Monstrous Compendium Vol. 1: Spelljammer Creatures
Frozen Sick
D&D Beyond Basic Rules
Basic Rules (2014)
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I wouldn't mind if they revamped it a bit, i mean the old hexblade was really popular for multiclassing because its level 1 features where very good. However the rest of the features I always found to be a bit lackluster, Accursed specter in 5e was cool in concept but very limited and tbh pretty lackluster. The version implemented in BG3 would be difficult to port into tabletop I think. Armor of hexes was very feast and famine and Master of hexes was never a satisfying capstone.
I think that there are some good ideas but the execution is poor. Blending sword and sorcery is what they need to be focusing on and fixing the AC problems warlocks have when it comes to being in melee. Medium armor would be a straightforward fix, however I would actually prefer if they went the Bladesinger route adding CHA to AC. It can be while hexbaldes curse is active or while concentrating on a spell (which would be more flexible as a requirement).
As a follow up to this discussion, we are playing with the new rules and I really wanted to play a hexblade, but the new hexblade, as it is the general opinion, well...kinda sucks. Me and my DM looked and both UA version, made some big changes which we both felt comfortable with and he allowed me to run this modified version. I will say that the few session we had so far, what we came up with seems very strong, probably A tier, but it does not seem so powerful to be unreasonable or broken and it is not above what the others are playing at the table, it just feel satisfying to play, fun and very fluid and synergistic compared to what the UA presented. This is what we came up with (yes we gave the features names because we are both degenerates and like to this stuff, plus is easier to refer to them if they have names). We also wanted to refrain from creating completely new features as far as possible but just modify what the UAs presented (except for a couple of exceptions).
Level 3: Hexblade's Curse
You can cast Hex without expanding a spell slot. You can do so a number of times equal to your CHA modifier and you regain all expanded uses of this feature once you finish a long rest. In addition your Hex spell grants you the additional benefits below.
Accursed Critical: When you make a weapon attack against a creature cursed by your Hex spell, you score a critical hit on a 19 or 20, instead of only on a 20.
Hungering Hex: Whenever another creature cursed by your Hex spell is reduced to 0 hit points, you regain a number of hit points equal to D8 + your CHA modifier. (Right now we are still debating whether or not this is too much healing since Hex can be moved around. It felt a lot at lower levels, but felt weaker at later levels where there are fewer but bigger enemies. Maybe the healing should scale somewhat different).
Level 3: Hex Warrior
Unyielding will: When you fail on a concentration saving throw, you can choose to succeed instead. When you do you gain temporary hit points equal to D8 + Warlock level. Once you use this feature, you can't using it again until you finish a short rest.
Accursed armor: While you are not wearing medium or heavy armor or wielding a shield, you gain a bonus to your AC equal to your CHA modifier while your are concentrating on a warlock spell.
Level 6: Malign Brutality
Harrowing Hex: After you cast a level 1+ warlock spell that has the casting time of an action, you can make one weapon attack as part of the same action.
Hateful Hex: The additional necrotic damage creatures take from your Hex spell is increased to 2D6.
Inescapable Hex: When you place your Hex on a creature, or as a bonus action on your turn, you may teleport up to 30ft to an empty space within 5 feet of a creature cursed by your Hex spell.
Level 10: Armor of Hexes
When you take damage from a creature cursed by your Hex spell, you can use your reaction to gain resistance against all damage you take from that creature until the start of your next turn.
Level 14: Master of Hexes
Masterful Hex: When you cast your Hex spell, you may modify it to not require concentration. When you do so the duration of the spell becomes 1 minute and it ends when the creature cursed by it is reduced to 0 hit points. Once your modify your Hex spell this way you can't do so again until you finish a short or long rest, or you use your Magical Cunning feature.
Explosive Hex: When you hit a creature cursed by your Hex spell with an attack, you can cause an explosion of sinister energy. The target and all creatures of your choice in a 30-foot emanation originating from the target, take necrotic damage equal to 3D6 + Warlock level. In addition, those creature have their speed reduced by 10 feet until the start of your next turn. Once you use this feature you can't use it again until you finish a long rest, or your use a pact magic slot to use it again (no action required).
