Strongest? Fighters obviously. They get the most ASI so the majority of them will be STR 20 or higher. DUH.
Artificers can get Belts of Hill Giant Strength, and be stronger than them, easy.
Not a real class and not on the poll. In addition, Fighters could get the same thing so it would be equal =)
Artificers are a real class, and I wasn't referring to the poll. Fighters can get the same thing, but they don't get the ability to automatically have it with their class features, so that does not make them the strongest class.
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Different subclasses get different proficiencies for Artificers, but all of them can literally be the strongest (as in strength score) with the belt of hill giant strength.
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If we’re playing the “strength score” game, then the answer is obviously barbarian. It’s the only way to get above 20 strength naturally, and it can get you to 24, which is higher that that allowed by a belt of hill giant strength.
I feel like centering this on strength score though began as a joke?
If we’re playing the “strength score” game, then the answer is obviously barbarian. It’s the only way to get above 20 strength naturally, and it can get you to 24, which is higher that that allowed by a belt of hill giant strength.
I feel like centering this on strength score though began as a joke?
Yes, you are correct. I forgot about that feature. Up until level 20, Artificers can have the strongest strength score.
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Do druids count as themselves when they turn into animal form? Also, that's closed off to Moon Druids, right? That's not the strongest class in the game, that's the strongest subclass, which is on par with the base barbarian class in terms of strength.
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Druids can DEFINITELY get the highest strength score, because your ASI you have selected are a class feature, and continue to apply and modify your beast form statistics. A Moon Druid Mammoth with five +2 Strength ASI stacked onto it can be a Strength 34 character, far above those piddling Barbarians and belt-wearing Artificers :)
If Wild-Shape counts, Polymorph would have to count (neither should count). That makes any spellcaster above level 8 be able to be the strongest, turning into a T-Rex, with a Strength Score of 25.
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Polymorph replaces your statistics. Wild Shape replaces your statistics, but then lets you retain the benefit of certain statistics (including class features, which in turn includes ASI). Thus, Wild Shape > Polymorph for the Strength game.
Druids can DEFINITELY get the highest strength score, because your ASI you have selected are a class feature, and continue to apply and modify your beast form statistics. A Moon Druid Mammoth with five +2 Strength ASI stacked onto it can be a Strength 34 character, far above those piddling Barbarians and belt-wearing Artificers :)
I mean, RAW, there’s no such thing as an ability score higher than 30, and ASIs can’t increase scores past 20, so the druid would still be limited to max(20, the beast form’s base strength).
Can you quote the language that provides that ability scores are capped at 30? Not familiar with that rule. The PHB Chapter 1 suggests that the modifier for any score can be calculated by "subtract 10 from the ability score and then divide the result by 2 (round down)."
A Druid can continue selecting ASI's for +2 Strength until their humanoid form hits 20. So long as they start at Strength 10 in humanoid form, nothing would stop them from selecting +2 Strength for all five ASI (not that that would be a good idea, but in theory). Those ASI are the Druid's class features (for Druid 4, Druid 8, Druid 12, Druid 16, and Druid 19), and while Wild Shaped, "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so."
Can you quote the language that provides that ability scores are capped at 30? Not familiar with that rule. The PHB Chapter 1 suggests that the modifier for any score can be calculated by "subtract 10 from the ability score and then divide the result by 2 (round down)."
A Druid can continue selecting ASI's for +2 Strength until their humanoid form hits 20. So long as they start at Strength 10 in humanoid form, nothing would stop them from selecting +2 Strength for all five ASI (not that that would be a good idea, but in theory). Those ASI are the Druid's class features (for Druid 4, Druid 8, Druid 12, Druid 16, and Druid 19), and while Wild Shaped, "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so."
I fully agree that ASIs are class features that a wild shaped druid can benefit from while in beast form. But those ASIs still have to follow their own rules, which are very clear. Every instance of the feature includes this line: "As normal, you can’t increase an ability score above 20 using this feature." It doesn't matter how the ability score is above 20.
As for there not being rules for scores above 30, consult the table. The line you're quoting specifically says "To determine an ability modifier without consulting the table..." It's a shortcut, but it's not universally applicable. The table itself contains the actual rules for ability scores, and there are none for scores below 1 or above 30. There are some special abilities that do define what happens if an ability score is reduced to 0 as a result of that ability, but I'm not aware of anything similar that says what happens if a score is somehow raised above 30. I'm not aware of anything that would allow that to happen mechanically, though; as established in my first paragraph, ASIs certainly can't. Epic Boon ability score increases also have explicit text limiting their benefits to 30.
I suppose a Wizard could get pretty strong too, though. Spend all your Wizard ASI on +2 Strength. Use Magic Jar to steal a Warlord's body. Have 30 Strength as a result.
