Yoooooo. I have a lot of options going forward with this character so I'm hoping I can get some help.
Assuming we'll get to level 20, my character, who started off as a a Lore bard, will have at least 2 levels of Draconic Sorceror, likely more, but I'm hoping to work out which level combination works best for me to get a good progression so I don't feel like he's lacking compared to the rest of the party
Some other bits of information:
-Currently he is level 7 (6 Bard 1 Sorceror) and only a session or two away from level 8, which I plan to take Sorceror in.
-For his Additional Magical Secrets I picked Healing Spirit and Spirit Guardians (Our cleric had an in game reason to leave and her player replaced her with a Wizard, making my guy the primary healer)
-Our current party is a Vengeance Paladin, an Open Hand Monk, a thief Rogue, a Wizard, and a Beastmaster Ranger
-Dm has a house rule that lets me cast any spell in bard or sorcerer table as long as I'm a high enough class level to cast the spell. (So currently, 3rd level Bard spells and 1st level sorc spells & all cantrips from both) So spell selection isn't much of a problem outside of magical secrets.
So my possible option for multiclassing the rest of the way are:
Bard 19 Sorc 1
Bard 18 Sorc 2
Bard 17 Sorc 3
Bard 16 Sorc 4
Bard 15 Sorc 5
Bard 14 Sorc 6 (What I'm most sold on at the moment)
I'd rather not go further than that to allow for the two sets of magical secrets, but I'm willing to listen if you want to convince me otherwise. With most of these I could get both 9th level bard/sorcerer spells from magical secrets as well as the higher level spells from other classes.
So, the questions I have here are:
What should the class spread look like @ 20?
How should the level order go for smooth progression?
What spells should I be going for with magical secrets?
What metamagic options should I go for (most likely 2 and only 2) that'll compliment a Lore Bard the most? Currently sold on Quickened and Twin Spell
Assuming that you're going to get to level 20 (most games fall out far earlier than this), I'm going to recommend that you take 17 levels in bard at minimum. You're going to want access to level 9 magic. Being able to upcast low level spells is no substitute for having access to actual high level spells. Especially since you are now the group's primary healer and you have interest in remaining in that role.
Ohh Alright. I'll keep that in mind. One of the things I was considering lately was taking ten levels in both bard and sorcerer - leveling up bard to 9 and then leveling sorcerer until the character was level 17, where I'd grab the 10th level in bard and use Magical Secrets to grab wish and likely one other high level spell.
Healing Spirit upcast already works great for out of combat healing. And I'd like the idea of being able to Quicken or Twin the vast array of spells on the bard and sorcerer table.
Good point. In which case Bard 14 Sorc 6 appeals to me more. I'd lose out on 8th and 9th level spells other than what I'd pick with magical secrets but I'd still have access to 7th level spells, the slots for which I'll get regardless. And I'd still be able to twin spell haste/slow.
Magical secrets does not allow you pick any spell higher than your bard chart alone allows. You do not add caster levels when choosing spells, only slots per day.
How did this character end up playing out? I'm thinking of a Bard/Sorc Cross, considering an end that looks like Bard 6/Sorc 14 with the Draconic background (I'm stoked on the idea of my Tabaxi having Dragon wings lol).
Magical secrets does not allow you pick any spell higher than your bard chart alone allows. You do not add caster levels when choosing spells, only slots per day.
Exactly. If you're only a 10th-level Bard, you can't grab Wish with magical secrets because you can't cast 9th-level spells. In a 10/10 split you'd be limited to 5th-level and below even with magical secrets. The key part of magical secrets is "A spell you choose must be of a level you can cast, as shown on the Bard table, or a cantrip."