That looks pretty good! However, I'd change the Unyielding Will to come at a price - it feels like the warlock gets two temp boons for the price of one. I'd actually make using this feature inflict 1d8 or 1d6 hit points on the warlock - a sort of fatigue or exhaustion tax. Or maybe it means the warlock gains 1 level of Exhaustion once the feature expires?
Much as I like this, though, I'm probably not going to be entirely happy with any version of the hexblade that doesn't grant easier access to medium armor and shield training.
I didn't understand the feedback about unyielding will. That part is the same as it is in the UA. If I understand correctly you are saying auto-passing the concentration should have some drawback?
Regarding the armor and shield proficiency I understand where you are coming from. I know a lot of people want armor prof because they like the armored warlock fantasy, but, obviously I did this for me, and I never liked the fact that warlocks got their armor form just putting on a piece of metal, I always wanted a version of hexblade that conjured their armor out of magic the same they do with their weapons. I was hoping they would make armor of shadows CHA unarmored defense for the 2024 warlock, but we got the same useless invocation we had in 2014.
1) Hexblade Curse should be like 2014 with more uses.
Hexblade Curse
At 3rd level, your Hexblade Patron empowers your curses. You always have the Hex spell prepared. You can cast Hex spell without using a spell slot. Until the curse ends, you gain the following benefits:
You can use this feature a number of times equal to your Charisma modifier (minimum of once), and you regain all expended uses of it when you finish a Long Rest.
2) Increasing Charisma isn’t the way forward. The true essence of the Hexblade, inspired by Elric of Melniboné, lies in wielding medium armor and a shield — that’s the authentic, original concept."
3) Accursed Specter was a genuinely cool feature, and I’m surprised more people don’t miss it.
4) A level 14 feature that only removes concentration from Hex comes far too late and feels underwhelming. Explosive Hex is even worse — weak, awkward, and nonsensical at that stage. At level 14, casting a Spell and attacking will almost always be the superior choice.
If we are willing to think about an actually different Hexblade, might I suggest:
3rd Level: HexBlade's Curse
You learn the Hex spell, and can cast it without expending a spell slot a number of times equal to you charisma modifier per long rest. Your Hex is enhanced by your Hexblade Curse granting it the following benefits:
6th Level: Acursed Death
When the creature affected by your Hex is reduced to 0 hp, you can end your Hex to cause one of the following effects:
11th Level: Debilitating Hex
Starting at 11th level, when you hit the target of your hex with an attack, you replace the extra damage you would deal with one of the following effects until the end of your next turn:
You can use this feature only once per turn.
14th Level: Master of Hexes
When you cast your Hex spell, you may modify it to not require concentration. When you do so the duration of the spell becomes 1 minute and it ends when the creature cursed by it is reduced to 0 hit points. When you cast Hex in this way, each time you roll the maximum value on the 1d6 for your Hex you can roll one additional 1d6 and add it to the total damage.
Your version of hexbalde curse is just worse. The healing is substituted by temp hp and causes the curse to end which is bad especially since you have other sources of temp hp. You also do not need to have proficiency dmg because Hex itself grants a dmg boost.
Hexblade is a warlock subclass, so increasing CHA should definitely the way forward. Making a subclass for warlock that requires other stats to work would be bad design. If you want to play a warlock with armor that uses STR or DEX instead of CHA you can achieve that through multiclassing.
Accursed specter was cool, bad it was bad and very limited due to it requiring a humanoid.
The level 14 feature scaling with warlock level defiantly makes it usable. You can argue that you dont like it, but it isnt bad. Having a Hex which you can cast without concentration isnt as bad as you think. Being able to stack the benefits of hexblades curse along another concentration spell in tougher fights is very valuable.
You can say you do not like it, and that would be fine, but you are making assumptions on whats good and bad using your personal preference as a metric, which does not work.
This has the same problem the UA Horror hexblade had, which is completely dependent on Hex. If you are not concentrating on Hex you have no subclass. Considering warlock has a lot of concentration spells, that isnt a design which a lot of people, including me, would want to play.
Re: Unyielding Will. Yes, I am saying there should be a give and take. It's something I really like about Colville's DRAW STEEL game; there's almost always a price for power. I wish D&D did more of that, especially for classes/characters meddling with arcane forces. I like the idea of things being a trade-off rather than ALWAYS being a straight up benefit or advantage.
