you are anywhere behind a team mate firing into a melee then the target receives half cover.
This is actually most of the reason for the archery fighting style. The +2 from archery cancels the +2 half cover that should be applied in most combats where a ranged attacker is firing into a melee at a target behind a team mate. It is also why the sharpshooter feat is particularly good since you get to ignore half and three quarter cover. However, there are a lot of DMs that don't tend to use the cover rules properly, regularly making ranged attackers more powerful than they should be.
P.S. To answer the OP's question. The ghoul/zombie would have 1/2 cover if behind the warrior.
P.P.S. There is an optional rule in the DMG p272 on hitting cover.
"HITTING COVER When a ranged attack misses a target that has cover, you can use this optional rule to determine whether the cover was struck by the attack. First, determine whether the attack roll would have hit the protected target without the cover. If the attack roll falls within a range low enough to miss the target but high enough to strike the target if there had been no cover, the object used for cover is struck. If a creature is providing cover for the missed creature and the attack roll exceeds the AC of the covering creature, the covering creature is hit."
This rule is optional. In the base rules, there are no critical misses. If you miss, you miss, and the attack has no other effect. The above rule gives a way for an attack that misses a creature behind cover to possibly affect the cover. The chances are quite small for the most part and if the AC of the covering creature is equal to or higher than the target's AC then the covering creature can never be hit anyway based on this rule.
In a combat situation everybody is constantly moving. Miniatures on a battlemat are by definition static.
See page 251 of the DMG for the rules on determining the amount of cover on a battlemat grid. If the ghoul, the warrior and the ranger are in a straight line along the grid the ghoul should have at least half cover.
Dm's call on whether a shot that misses the ghoul has a chance to hit the warrior. My personal ruling would be that a shot that would have hit the ghoul but missed due to the AC adjustment for cover would attack the warrior instead with the same to hit roll. This would likely miss the warrior. If you want to be less generous assume the shot hits the warrior. I would use an attack with the same to hit roll agains the object providing cover (in this case the warrior) to give armor, etc, a chance to mitigate any damage. A "miss" against the warrior could indicate a shot that hit, but did not penetrate armor.
It always crosses my mind when someone shoots into melee or especially when there is grappling involved, but so far I have not applied any house rules to that situation.
It always crosses my mind when someone shoots into melee or especially when there is grappling involved, but so far I have not applied any house rules to that situation.
I honestly have never found anything other than hilarity and increased fun when using critical miss rules in cases like this. Honestly. Getting shot by your own archer in battle--particularly if that archer has been talking up his shooting prowess--is what makes all the prep work and pizza buying all worthwhile.
In this scenario, the ranger wants to shoot the ghoul 40 feet in front of him, but directly in front of the ghoul,(on a battle map) is the warrior. Both the warrior and the ranger are generally the same height, so how would you go about dealing with this. Would the zombie have half-cover? Would there be a chance to hit the warrior?
It’s assumed that the warrior who is friendly with the Ranger works with him and moves to the side so the ranged attack hits it’s target.
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now what if the warrior was a large creature? Would there be any change to how the ghoul is hit?
May depend on DM, but since each squar of a grid gives you 5 feet to move in, I'd say the odds of hitting a friendly creature are somewhat low (maybe for a very low attack roll).
It is possible that it will have half cover, but I usually reserve that until there are more than one creature blocking.
If the warrior is a size category larger, then I would give the target cover (half or 3/4th depending on scenario).
A creature will generally take up roughly 1/4 of their area at any given time, or roughly 1/2 when viewed from the side.
With that in mind, I would say probably half cover if the target and the cover are roughly the same size and are directly in line with the shot. If the archer is able to move say 5 ft to the side for every 30 ft or so of distance, they will no longer get half cover.
The DMG gives the rules for this in the "Using Miniatures" section.
It was that way in 4e, but no more. Any creature, be they hostile or allied, counts as cover, at least assuming they are at least the same size category.
I am one with the Force. The Force is with me.
PHB p196
"A target can benefit from cover only when an attack or other effect originates on the opposite side of the cover."
"A target with half cover has a +2 bonus to AC and Dexterity saving throws. A target has half cover if an obstacle blocks at least half of its body. The obstacle might be a low wall, a large piece of furniture, a narrow tree trunk, or a creature, whether that creature is an enemy or a friend."
DMG p 251
"COVER
To determine whether a target has cover against an attack or other effect on a grid, choose a corner of the attacker's space or the point of origin of an area of effect. Then trace imaginary lines from that corner to every corner of any one square the target occupies. If one or two of those lines are blocked by an obstacle (including another creature), the target has half cover."
In the case of one medium size character on a grid firing at another medium size creature on a grid with a medium sized creature in between then there is a just less than 90 degree arc behind the blocking creature from the target where the target receives half cover since two lines of sight to corners of the target square will be blocked by the square containing the intervening creature based on this rule in the DMG for determining cover on grids. (It is just less than 90 degrees since the line of sights are taken from your choice of one corner of the attackers square/hex.
Basically, if you are anywhere behind a team mate firing into a melee then the target receives half cover.
This is actually most of the reason for the archery fighting style. The +2 from archery cancels the +2 half cover that should be applied in most combats where a ranged attacker is firing into a melee at a target behind a team mate. It is also why the sharpshooter feat is particularly good since you get to ignore half and three quarter cover. However, there are a lot of DMs that don't tend to use the cover rules properly, regularly making ranged attackers more powerful than they should be.
P.S. To answer the OP's question. The ghoul/zombie would have 1/2 cover if behind the warrior.
P.P.S. There is an optional rule in the DMG p272 on hitting cover.
"HITTING COVER
When a ranged attack misses a target that has cover, you can use this optional rule to determine whether the cover was struck by the attack. First, determine whether the attack roll would have hit the protected target without the cover. If the attack roll falls within a range low enough to miss the target but high enough to strike the target if there had been no cover, the object used for cover is struck. If a creature is providing cover for the missed creature and the attack roll exceeds the AC of the covering creature, the covering creature is hit."
This rule is optional. In the base rules, there are no critical misses. If you miss, you miss, and the attack has no other effect. The above rule gives a way for an attack that misses a creature behind cover to possibly affect the cover. The chances are quite small for the most part and if the AC of the covering creature is equal to or higher than the target's AC then the covering creature can never be hit anyway based on this rule.
In a combat situation everybody is constantly moving. Miniatures on a battlemat are by definition static.
See page 251 of the DMG for the rules on determining the amount of cover on a battlemat grid. If the ghoul, the warrior and the ranger are in a straight line along the grid the ghoul should have at least half cover.
Dm's call on whether a shot that misses the ghoul has a chance to hit the warrior. My personal ruling would be that a shot that would have hit the ghoul but missed due to the AC adjustment for cover would attack the warrior instead with the same to hit roll. This would likely miss the warrior. If you want to be less generous assume the shot hits the warrior. I would use an attack with the same to hit roll agains the object providing cover (in this case the warrior) to give armor, etc, a chance to mitigate any damage. A "miss" against the warrior could indicate a shot that hit, but did not penetrate armor.
It always crosses my mind when someone shoots into melee or especially when there is grappling involved, but so far I have not applied any house rules to that situation.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
I honestly have never found anything other than hilarity and increased fun when using critical miss rules in cases like this. Honestly. Getting shot by your own archer in battle--particularly if that archer has been talking up his shooting prowess--is what makes all the prep work and pizza buying all worthwhile.
Looking for new subclasses, spells, magic items, feats, and races? Opinions welcome :)
Yeah: if an archer rolls a 1 while shooting into a grapple, most of my players expect Things.