OK so I was surfing youtube looking for "how to play" and "How to be a DM" ran across a guy whos title said some thing like "are your players murder hobo's" I thought well that sounds kinda negative. 

I admit my wow toons are mostly female blood elves my all time favorite is a hunter with her cat putiecat and I enjoyed long walks in the woods  seeking out wild life and then killing them, skinning their bodys and selling the hides in the AH...good times...

Yes back in the 80's we did engage in "hack and slash" campaigns and power play mayhem. So times it's just fun to kill every thing with your chaotic evil fire giant......

I am not saying that the new generation is a soft huges and kisses with the enemy. Gary him self in the basic beginner module book said try to get the party to take to the kobold's….  

I admit I am new here coming from decades of killing every thing I come across. The game has changed but is was always chaotic good against the evil. So here I am not happy there in NOT a blood elf in the basic's STIll four decades later and on the 3rd ownership of the game. I am my own.

Granted She is a sub race of drow and I made her purple skin eyes and hair; a sub class (on my hard cover copy I'll just make it a stand alone class. anyway I digress the sub-race is a female lead race of sadistic evil dominatrix women who enslave the males and sacrifice them to Lilith after mating. The sub-class is way worse then the basic population of females and is because of the matriarchy society only female. so basically she loathes every one. 

I guess shame name calling didn't go away it just got creative. as Murder hobo is kind of negative. The Grimm killed them all back in their day but NO Nick had to be the touchy feely kinda grimm I was always on Adalinds side. 

If the party is all made up of chaotic evil toons what would we do? Hunter down the Alliance party!

"For The Horde" 

I think the game has just evolved more. While there are certainly hack and slash adventures that are fitting to your playstyle, the playstyle of murder hobo has gotten a bad rep, but it should be one of those things like, everyone at the table is a murder hobo or none of you. Otherwise it will cause complications. The player who wants to kill everything could cause problems for the rest of the group, and they may not be okay with that. 

There's nothing wrong with being a murder hobo, but it should be understood by everyone what kind of game you want to be playing.

I've always had difficulties connecting to evil characters, so I never roll them. However, I love mobster movies and have always been interested in being the Boss of a criminal organization (in D&D obviously). You could get creative that way if you're set on the path of evil. Try to be bigger and badder than the worst organization in your campaign, or strive to create your own. That way you can take the 'hobo' out of 'murder hobo' and just call yourself a murderer for hire. 

 "A murderer for hire" sounds kind of condescending in a game where reward, paid bountys or treasure taken after killing is the center of the game. Soldiers/fighters are paid killers. Your character kills a kobold you don't think your self a murderer? You know the other kobolds do...

So I am making a sub-race of dominatrixes who split from the drow race because they interpreted the will of Lilith that females are the superior sex and that their goddess was displeased with the patriarch system of the drow. Splintering to a new race of sadistically cruel domineering sadist. Not going in to my class of assassin/priestesses that make the sadistically cruel domineering sadist look vanilla.

Am I chaotic evil in nature I mean I don't make baby stew from infants but that I think of such things is kind of disturbing to most. But I have always had a sick and twisted sense of humor.

Yes I was the one on IMDB Grimm board advocating of a Hexenbiest when every one thought her evil. Yes I am Horde and killed a lot of Allinace players...... Yes I want to play a Chaotic evil assassin/priestess yes I want to run my own champagne. Think how much fun it would be to have 2 partys one good and the other evil pited againest each other. good times to be had...

the first edition had over a page for assassins second edition didn't have a single word about it like banished from the game the same with the DM guides. =/ can't say about 2nd revised 3, 3.5,4,5th.....

Oh man. When I started playing, the common mode of play as far as I knew was

1. Enter dungeon.
2. Kill everything in dungeon.
3. Exit dungeon.

What were the things in the dungeon? Just random stuff yanked out of the monster manuals, plopped down in side-by-side rooms in the dungeon with a common door that somehow none of the monsters ever went through, but you sure did. Orcs! Kill em! Giants! Kill em! Demon! Kill it! Unicorn! Kill it! :D

Bear in mind I was in 3rd grade. But the idea of sometimes negotiating, and the idea that all orcs might not deserve death, was something that had to slowly seep into our consciousnesses. Even in pre-bought modules for 1st Ed or Basic/Advanced, there was very little in the way of suggesting that you might not just kill everything you met. Except for towns, of course. You don't kill the shopkeepers. But even the 'good' characters were just expected to 'make their living' by leaving a trail of monster blood behind them.