While I get what you are saying, in DnD features rarely have a drawback attached to them and if they do usually the feature is much more powerful than the avrg feature. My point is that if fighter gets to action surge without a drawback (which would be high physical exertion), I dont want my once per short rest feature to have an unnecessary drawback.
So more like the Blood Hunter?
DM, player & homebrewer(Current homebrew project is an unofficial conversion of SBURB/SGRUB from Homestuck into DND 5e)
Once made Maxwell's Silver Hammer come down upon Strahd's head to make sure he was dead.
Always study & sharpen philosophical razors. They save a lot of trouble.
Yes, in theory like the Blood Hunter. I think the game becomes a LOT more interesting if you have to make decisions in terms of trade-offs for magical power.
IMNSHO, the Blood Hunter's costs were perhaps too....well, costly. But the basic idea is sound.
no offense meant to anyone posting tips on how to improve the hexwarlock ( not gonna call him in blade in the presented form ), but there is no benefit even with these tips that will improve the chances someone is going to play a pure hexwarlock, not too mention the hexwarlock doesn't provide anything at all to choose one over a celestial, fiend aso ....
1 lvl split of ftr/Paladin / 19 lvl HexWarlock fixes the main issues of the hexwarlock as it is presented, add to it, you going to need 13 str to use GWM anyway so the 13 str/13 chr of a Paladin or the 13 str of a ftr are neglitable
If the wanted to present a subclass that is only playable as MC with 1+ ftr or pal why not just print it like it is .....
The main issue of the bladelock/hexblade warlock is the lack of defensive options that allow it to be in the frontline.
The current version of the hexblade does not provide anything to fix that issue except lackluster conditional features.
if I am gonna multiclass into paladin or fighter (instill think fighter is the better option because on top of armor and shield profs it gives you CON saving throws a fighting style and if you end up taking a 2nd level you get action surge.
i think the current hexblade does have some decent ideas such as the attack after casting a spell and unyielding will which IMO is a good feature but they need to be executed better alongside fixing the AC problems warlocks have to be a melee weapon user and making hexblades curse a feature which is good and boosts offense as it has always been.
sure you can give hexblades medium armor and shield and call it a day, but me personally I would prefer something similar to the genie paladin granting you and AC bonus that scales with your CHA.
Also in oder to push the hexblade into melee they should design features that reward you for being in melee, not punish you if you are not. Accursed shield does the latter making you AC paper if you are not within 10ft of your hexblade target. This is not the right design, instead, they should include more features that boost or synergize with melee weapon fighting, actually putting the blade part lf hexblade on display.
examples: improved critical should be part of the base hexblades curse but only work for melee weapon attacks. Exploding hex should deal a lot more dmg (4D6 + warlock level) bit only be able to use it when you hit your target with a melee weapon attack and AC should not be tied to being in melee, either give hexblades medium armor prof or give them the genie paladin feature (which I would prefer because it incentivizes focusing on CHA as warlocks should as opposed to going full dex or str and multiclass)
that is what the redesign I posted was aiming to do. Now i am not a game designer so my balancing might be off, but we are using that at my current table and as of now (level 12 just got that juicy attack) it feels fantastic to play. It feels smooth and powerful to play, provides interesting decision making regarding what you want to be concentrating on (hex for hexbaldes curse related buffs or something else) and while not perfect it’s certainly fun to play and strong compared to the rest of the table.
If we get rid of the dependence on the Hex spell, then one could do something like:
3rd Level: HexBlade's Curse
As a bonus action, you can curse one creature you can see within 30 ft of you. This curse lasts until the end of your next turn, unless you use another bonus action to sustain it for up to a maximum duration of 10 minutes. Your curse has the following effects:
6th Level: Acursed Death
When the creature within 30 ft of you that you can see dies, you can use your Reaction to cause one of the following:
11th Level: Might and Magic
When you use the Magic Action to cast a warlock spell, you can immediately use your bonus action to make one weapon attack or unarmed strike against one of the targets of your spell. If the attack hits the target has disadvantage on any saving throw it makes against your spell.
In addition, your weapon attacks and unarmed strikes deal +3 additional necrotic damage while you are concentrating on one the spells from your Hexblade spell list.
