So my group is doing a partially house-rules ToA, and the DM decided that during the week (between sessions) that we could 'craft' things they approved of over the course of the week, so that technically our characters were still doing something in the void.
I chose carpenter over woodcarver, because i thought it would apply, as opposed to say carving totems or something (as that's what I personally assume carvers tools can do)
I had chosen Carpenter's Tools proficiency/tools (mainly to repair my rangers bow if it broke). But after the DM said what they said about crafting approved items during the week i thought "Hmm, we're in a jungle, perhaps our fighter could cut down a tree and I could attempt to make a better bow?" using my carpenters tools - to which I was promptly told "No, carpenters cannot make weapons, they can build houses and boats, but your tools don't say you can make weapons" then corrected herself and said "Maybe a staff but not a bow"
They then pointed to the fact our fighter had the Blacksmithing tools proficiency/tools and that he could make both weapons and armor and that HE could make a bow AND arrows but that I could not. Again they said "your tools don't allow you to do that"
But to me, this doesn't make sense.. because I'm thinking in standard RPG terms for crafts where a blacksmith can make weapons of light/heavy metal, and armor of light/heavy metal or things like metal cookpots etc. While a carpenter (or perhaps a woodcarver but not sure) can make wooden weapons/shield or boats and the like.
So Am I wrong?
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Also bonus question, i havent brought this up to our DM because I'm not 100% sure I'm right or wrong. My ranger is a Tabaxi, and this question specifically applies to the:
"Cat's Talent - You have proficiency in the Perception and Stealth skills."
my base perception on the character sheet is 4, and my base stealth is 6.
But are those numbers the total including cat's talent since it's a racial trait?
Or does this mean I gain my proficiency bonuses on top for +6 perception, and +8 stealth?
Ability checks - and by extension skills, tools and vehicle proficiencies - are open-ended systems. There isn't an exhaustive list of things that you can do with a set of tools. The crafting rules are likewise open-ended and say that you must have the right tools and materials, but don't go on to define what those are for each item. Thus, "your tools don't say you can make weapons" is faulty logic; they don't have to say that to enable you to make weapons. Likewise, saying that a blacksmith's tools are useful for making a wooden bow is silly.
Where I will agree with the DM is that carpenter's tools are mainly meant to build structures. Xanathar's Guide to Everything lists the contents of carpenter's tools as "a saw, a hammer, nails, a hatchet, a square, a ruler, an adze, a plane, and a chisel." Contrast that with woodcarver's tools: "a knife, a gouge, and a small saw." Xanathar's Guide to Everything lists crafting arrows as one of the things you can use woodcarver's tools for. The rules don't say which set of tools is more fit for crafting a bow.
Carpenter Tools are for structures, vehicles, or any larger wooden object that doesn't need fine detail.
Woodcarving Tools are for fine detail wood work, like bows, staves, totems, and the like. It can also be used with Carpenter Tools to make things like totem poles and adding fine details to door frames and such.
I would also agrue that you would only be able to make a bow with Blacksmithing Tools if the bow was made with metal.
As far as the question with Cat's Talent, it just gives you proficiency with those skills. Same way you get proficiencies with your class and background.
Regarding your wish to craft a bow, maybe you can convince your DM to consider using probability to determine your success. Possibly you can talk him into avoiding absolute scenarios. Rather than thinking "No, that's not possible," maybe the DM could think, "That will be very difficult, but you can certainly give it a go." Then the DM could set a Difficulty Class for the thing you're trying to do and allow you to roll.
If your wis and dex are say, 12 and 16 respectively and you have +3 proficiency at lets say level 5 your perception and stealth are +4 and +6. It is very unlikely that your stealth is +6 without proficiency
Regarding your wish to craft a bow, maybe you can convince your DM to consider using probability to determine your success. Possibly you can talk him into avoiding absolute scenarios. Rather than thinking "No, that's not possible," maybe the DM could think, "That will be very difficult, but you can certainly give it a go." Then the DM could set a Difficulty Class for the thing you're trying to do and allow you to roll.
That or asks the DM for a mulligan and replace Carpenter tools for woodcarving tools.
I just figured it out Bdaddly, it's already intrinsically there for my +6 (18 dex)
i had to take a better look at the breakdown on my perception
i have 14 wisdom, which = +2, then if I added my proficiency, my perception score gets a total of +4 (or +5 at level 5 etc) I was just looking at it wrong.
It's a house rules campaign. Doesn't sound like if it's common sense to make a bow with certain tools really matters. I think instead of a common sense argument, simply telling the DM what you want to do, and asking if they can somehow fit that into the world setting and your character would be a better option.