I started played in 3rd grade, and the idea of handing out XP for non-lethal neutralizing of threats wasn't something we did I think maybe until I was in college, LOL. And then, White Wolf was around, and suddenly more and more people were trying to make the game about more than monster-slaughter, and poof--maybe a whole session without combat. Unheard of in my youth. (I love it now, but I would have thought you were an alien or a commie for suggesting it when I was a kid.)

LOL "all orcs might not deserve death"

(me) looking at the lawful good fighter. "what do you mean we should let him go?"

(fighter) "He told we all he knows."

(me) "So you want to let the evil orc who has been raiding the travelers and killing them go because he supposedly told us all he knows?"

(fighter) "yes"

(me) "So he can run to his orc friends and come back in numbers and kill us all?"

It just might be me as I am 101st Airborne but all orcs deserve death..... I am only good with one feeling and thats Rage! =P

Quote from XXSUPERHEROXX >>

 "A murderer for hire" sounds kind of condescending in a game where reward, paid bountys or treasure taken after killing is the center of the game. Soldiers/fighters are paid killers. Your character kills a kobold you don't think your self a murderer? You know the other kobolds do...

It would be if that's what's at the centre of your game. My last game, the PCs were fleeing for their lives from a genocidal coup and trying to find out where all the evil fiends destroying villages were coming from. If you enjoy killing everything in the dungeon, that's fine - but arguably the hobby has grown because there are more interesting characters to play and stories to be told,

I am sorry I read this three times and well I got questions.

genocidal - relating to or involving the deliberate killing of a large group of people of a particular nation or ethnic group.

Coup - a sudden, violent, and illegal seizure of power from a government? or a notable or successful stroke or move.

were they running or trying to find the evil fiends? not sure about the hobby has grown thing if they stop running from the genocidal government or the genocidal people trying to take over the government are they going to kill the fiends or just going to give then a very stern scolding and the hollow threat of a time out in the corner? Not sure when it's ok to kill them now do we chase them away so they can keep destroying villages? 

Quote from XXSUPERHEROXX >>

I am sorry I read this three times and well I got questions.

genocidal - relating to or involving the deliberate killing of a large group of people of a particular nation or ethnic group.

Coup - a sudden, violent, and illegal seizure of power from a government? or a notable or successful stroke or move.

were they running or trying to find the evil fiends? not sure about the hobby has grown thing if they stop running from the genocidal government or the genocidal people trying to take over the government are they going to kill the fiends or just going to give then a very stern scolding and the hollow threat of a time out in the corner? Not sure when it's ok to kill them now do we chase them away so they can keep destroying villages? 

 Yes, I know what genocide and coup mean. And why couldn't they be doing both?

And of course they were killing things, it just wasn't central to the game.

It's like Grimm's on the TV show. You suppose to think that the Grimm's were the hero's but they were in fact Genocidal maniacs. So what your saying is that your players were basically taking care of the problem with a permeant solution. Well maybe not permeant if the monsters have a necromancer. So how were they to resolve the village burning if you didn't want them to kill anything? 

Murder Hobo is a two part description.  The murder part just means you go around killing anything and everything for the sole purpose of loot and xp.  The Hobo description eludes to the fact that you don't give any consideration to any other aspect of the game.  You are a homeless vagabond with literally no motivation, prospects or interests.  It's not the same as just a pure hack and slash.  You know if you're a murder hobo if you don't ever engage with NPCs for any other reason then "tell me where to go, and what to kill, and for how much"

Having an evil character does not make a Murder Hobo.  In fact if you give any consideration to your alignment then you aren't really a murder hobo, because you have put at least a little bit of thought into your character.  

If you have to ask...

I never said I didn’t want them to kill anything, it’s just not a mindless murder feat and take the gold. 