14th Level: Debilitating Curse
Each time you sustain your Hexblade's Curse on a target while you are within 30 ft of it, you deal 4d10 necrotic damage to it.
the UA hexblade as compared to other subclasses provides.
more ability to frontline (accursed shield + armor of hexes, unyielding will) (only fiend comes close, but by level 10 resistance to one damage type per SR isnt going to be more than -10 damage taken per round, and unyielding will allows you to maintain concentration when unlucky while giving temp Hp.
more damage while frontlining, (unyielding will crits on 19)
better ability to debuff a target:( hindering curse)
damage even while casting with an action (harrowing hex)
excelent ability to stay close, (inescapable hex) that requires no reaction/action or spell cost.
and a bunch of spells that arent normally on the warlock list that work well with this type of play: (every spell except hex, is a new spell to the warlock list)
for a martial leaning charachter, the other subclasses are not ideal.
The big factor is that martial charachters want spells that still allow them to use attack actions, and capitilize off their martial attacks, and damage buffs. so the hexblade spell list, which is almost all non action using casting, other than conjure barrage which is worth giving up attack actions with enough enemies, steel wind strike, which is also worth it with multiple enemies and synergizes with on hit damage buffs, like hex/bestow/shroud. Is kind of a big deal, along with harrowing hex which allows you a no cost BA attack when you cast spells.
unyielding will, which can save concentration, provide temp HP and deals damage to targets in melee range with you with no action cost is also hard to match for a martial build.
As far as multiclassing, you arent better than a pure hexblade because every level is a big deal until like level 14. your pld dip gives you +5% defense (only sometimes) divine favor, 2 masteries, and 2 spell slots. but thats not really objectively better than;
level 2, 2 invocations
level 3 subclass and level 2 spells, (level 3 hexblade spells)
level 4 ASI
level 5 invocations, (thirsting blade) level 3 pact level 5 hexblade spells
level 6, hindering curse, harrowing hex, inescapable hex
level 7, teir 3 spells, level 7 hexblade spells, invocation
level 8 ASi
level 9 teir 5 spells, level 9 hexblade spells, invocation
level 10 armor of hexes
level 11, 3 spells per SR (and 2 spells with magical cunning) level 6 spells,
level 12 ASI invocation
level 13 level 7 spells
level 14, 19 crit, aoe damage and debuff in melee, but most importantly, one hexblades curse per SR
level 15 level 8 spells invocation
level 16, asi
I tested hexblades side by side, two with dips, and 2 without. the dipping classes had nice things, like mastery, free con proficiency, second wind, But the pure hexblade gets a huge boost from spell level. there is a huge difference between 5 level 1 spells, and 5 level 2 spells, and 5 level 3 spells in terms of power. And the other levels have milestones which add a lot, like invocations, ability scores, or feats. They werent objectively weaker than pure warlock, but they werent objectively better either.
perhaps level 2. thats about it.
id also say, for martial leaning charachters, while 15-16 provides big power, it might nit be the type of power you want, but level 17 is huge (foresight and 4 spells per SR)
Not trying to be rude, but this is worst than the UA version. Hexblades curse is still a shadow of its former self and needs your BA each turn to sustain. There is still no fix for the poor AC you have as a frontline role, I do not know why might and magic comes in at lvl11 not 10 as even so it is a feature which should come in much earlier and it still has the problem that you only have a subclass against the cursed target and 0 features to defend yourself from other enemies or do anything meaningful against other enemies.
You can’t frontline without STR and AC — you’ll get shut down fast.
You keep saying you’ve tested, but your tests don’t cover every scenario. It feels like you just roll dice and ignore complex, dynamic situations, focusing only on straightforward, linear ones.
In a single round, I could easily grapple or knock you prone. You’d lose concentration, and by the second turn, you’d be gone.
Even back in the 2014 version, I would always switch to a shield and play defensively to survive when fighting alongside a front-line Fighter.