So, acording to the PHB, bards and sorcerers, in a level up, can learn any spells of the according spell list, if they have spell slots for then, and, understanding that the rules on spellcasting multiclass say that if your level in spellcaster classes like, bard or sorcerer, combined equals 17 or more, you have 17 level on the spell slot table. Independently of the quantity of levels you take in bard or sorcerer, being that both of than are full spellcasting classes, that means that you will have 9th level spell slots at level 17, by proxy 9th level spells
So, acording to the PHB, bards and sorcerers, in a level up, can learn any spells of the according spell list, if they have spell slots for then, and, understanding that the rules on spellcasting multiclass say that if your level in spellcaster classes like, bard or sorcerer, combined equals 17 or more, you have 17 level on the spell slot table. Independently of the quantity of levels you take in bard or sorcerer, being that both of than are full spellcasting classes, that means that you will have 9th level spell slots at level 17, by proxy 9th level spells
Ahhh.... no, not quite. While you do have access to the spell slots of a 17th level caster, you only have the spells known as if you were single classed.
Example: Bard 10, Sorcerer 10. Would have 9th level spell slots, but could only have 5th level spells. You xould cast fireball as 9th level, but youll never be able to cast Meteor Swarm or Wish
Yoooooo. I have a lot of options going forward with this character so I'm hoping I can get some help.
Assuming we'll get to level 20, my character, who started off as a a Lore bard, will have at least 2 levels of Draconic Sorceror, likely more, but I'm hoping to work out which level combination works best for me to get a good progression so I don't feel like he's lacking compared to the rest of the party
Some other bits of information:
So my possible option for multiclassing the rest of the way are:
I'd rather not go further than that to allow for the two sets of magical secrets, but I'm willing to listen if you want to convince me otherwise. With most of these I could get both 9th level bard/sorcerer spells from magical secrets as well as the higher level spells from other classes.
So, the questions I have here are:
Assuming that you're going to get to level 20 (most games fall out far earlier than this), I'm going to recommend that you take 17 levels in bard at minimum. You're going to want access to level 9 magic. Being able to upcast low level spells is no substitute for having access to actual high level spells. Especially since you are now the group's primary healer and you have interest in remaining in that role.
Ohh Alright. I'll keep that in mind. One of the things I was considering lately was taking ten levels in both bard and sorcerer - leveling up bard to 9 and then leveling sorcerer until the character was level 17, where I'd grab the 10th level in bard and use Magical Secrets to grab wish and likely one other high level spell.
Healing Spirit upcast already works great for out of combat healing. And I'd like the idea of being able to Quicken or Twin the vast array of spells on the bard and sorcerer table.
Its not just raw healing of HP. You're going to need things like Greater Restoration, or Resurrection over just Revivify sooner or later.
Good point. In which case Bard 14 Sorc 6 appeals to me more. I'd lose out on 8th and 9th level spells other than what I'd pick with magical secrets but I'd still have access to 7th level spells, the slots for which I'll get regardless. And I'd still be able to twin spell haste/slow.
Magical secrets does not allow you pick any spell higher than your bard chart alone allows. You do not add caster levels when choosing spells, only slots per day.
How did this character end up playing out? I'm thinking of a Bard/Sorc Cross, considering an end that looks like Bard 6/Sorc 14 with the Draconic background (I'm stoked on the idea of my Tabaxi having Dragon wings lol).
Exactly. If you're only a 10th-level Bard, you can't grab Wish with magical secrets because you can't cast 9th-level spells. In a 10/10 split you'd be limited to 5th-level and below even with magical secrets. The key part of magical secrets is "A spell you choose must be of a level you can cast, as shown on the Bard table, or a cantrip."
So, acording to the PHB, bards and sorcerers, in a level up, can learn any spells of the according spell list, if they have spell slots for then, and, understanding that the rules on spellcasting multiclass say that if your level in spellcaster classes like, bard or sorcerer, combined equals 17 or more, you have 17 level on the spell slot table. Independently of the quantity of levels you take in bard or sorcerer, being that both of than are full spellcasting classes, that means that you will have 9th level spell slots at level 17, by proxy 9th level spells
Ahhh.... no, not quite. While you do have access to the spell slots of a 17th level caster, you only have the spells known as if you were single classed.
Example: Bard 10, Sorcerer 10. Would have 9th level spell slots, but could only have 5th level spells. You xould cast fireball as 9th level, but youll never be able to cast Meteor Swarm or Wish
Edit - source https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/basic-rules/customization-options#Spellcasting