I just picked up this spell and was wondering if I could twin it. You can only twin a spell that targets one creature, and when you cast it it only targets one, so could you twin it?
is incapable of targeting more than one creature at the spell’s current level
If you know this rule yet are still unsure whether a particular spell qualifies for Twinned Spell, consult with your DM, who has the final say. If the two of you are curious about our design intent, here is the list of things that disqualify a spell for us:
The spell has a range of self.
The spell can target an object.
The spell allows you to choose more than one creature to be affected by it, particularly at the level you’re casting the spell. Some spells increase their number of potential targets when you cast them at a higher level.
The spell can force more than one creature to make a saving throw before the spell’s duration expires.
The spell lets you make a roll of any kind that can affect more than one creature before the spell’s duration expires
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Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
is incapable of targeting more than one creature at the spell’s current level
If you know this rule yet are still unsure whether a particular spell qualifies for Twinned Spell, consult with your DM, who has the final say. If the two of you are curious about our design intent, here is the list of things that disqualify a spell for us:
The spell has a range of self.
The spell can target an object.
The spell allows you to choose more than one creature to be affected by it, particularly at the level you’re casting the spell. Some spells increase their number of potential targets when you cast them at a higher level.
The spell can force more than one creature to make a saving throw before the spell’s duration expires.
The spell lets you make a roll of any kind that can affect more than one creature before the spell’s duration expires
But the offending AoE attack is not a direct effect of the Dragon's Breath casting. The spell grants the creature a new option for the Attack action. It does not, itself, inflict that damage.
Basically that SAC clarification was written for dragon's breath first and foremost. You can go back to earlier tweets before the SAC and see where the wording originated during answers to the question of twinning DB. Take that as you will, but the designers clearly didn't want that spell to be twinned.
But the offending AoE attack is not a direct effect of the Dragon's Breath casting. The spell grants the creature a new option for the Attack action. It does not, itself, inflict that damage.
You're trying to argue that the effect of Dragon's Breath is not a direct result of the Dragon's Breath spell?
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Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
Basically the designers made a booboo and dropped the ball with twinned spell and how it works. They didn't actually write it out properly, which is why so many people get confused about it as their explanation in Sage Advice (which is RAI) doesn't actually match the RAW.
It's up to your DM decide which to go with: the RAW or the RAI.
Personally I would say no. Not because of RAW/RAI, simply because it'd be too powerful if you could. I'd probably consider re-writing it, because the RAW of it is broken and RAI excludes too many spells to be as useful. Then again, I'm unhappy with all metamagic and how its done in this edition, so I'm maybe biased.
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One way to make it explicit would be to make a Twin flag and apply it to every spell where it is applicable just like they do with R ritual spells and C concentration spells.
But the offending AoE attack is not a direct effect of the Dragon's Breath casting. The spell grants the creature a new option for the Attack action. It does not, itself, inflict that damage.
You're trying to argue that the effect of Dragon's Breath is not a direct result of the Dragon's Breath spell?
No, I'm saying the targeting for the spell Dragon's Breath is a different targeting parameter than the breath weapon action it grants. The creature using the breath weapon attack is the one triggering the save, not the person (usually) casting Dragon's Breath.
But the offending AoE attack is not a direct effect of the Dragon's Breath casting. The spell grants the creature a new option for the Attack action. It does not, itself, inflict that damage.
You're trying to argue that the effect of Dragon's Breath is not a direct result of the Dragon's Breath spell?
No, I'm saying the targeting for the spell Dragon's Breath is a different targeting parameter than the breath weapon action it grants. The creature using the breath weapon attack is the one triggering the save, not the person (usually) casting Dragon's Breath.
Ok, but the writers gave some extra direction on how they rule for twinning spells and that includes: The spell can force more than one creature to make a saving throw before the spell’s duration expires. That doesn't care who the attacker is, it cares that the spel CAN force more than one creature to make a saving throw before it expires.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Canto alla vita alla sua bellezza ad ogni sua ferita ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
It should be noted that the last 5 bullet points on the list are RAI (and clearly written as such) - not RAW. They are intended for spells where it's still ambiguous based on the first three bullet points. So it doesn't really matter what the last 5 say. RAW it can be twinned. Obviously RAI it cannot. It all depends on which the DM decides to go with.
I just picked up this spell and was wondering if I could twin it. You can only twin a spell that targets one creature, and when you cast it it only targets one, so could you twin it?
Let's see...
Targets only one creature: check
Doesn't have a range of self: check.
Looks like.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
If you're going by the most recent comments from Sage Advice, I think it would be a no:
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
But the offending AoE attack is not a direct effect of the Dragon's Breath casting. The spell grants the creature a new option for the Attack action. It does not, itself, inflict that damage.
Basically that SAC clarification was written for dragon's breath first and foremost. You can go back to earlier tweets before the SAC and see where the wording originated during answers to the question of twinning DB. Take that as you will, but the designers clearly didn't want that spell to be twinned.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
You're trying to argue that the effect of Dragon's Breath is not a direct result of the Dragon's Breath spell?
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
To put it simply:
RAW: Yes.
RAI: No.
Basically the designers made a booboo and dropped the ball with twinned spell and how it works. They didn't actually write it out properly, which is why so many people get confused about it as their explanation in Sage Advice (which is RAI) doesn't actually match the RAW.
It's up to your DM decide which to go with: the RAW or the RAI.
Personally I would say no. Not because of RAW/RAI, simply because it'd be too powerful if you could. I'd probably consider re-writing it, because the RAW of it is broken and RAI excludes too many spells to be as useful. Then again, I'm unhappy with all metamagic and how its done in this edition, so I'm maybe biased.
Click ✨ HERE ✨ For My Youtube Videos featuring Guides, Tips & Tricks for using D&D Beyond.
Need help with Homebrew? Check out ✨ this FAQ/Guide thread ✨ by IamSposta.
One way to make it explicit would be to make a Twin flag and apply it to every spell where it is applicable just like they do with R ritual spells and C concentration spells.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
No, I'm saying the targeting for the spell Dragon's Breath is a different targeting parameter than the breath weapon action it grants. The creature using the breath weapon attack is the one triggering the save, not the person (usually) casting Dragon's Breath.
Ok, but the writers gave some extra direction on how they rule for twinning spells and that includes: The spell can force more than one creature to make a saving throw before the spell’s duration expires. That doesn't care who the attacker is, it cares that the spel CAN force more than one creature to make a saving throw before it expires.
Canto alla vita
alla sua bellezza
ad ogni sua ferita
ogni sua carezza!
I sing to life and to its tragic beauty
To pain and to strife, but all that dances through me
The rise and the fall, I've lived through it all!
It should be noted that the last 5 bullet points on the list are RAI (and clearly written as such) - not RAW. They are intended for spells where it's still ambiguous based on the first three bullet points. So it doesn't really matter what the last 5 say. RAW it can be twinned. Obviously RAI it cannot. It all depends on which the DM decides to go with.
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Rules as Intended as Written in Sage Advice Compendium
"Not all those who wander are lost"