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So my group is doing a partially house-rules ToA, and the DM decided that during the week (between sessions) that we could 'craft' things they approved of over the course of the week, so that technically our characters were still doing something in the void.
I chose carpenter over woodcarver, because i thought it would apply, as opposed to say carving totems or something (as that's what I personally assume carvers tools can do)
I had chosen Carpenter's Tools proficiency/tools (mainly to repair my rangers bow if it broke). But after the DM said what they said about crafting approved items during the week i thought "Hmm, we're in a jungle, perhaps our fighter could cut down a tree and I could attempt to make a better bow?" using my carpenters tools - to which I was promptly told "No, carpenters cannot make weapons, they can build houses and boats, but your tools don't say you can make weapons" then corrected herself and said "Maybe a staff but not a bow"
They then pointed to the fact our fighter had the Blacksmithing tools proficiency/tools and that he could make both weapons and armor and that HE could make a bow AND arrows but that I could not. Again they said "your tools don't allow you to do that"
But to me, this doesn't make sense.. because I'm thinking in standard RPG terms for crafts where a blacksmith can make weapons of light/heavy metal, and armor of light/heavy metal or things like metal cookpots etc. While a carpenter (or perhaps a woodcarver but not sure) can make wooden weapons/shield or boats and the like.
So Am I wrong?
-----
Also bonus question, i havent brought this up to our DM because I'm not 100% sure I'm right or wrong. My ranger is a Tabaxi, and this question specifically applies to the:
"Cat's Talent - You have proficiency in the Perception and Stealth skills."
my base perception on the character sheet is 4, and my base stealth is 6.
But are those numbers the total including cat's talent since it's a racial trait?
Or does this mean I gain my proficiency bonuses on top for +6 perception, and +8 stealth?
Occassional Dungeon Master.
Ability checks - and by extension skills, tools and vehicle proficiencies - are open-ended systems. There isn't an exhaustive list of things that you can do with a set of tools. The crafting rules are likewise open-ended and say that you must have the right tools and materials, but don't go on to define what those are for each item. Thus, "your tools don't say you can make weapons" is faulty logic; they don't have to say that to enable you to make weapons. Likewise, saying that a blacksmith's tools are useful for making a wooden bow is silly.
Where I will agree with the DM is that carpenter's tools are mainly meant to build structures. Xanathar's Guide to Everything lists the contents of carpenter's tools as "a saw, a hammer, nails, a hatchet, a square, a ruler, an adze, a plane, and a chisel." Contrast that with woodcarver's tools: "a knife, a gouge, and a small saw." Xanathar's Guide to Everything lists crafting arrows as one of the things you can use woodcarver's tools for. The rules don't say which set of tools is more fit for crafting a bow.
Carpenter Tools are for structures, vehicles, or any larger wooden object that doesn't need fine detail.
Woodcarving Tools are for fine detail wood work, like bows, staves, totems, and the like. It can also be used with Carpenter Tools to make things like totem poles and adding fine details to door frames and such.
I would also agrue that you would only be able to make a bow with Blacksmithing Tools if the bow was made with metal.
As far as the question with Cat's Talent, it just gives you proficiency with those skills. Same way you get proficiencies with your class and background.
@quickstudy Ok.. So then my perception and stealth are + 4, and + 6, and not + 6 and +8 then?
Occassional Dungeon Master.
Regarding your wish to craft a bow, maybe you can convince your DM to consider using probability to determine your success. Possibly you can talk him into avoiding absolute scenarios. Rather than thinking "No, that's not possible," maybe the DM could think, "That will be very difficult, but you can certainly give it a go." Then the DM could set a Difficulty Class for the thing you're trying to do and allow you to roll.
If your wis and dex are say, 12 and 16 respectively and you have +3 proficiency at lets say level 5 your perception and stealth are +4 and +6. It is very unlikely that your stealth is +6 without proficiency
Extended Signature
I just figured it out Bdaddly, it's already intrinsically there for my +6 (18 dex)
i had to take a better look at the breakdown on my perception
i have 14 wisdom, which = +2, then if I added my proficiency, my perception score gets a total of +4 (or +5 at level 5 etc) I was just looking at it wrong.
Occassional Dungeon Master.
It's a house rules campaign. Doesn't sound like if it's common sense to make a bow with certain tools really matters. I think instead of a common sense argument, simply telling the DM what you want to do, and asking if they can somehow fit that into the world setting and your character would be a better option.