When you action surge in 2024, is it legal to use the extra action first, so you can do something involving attacking first and casting a spell second?
I can't see any reason why you couldn't. Action Surge grants you another action, but doesn't impose any restriction on when you can use that action; there's nothing preventing you from using the additional action to attack, then your main action to cast a spell.
Action Surge gives you another Action. Anything you can do with an Action, you can do.
Not quite- as of the 2024 iteration of Fighter/Action Surge, you cannot repeat the Magic Action. Now, the exact wording is "On your turn, you can take one additional action, except the Magic action", which I would parse as only checking that you aren't taking two Magic Actions in one turn, in regards to the original question.
Actually I read it as saying that your action surge action can not be a magic action - hence it must be some other sort of action like an attack action.
Actually I read it as saying that your action surge action can not be a magic action - hence it must be some other sort of action like an attack action.
Yes, but all that really means in practice is that you can't take two Magic actions in a turn, because you can still take the Magic action with your normal action, and there's no requirement to take the two actions in any particular order.
Its true that you can take magic action with your regular action, but my reading goes further - at no time can you take a magic action with your action surge action. you can't use the action surge first to cast magic then the regular action to use a weapon (or do something else). you can use the action surge for anything except the magic action which can only be used with the regular action. While perhaps a subtle point it can be an important one.
you can't use the action surge first to cast magic then the regular action to use a weapon (or do something else).
Again, no one is saying you can. But you can achieve the exact same effect by using your regular action first to cast magic and then the action surge action to use a weapon (or do something else).
Because you can use the two actions in either order, the only restriction that really matters - the only rule you have to remember about it - is that they can’t both be Magic actions.
you can't use the action surge first to cast magic then the regular action to use a weapon (or do something else).
Again, no one is saying you can. But you can achieve the exact same effect by using your regular action first to cast magic and then the action surge action to use a weapon (or do something else).
Because you can use the two actions in either order, the only restriction that really matters - the only rule you have to remember about it - is that they can’t both be Magic actions.
There are other scenarios where it matters, mostly when the results of your action mean that you now want to use action surge to cast, but you're right that it mostly doesn't matter.
You can take Action (in any order) Action: choose (pick one of the options) or Action Surge: pick your choice (BUT stipulates you CANNOT choose Magic action with this use).
also rules stipulates that you can’t cast 2 spells that require an Action to cast in the same round. Hence closing the dipping in Fighter by a caster for AS to cast 2 Action spells.
Only exception would be if a class ability grants you the ability to do so.
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No different from using your BA first, if you had the ability to BA dash and then attack after, if you need more movement to get to a target.
So 2024 no casting of 2 Action spells, but you can select anything else in the Action list.
also rules stipulates that you can’t cast 2 spells that require an Action to cast in the same round.
Just to be clear, while this is true of Action Surge, there's no general rule about this; if you had some other way of getting an extra action that didn't have this restriction, you could do this.
(Edit: Plaguescarred gave a good example of this below.)
It's also worth pointing out that the restriction is not specifically on casting spells, but on any use of the Magic action, including a variety of other non-spell things such as some Channel Divinity options, activating some magic items, etc.
How spellcasting is limited is by spell slots, not spell requiring an action. So for example it's possible for
An Eldritch Knight Fighter take the Magic action and cast a spell, use Action Surge and take the Attack action and replace one of the attacks with a casting of one Wizard cantrips that has a casting time of an action.
How spellcasting is limited is by spell slots, not spell requiring an action. So for example it's possible for
An Eldritch Knight Fighter take the Magic action and cast a spell, use Action Surge and take the Attack action and replace one of the attacks with a casting of one Wizard cantrips that has a casting time of an action.
Like mentioned, if a class specific ability is given otherwise. or if a racial feature allows for a spell (ie misty step, darkness) without a spell slot could also be used.
Point is they allowed exceptions, but otherwise 1 spell per round cast.
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When you action surge in 2024, is it legal to use the extra action first, so you can do something involving attacking first and casting a spell second?
In the following order for example:
Why or why not?
Yes, there's zero stipulation about when you take the action, just that you can take an additional action.
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I can't see any reason why you couldn't. Action Surge grants you another action, but doesn't impose any restriction on when you can use that action; there's nothing preventing you from using the additional action to attack, then your main action to cast a spell.
While many use it after taking their main action, nothing prevent you from using it before instead.
The only drawback is that you might waste your action surge (after evaluating your main action, maybe you decide action surge is no longer required).
Not quite- as of the 2024 iteration of Fighter/Action Surge, you cannot repeat the Magic Action. Now, the exact wording is "On your turn, you can take one additional action, except the Magic action", which I would parse as only checking that you aren't taking two Magic Actions in one turn, in regards to the original question.
Actually I read it as saying that your action surge action can not be a magic action - hence it must be some other sort of action like an attack action.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Ditto i read it the same way, the additional action you can take can't be the Magic action.
Yes, but all that really means in practice is that you can't take two Magic actions in a turn, because you can still take the Magic action with your normal action, and there's no requirement to take the two actions in any particular order.
pronouns: he/she/they
Its true that you can take magic action with your regular action, but my reading goes further - at no time can you take a magic action with your action surge action. you can't use the action surge first to cast magic then the regular action to use a weapon (or do something else). you can use the action surge for anything except the magic action which can only be used with the regular action. While perhaps a subtle point it can be an important one.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
No one is saying otherwise.
Again, no one is saying you can. But you can achieve the exact same effect by using your regular action first to cast magic and then the action surge action to use a weapon (or do something else).
Because you can use the two actions in either order, the only restriction that really matters - the only rule you have to remember about it - is that they can’t both be Magic actions.
pronouns: he/she/they
There are other scenarios where it matters, mostly when the results of your action mean that you now want to use action surge to cast, but you're right that it mostly doesn't matter.
You can take Action (in any order) Action: choose (pick one of the options) or Action Surge: pick your choice (BUT stipulates you CANNOT choose Magic action with this use).
also rules stipulates that you can’t cast 2 spells that require an Action to cast in the same round. Hence closing the dipping in Fighter by a caster for AS to cast 2 Action spells.
Only exception would be if a class ability grants you the ability to do so.
——————————-
No different from using your BA first, if you had the ability to BA dash and then attack after, if you need more movement to get to a target.
So 2024 no casting of 2 Action spells, but you can select anything else in the Action list.
Just to be clear, while this is true of Action Surge, there's no general rule about this; if you had some other way of getting an extra action that didn't have this restriction, you could do this.
(Edit: Plaguescarred gave a good example of this below.)
It's also worth pointing out that the restriction is not specifically on casting spells, but on any use of the Magic action, including a variety of other non-spell things such as some Channel Divinity options, activating some magic items, etc.
pronouns: he/she/they
How spellcasting is limited is by spell slots, not spell requiring an action. So for example it's possible for
An Eldritch Knight Fighter take the Magic action and cast a spell, use Action Surge and take the Attack action and replace one of the attacks with a casting of one Wizard cantrips that has a casting time of an action.
Like mentioned, if a class specific ability is given otherwise.
or if a racial feature allows for a spell (ie misty step, darkness) without a spell slot could also be used.
Point is they allowed exceptions, but otherwise 1 spell per round cast.