Hello all! This is my first post here. This is my first game and I am currently a mountain dwarf barb. Stats are:
Str:17; Dex 10; Con 17; Int: 9; Wis: 12; Cha 10
At level 1, I got extremely lucky pulling from the deck of many things the moon card. This earned me a magical maul called the tenderizer. It gets plus 1 to attack and damage whenever my health hits 3/4, 1/2, and 1/4 of total. We are now level 3 and I'm a bear totem barbarian. At level 4, with these stats and maul, I'm grabbing GWM. I talked to my DM and he said that we will more than likely stop at lvl 10. With that in mind, I want to take this to level 5 for the extra attack and switch to fighter. This is where I need advice. Do I take champion or rune knight?
For further help, this is my party composition: Cleric, Ranger, Rogue, and 3 npcs that rotate (artificer, monk, and sorcerer). We do have druid pc but just recently he has been spotty with play due to personal reasons.
Uhm... before the whole advice thing, what in the world is a level one party doing with the deck of many things?
Right. Focus. Advice. Before we talk about the subclasses, something you might want to know. Don't go all out fighter for the last five levels. If you really want a fighter multiclass, stop at level 4. Extra attack doesn't stack, so staying until level 5 will do nothing for you. Switch back to barbarian at the end.
Onto the subclass. Let's weigh options. Champion gives you a critical hit on 19s and 20s, while rune knight
Hahaha funny story that. It was an reward for delivering a parcel to an archmage unscathed. He gave everyone else a choice of money or a small uncommon magical item. This goofy barb nat 20 and sees an unassuming deck of cards near the guy. I ask out of curiosity and the Mage says "it is a deck of cards that determine one's fate. Perhaps it is fate that you see them." So I ask if I can grab a card. He allows it, I roll % and score one wish. The DM outwardly cursed my luck.
To me, the only benefit to multi classing a fighter and barbarian would be going to higher levels. Even then, I would be looking to take fighter first and get it to 11 for the 3rd attack, then flip to barbarian for the rage bonus and resistance, making the character much tankier. Only going to about 10, I think you'll likely get more out of full barbarian than any perks a fighter may offer.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Talk to your Players.Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
I see and thank you for the response. Way better than the Zoradain. I do have plenty of time before we get to lvl 5. At that time, I'll decide from the way the party moves how I'll progress class wise
Basically you're comparing what you'd get at levels 6,7,8 and 9 for fighter vs barbarian. And then what you'd be giving up at lvl 10 barb.
Barbarian you'd get Aspect of the Beast a middle of the road ability, Feral Instinct which IS really nice, ASI and brutal critical which actually isn't very good. Then you'd be missing out on Spirit Walker, another meh ability.
Fighter you'd get Second Wind which is decent, Action Surge which is S tier, a subclass which is great and an ASI.
To me fighter multiclassing is a no brainer from an optimization standpoint. Staying barb is valid for the roleplay flavor and still decently strong.
I've multiclassed a barb with rune knight and been in a parties with barbs who multiclassed champion and stayed barb all the way. They were all pretty strong, though I did choose rune knight and do think that is the most fun with all the extra options it brings.
Basically you're comparing what you'd get at levels 6,7,8 and 9 for fighter vs barbarian. And then what you'd be giving up at lvl 10 barb.
Barbarian you'd get Aspect of the Beast a middle of the road ability, Feral Instinct which IS really nice, ASI and brutal critical which actually isn't very good. Then you'd be missing out on Spirit Walker, another meh ability.
Fighter you'd get Second Wind which is decent, Action Surge which is S tier, a subclass which is great and an ASI.
To me fighter multiclassing is a no brainer from an optimization standpoint. Staying barb is valid for the roleplay flavor and still decently strong.
I've multiclassed a barb with rune knight and been in a parties with barbs who multiclassed champion and stayed barb all the way. They were all pretty strong, though I did choose rune knight and do think that is the most fun with all the extra options it brings.