Murder Hobo is a two part description.  The murder part just means you go around killing anything and everything for the sole purpose of loot and xp.  The Hobo description eludes to the fact that you don't give any consideration to any other aspect of the game.  You are a homeless vagabond with literally no motivation, prospects or interests.  It's not the same as just a pure hack and slash.  You know if you're a murder hobo if you don't ever engage with NPCs for any other reason then "tell me where to go, and what to kill, and for how much"

Thank you. I've always struggled to articulate what a Murder Hobo is. And from now on this is how I will describe it.

And to add, although I believe it is also implied in your comment, just because you're evil doesn't mean you kill indiscriminately. If you have any notion of long term plans that is one sure fire way to draw attention to your activities. Using evil as an excuse for unfettered killing? Murder Hobo.

Murder hobo's can be lawful good characters as well as chaotic evil.  It's the lack of interests in the world at large that makes them a murder hobo, not the actual act of murdering someone.  

If you play a chaotic evil character for example and you pursue an action that would be contrary to your overall well being... 

Example:  you kill a city guard who spits at you.  You know full well that you're going to bring down the wrath of the entire city watch, but it doesn't matter if your character will be killed... a chaotic evil character would not stand to be spat at without retaliation. 

This would not be a murder hobo... the consideration given to their alignment, even if it probably means their death, is good roll playing.

The definition of hobo is a homeless person or a migrant worker. 

The definition of murder is the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another or kill (someone) unlawfully and with premeditation. Serial killer would be more accurate I guess you might call them a hobo but your not sure their all homeless Serial killer would be a person killing to fill a need whether that's greed or some sick thrill pleasure. 

Homeless? are all adventurers homeless or are some or a lot have homes their just out on a job to end the burning of villages? 

Getting past that people just do not know the meaning of words they think they know and they get offended if you call them illiterate. If I am hired to end the burning of villages then killing is a big part of bring about a solution. 

alignment if a guard spat in a chaotic evil players face the Player if given that he or she is really playing in to their toon would not simply kill the guard out right they would walk away and make plans to kill every one in that guards life that he or she loved making it hideous and painful and last a long time for the poor unfortunate loved ones or friends  of the guard.  The player would let the guard live as there is more pain in living when all you knew are dead and died horribly and he would be shunned as all how get close to him die horribly. 

I disagree.  A Chaotic character is more rash... but I suppose that is up to interpretation and playstyle.  We know what the words Murder and  Hobo mean in their literally definition, but Murder Hobo is a D&D urban term that has a slightly different meaning.  It's describing a specific type of player.

Quote from XXSUPERHEROXX >>

The definition of hobo is a homeless person or a migrant worker.  

A hobo originally was a very specific sort of 'homeless' person. Hobos were sometimes willingly homeless, and were actively looking for work (as opposed to 'bums'). So the migrant worker definition is pretty close, but just 'homeless person' doesn't capture 'hobo'. 

See that is the problem people who do not really know what words mean and just assume what they mean use them then they become slag/urban highjacked. 

For an example a  acronyms for 'Fornication under commandment of the king. was not a word but when people used it it became a word then people used it as an exlamation point then the beginning defination became a long list of urban slag the meaning is lost and you have to interpete the meaning of it in it's use and inflextion. 

so orange is the new black in a closed group as they hijacked the word to a new meaning so when you say orange in your group they alone know you mean black and every one else just think your not educated. blah blah blah. 

Migrant worked are not homeless they just travel to where the work is such as picking produce or where the work is for a set time then go home. 

I feel like you're going on a huge tangent.  Murder Hobo (originally murderous hobo) is a uniquely D&D phrase that wasn't hijacked from anywhere else.  It's just an expression to describe a play style.  The word meaning is also pretty on point.  I agree it carries a negative connotation, and that is because the majority of pen and paper RPG players prefer a more story-centric game.  These days there is a ton of other outlets that satisfies the "Murder Hobo" play (video games etc..). 

The "Fornication under commandment of the king" is also a bit of a myth, though the true etymology is probably even further away from what the word is used for today.  Language (especially English) evolves at an extremely fast rate.  When you read a random text from 100 years ago the language is wildly different.  You can't really fight it.  

A migrant worker is homeless if they literally don't have a home.  In D&D's case how many people actually play with homes and upkeep and downtime etc... a lot do not... so most people are already firmly in the hobo category.