Hmmm, those are good points. However, it does mean that a level 20 Barbarian can't actually have 24 Strength and Constitution, unless they have a natural 18 Strength and a +2 Racial Bonus. Otherwise, when their Barbarian Capstone pushes them up to 24, their earlier +Strength ASI turn off.
Strongest? Fighters obviously. They get the most ASI so the majority of them will be STR 20 or higher. DUH.
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Artificers can get Belts of Hill Giant Strength, and be stronger than them, easy.
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Not a real class and not on the poll. In addition, Fighters could get the same thing so it would be equal =)
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Artificers are a real class, and I wasn't referring to the poll. Fighters can get the same thing, but they don't get the ability to automatically have it with their class features, so that does not make them the strongest class.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
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Sorry, poor word choice. They are not accessible in every campaign. They also only start with simple weapon proficiency.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Different subclasses get different proficiencies for Artificers, but all of them can literally be the strongest (as in strength score) with the belt of hill giant strength.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
If we’re playing the “strength score” game, then the answer is obviously barbarian. It’s the only way to get above 20 strength naturally, and it can get you to 24, which is higher that that allowed by a belt of hill giant strength.
I feel like centering this on strength score though began as a joke?
May have started as a joke, but now it's a war. Somebody went and said artificers weren't a real class. Millions have died for far less.
Please do not contact or message me.
They’re not a real class. They’re...
artificial. *is immediately assassinated by a sniper*
Yes, you are correct. I forgot about that feature. Up until level 20, Artificers can have the strongest strength score.
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Ah, Belt of Giant Strength is a crutch.
Druids can get STR 24 without items.
So yeah, Artifakers aren't the strongest.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Do druids count as themselves when they turn into animal form? Also, that's closed off to Moon Druids, right? That's not the strongest class in the game, that's the strongest subclass, which is on par with the base barbarian class in terms of strength.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
Druids can DEFINITELY get the highest strength score, because your ASI you have selected are a class feature, and continue to apply and modify your beast form statistics. A Moon Druid Mammoth with five +2 Strength ASI stacked onto it can be a Strength 34 character, far above those piddling Barbarians and belt-wearing Artificers :)
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If Wild-Shape counts, Polymorph would have to count (neither should count). That makes any spellcaster above level 8 be able to be the strongest, turning into a T-Rex, with a Strength Score of 25.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
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Polymorph replaces your statistics. Wild Shape replaces your statistics, but then lets you retain the benefit of certain statistics (including class features, which in turn includes ASI). Thus, Wild Shape > Polymorph for the Strength game.
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I mean, RAW, there’s no such thing as an ability score higher than 30, and ASIs can’t increase scores past 20, so the druid would still be limited to max(20, the beast form’s base strength).
Can you quote the language that provides that ability scores are capped at 30? Not familiar with that rule. The PHB Chapter 1 suggests that the modifier for any score can be calculated by "subtract 10 from the ability score and then divide the result by 2 (round down)."
A Druid can continue selecting ASI's for +2 Strength until their humanoid form hits 20. So long as they start at Strength 10 in humanoid form, nothing would stop them from selecting +2 Strength for all five ASI (not that that would be a good idea, but in theory). Those ASI are the Druid's class features (for Druid 4, Druid 8, Druid 12, Druid 16, and Druid 19), and while Wild Shaped, "You retain the benefit of any features from your class, race, or other source and can use them if the new form is physically capable of doing so."
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
I fully agree that ASIs are class features that a wild shaped druid can benefit from while in beast form. But those ASIs still have to follow their own rules, which are very clear. Every instance of the feature includes this line: "As normal, you can’t increase an ability score above 20 using this feature." It doesn't matter how the ability score is above 20.
As for there not being rules for scores above 30, consult the table. The line you're quoting specifically says "To determine an ability modifier without consulting the table..." It's a shortcut, but it's not universally applicable. The table itself contains the actual rules for ability scores, and there are none for scores below 1 or above 30. There are some special abilities that do define what happens if an ability score is reduced to 0 as a result of that ability, but I'm not aware of anything similar that says what happens if a score is somehow raised above 30. I'm not aware of anything that would allow that to happen mechanically, though; as established in my first paragraph, ASIs certainly can't. Epic Boon ability score increases also have explicit text limiting their benefits to 30.
I suppose a Wizard could get pretty strong too, though. Spend all your Wizard ASI on +2 Strength. Use Magic Jar to steal a Warlord's body. Have 30 Strength as a result.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.
Hmmm, those are good points. However, it does mean that a level 20 Barbarian can't actually have 24 Strength and Constitution, unless they have a natural 18 Strength and a +2 Racial Bonus. Otherwise, when their Barbarian Capstone pushes them up to 24, their earlier +Strength ASI turn off.
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I'm going to make this way harder than it needs to be.