Cool! That's was how I was looking at it after dragonlouis pointed it to me. I come from pathfinder 1e and I enjoy the crunchy munchy optimization gameplay. Oh and news on our Druid. He doesn't seem to be able to come back so we lost the guy who could equally tank and take sentinel. I believe I can fill in the gap regardless without the feat and just take my ASI at 8. However, Sentinel could be helpful in combo with Rune Knight since my tenderizer, gwm, and rage will keep my damage viable. Thoughts?
Sentinel is a nice tanky feat. With odd Str and Con scores though bumping them both by one with your lvl 9 (since ASIs are class level not character level) ASI would be a nice boost for dmg, AC and hp. As well as Rune Knight DCs
I'm only minorly familiar with pathfinder, but I don't think they use bounded accuracy like D&D does. With bounded accuracy each +1 matters a lot more.
Oh really?! I must have misread that. I thought ASI was character level based. Oh well...then at level 9 it is! Bounded accuracy is interesting? Even as I looked it up: "Bounded accuracy is a design principle in 5e D&D that limits the numeric bonuses we add to our d20-based rolls. Changes made to the bonuses from previous editions allow us to focus more on how many hits a character can take and what abilities they have, rather than just looking at the numbers." So you are restricted in your numbers and that sucks. Skills, for example, can easily go higher than 30 even at level 5 if you are specialized in your skill in Pathfinder 1e. This will really get crunchy munchy so I'll leave it with just that. Just know, character customization is the sky in Pathfinder 1e. I like to compare it to Path of Exile lol.
Oh really?! I must have misread that. I thought ASI was character level based. Oh well...then at level 9 it is! Bounded accuracy is interesting? Even as I looked it up: "Bounded accuracy is a design principle in 5e D&D that limits the numeric bonuses we add to our d20-based rolls. Changes made to the bonuses from previous editions allow us to focus more on how many hits a character can take and what abilities they have, rather than just looking at the numbers." So you are restricted in your numbers and that sucks. Skills, for example, can easily go higher than 30 even at level 5 if you are specialized in your skill in Pathfinder 1e. This will really get crunchy munchy so I'll leave it with just that. Just know, character customization is the sky in Pathfinder 1e. I like to compare it to Path of Exile lol.
I've played older editions where bonuses continually rise (super high ACs and attack bonuses), so I kind of understand, which is why I mentioned the difference. Bonuses matter more in 5e than in previous editions and PF, so rounding off your Str and Con is helpful.
Hello all! This is my first post here. This is my first game and I am currently a mountain dwarf barb. Stats are:
Str:17; Dex 10; Con 17; Int: 9; Wis: 12; Cha 10
At level 1, I got extremely lucky pulling from the deck of many things the moon card. This earned me a magical maul called the tenderizer. It gets plus 1 to attack and damage whenever my health hits 3/4, 1/2, and 1/4 of total. We are now level 3 and I'm a bear totem barbarian. At level 4, with these stats and maul, I'm grabbing GWM. I talked to my DM and he said that we will more than likely stop at lvl 10. With that in mind, I want to take this to level 5 for the extra attack and switch to fighter. This is where I need advice. Do I take champion or rune knight?
For further help, this is my party composition: Cleric, Ranger, Rogue, and 3 npcs that rotate (artificer, monk, and sorcerer). We do have druid pc but just recently he has been spotty with play due to personal reasons.
Thank you all for time.
Uhm... before the whole advice thing, what in the world is a level one party doing with the deck of many things?
Right. Focus. Advice. Before we talk about the subclasses, something you might want to know. Don't go all out fighter for the last five levels. If you really want a fighter multiclass, stop at level 4. Extra attack doesn't stack, so staying until level 5 will do nothing for you. Switch back to barbarian at the end.
Onto the subclass. Let's weigh options. Champion gives you a critical hit on 19s and 20s, while rune knight
a) gives extra damage
b) gives runes
Take rune knight.
DMing:
The Cataclysm Stadium
Rise of the White Mask
Optimization Guides:
Literally Too Angry to Die - A Guide to Optimizing a Barbarian.
Hahaha funny story that. It was an reward for delivering a parcel to an archmage unscathed. He gave everyone else a choice of money or a small uncommon magical item. This goofy barb nat 20 and sees an unassuming deck of cards near the guy. I ask out of curiosity and the Mage says "it is a deck of cards that determine one's fate. Perhaps it is fate that you see them." So I ask if I can grab a card. He allows it, I roll % and score one wish. The DM outwardly cursed my luck.