Now imagine doing all that without AC…
Accursed shield is a bad fix for AC. +2 is bad enough also a value but you also have two restrictions in top of it being a poor defensive buff: have to be within 10ft of a specific target and only works while not wearing armor which means it forces you to take armor of shadows which is a bad invocation which you don't want anyway. Armor of hexes is also a poor feature especially at level 10: reducing 10 dmg from one attack coming from a specific target as a reaction (meaning only once per turn at a stage of the game where enemies are attacking multiple times) is nothing to write home about.
crit on a 19 comes in way too late, it should be part of the basic hexbaldes curse.
unyielding will is a nice feature but its only one use per long rest which is too few. It should refresh on a short rest.
hindering curse only works for you allies except for in some very niche cases so its dependent on your team and does not grant you any personal benefits.
harrowing hex is not that great on a class that only has 2 spell slot for moat of its career and using those spell slots to sometimes cast bonus action spells such as spirit shroud or animate objects (takes action to casts and bonus action to command) so realistically you aren’t getting much use out of it if any.
inescapable hex is not terrible but it triggers attacks of opportunity so in certain cases it might be unusable or too risky to use with your poor AC which the subclass itself does not fix.
new spells: thats what the expanded spell list exists for. Its not really something out of the ordinary and the spell list itself is good, not fantastic but with that said, the spell list is probably the best and most exciting feature in the entire subclass which is not ideal to say the least.
other subclasses might not be ideal, but neither is this, it does not fix the glaring survivability issue since the defensive features are a hindrance to use and even then are poor in what the actually give and if you want to be in melee your still better off multiclassing and at that point any other subclass is better than this.
the dmg on unyielding will is negligible at level 3 and since it does not scale, it becomes useless very fast. And as I already said unyielding will is decent but only 1 use is too few and yeah the spell list is great and fun but not worth taking the subclass for it because the rest of the features are simply bad.
the level 14 feature is also laughable 3D6 dmg once per long rest and two minor features which should be part of the base hexblades curse.
multiclassing is definitely better and again if im multiclassing im dropping hexblade all together since the other subclasses grant better benefits at less of a cost. Im not sure where you are getting the 5 spells from since you only have 2 spell slots, but even so, I would rather push my features a level back bit have armor prof on top of con saves, masteries and fighting styles. With a pure hexblade you still get like a 17 AC but only if you invest in armor of shadows and be within 10 of your curse target. While I can where halfplate and take defense and be at 18 AC all the time not to mention if I get magical armor I can wear it while with the pure hexblade you are stuck without armor or have to give up 50% of your hexbaldes curse benefits.
No matter how you spin it the UA hexblade is poorly designed, there is no feature which feels remotely good to use or powerful enough compared to what you can get from other subclasses. It does not fix any of the issues bladelocks have (it tries to, but it fails to do so because the features are weak), non of the damaging features scale so they start feeling weak almost immediately and the few features you have that are not tied to the curse target are either weak/difficult to use or limited in use (unyielding will). This version is uninspired and unfortunately it shows that it had been designed by people who dont get what the hexblade is supposed to be mechanically. Its trying too hard to not be the PotB subclass while still trying to weave in some features which encourage melee weapon fighting and it juts ends up failing on all fronts.
the hexbalde needs to do 4 things:
- give warlocks good AC and defensive options that can be easily accessed and maintained so it can reliably exist in melee, either through armor and shield profs or some sort of bonus that scales with their CHA ( they gave it to draconic sorcs, genie palys and bladesinger wizards I dont see why they shouldnt give it to the frontline warlock subclass).
- restore hexbaldes curse to be as close to the original as possible meaning improved crit, healing on kill and se sort kf a dmg boost.
- have features which combine sword and sorcery like they gave other gish subclasses and lean more into the melee weapon fighting power fantasy without being afraid it will end up the default PotB pick, it is supposed to be.
- lastly it should not be fully dependent on the hexblades curse. Its ok to have some features which work on the cursed target but it needs to have features which can also stand on their own. Being able to function only against one target is neither fun nor satisfying to play ( something which the original hexblade suffered from but hex warrior and hexblades curse where powerful enough to make this issue be negligible).
Agreed. Except you don’t necessarily need STR. With 14 DEX you can wear a half plate which is only 1 AC short of a fullplate.
The reason I keep saying I would prefer a feature which boosts your AC that scales with CHA is because it would allow the warlock to go pure hexblade and not feel bad about its defences. If it was something like add CHA modifier to AC while not wearing armor I would be happy to take armor of shadows, but for a measly +2 im just gonna start fighter and not even bother trying.