So....Rune Knight? Ok!
*face palm*
imagine if you got the Void. Or maybe Donjon. You totally shouldn't have drawn.
DMing:
The Cataclysm Stadium
Rise of the White Mask
Optimization Guides:
Literally Too Angry to Die - A Guide to Optimizing a Barbarian.
Yea...I realized how bad it could have been after the session when the DM showed me what each can do. More like the deck of unfortunate events.
Fighter multi w barb is pointless.
...
unbelievable
DMing:
The Cataclysm Stadium
Rise of the White Mask
Optimization Guides:
Literally Too Angry to Die - A Guide to Optimizing a Barbarian.
Agreed
"Anyone can smith at the cosmic anvil, yet only I can forge a weapon as good as thee."
My Homebrew Please click it, they have my family.
To me, the only benefit to multi classing a fighter and barbarian would be going to higher levels. Even then, I would be looking to take fighter first and get it to 11 for the 3rd attack, then flip to barbarian for the rage bonus and resistance, making the character much tankier. Only going to about 10, I think you'll likely get more out of full barbarian than any perks a fighter may offer.
Talk to your Players. Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
I see and thank you for the response. Way better than the Zoradain. I do have plenty of time before we get to lvl 5. At that time, I'll decide from the way the party moves how I'll progress class wise
Basically you're comparing what you'd get at levels 6,7,8 and 9 for fighter vs barbarian. And then what you'd be giving up at lvl 10 barb.
Barbarian you'd get Aspect of the Beast a middle of the road ability, Feral Instinct which IS really nice, ASI and brutal critical which actually isn't very good. Then you'd be missing out on Spirit Walker, another meh ability.
Fighter you'd get Second Wind which is decent, Action Surge which is S tier, a subclass which is great and an ASI.
To me fighter multiclassing is a no brainer from an optimization standpoint. Staying barb is valid for the roleplay flavor and still decently strong.
I've multiclassed a barb with rune knight and been in a parties with barbs who multiclassed champion and stayed barb all the way. They were all pretty strong, though I did choose rune knight and do think that is the most fun with all the extra options it brings.
Cool! That's was how I was looking at it after dragonlouis pointed it to me. I come from pathfinder 1e and I enjoy the crunchy munchy optimization gameplay. Oh and news on our Druid. He doesn't seem to be able to come back so we lost the guy who could equally tank and take sentinel. I believe I can fill in the gap regardless without the feat and just take my ASI at 8. However, Sentinel could be helpful in combo with Rune Knight since my tenderizer, gwm, and rage will keep my damage viable. Thoughts?
Note: We are still in the middle of level 3.
Sentinel is a nice tanky feat. With odd Str and Con scores though bumping them both by one with your lvl 9 (since ASIs are class level not character level) ASI would be a nice boost for dmg, AC and hp. As well as Rune Knight DCs
I'm only minorly familiar with pathfinder, but I don't think they use bounded accuracy like D&D does. With bounded accuracy each +1 matters a lot more.
Oh really?! I must have misread that. I thought ASI was character level based. Oh well...then at level 9 it is! Bounded accuracy is interesting? Even as I looked it up: "Bounded accuracy is a design principle in 5e D&D that limits the numeric bonuses we add to our d20-based rolls. Changes made to the bonuses from previous editions allow us to focus more on how many hits a character can take and what abilities they have, rather than just looking at the numbers." So you are restricted in your numbers and that sucks. Skills, for example, can easily go higher than 30 even at level 5 if you are specialized in your skill in Pathfinder 1e. This will really get crunchy munchy so I'll leave it with just that. Just know, character customization is the sky in Pathfinder 1e. I like to compare it to Path of Exile lol.
I've played older editions where bonuses continually rise (super high ACs and attack bonuses), so I kind of understand, which is why I mentioned the difference. Bonuses matter more in 5e than in previous editions and PF, so rounding off your Str and Con is helpful.
Older editions? Ah I remember 3.5 and the multitudes of books I still own from it. Anyway, I'll do that with my ASI! Thanks!