I've got an idea but wanted to see what others might think of it.
At level 10, you will need to take Summon Construct (stone version) and have your Animated Performance pet both up.
Round 1 you upcast command on any group you see of enemy making them grovel. You send in your Animated Performance pet in to attack on giving him inspiration (allowed on same turn as a single bonus action). It slam attacks and provides a inspiration dice role of aoe damage to boot. You can then send in your Rock Construct to hit another few times. Leave them both within 10 ft of everyone.
At the next turn of each of the baddies within 10 ft, they have to make a Wis saving throw or lose half movement and no reactions (from Construct). They also lose 10 ft of movement from your Animated pet. Since it costs half movement to stand up, can any of them stand or are they just stuck groveling till we are done with em?
The groveling “command” ends when you attack them. As the groveling is now harmful to them.
This isn't correct. There is a line where if the command itself is directly harmful it ends, but "grovel" is not a harmful command and listed specifically as an example of a valid command and what it does. There is nothing to say that attacking the target stops the command from being carried out.
Bard already has Summon Construct and the AP Pet active.
Bard casts Command. Can move the SC and Pet into position, even attacking.
On Enemy Turn, they drop prone and their turn ends.
Bard next turn, can have the SC and AP Pet attack it with advantage, etc. They could also cast a spell like Command to keep them in place.
Enemy turn, they have 2 effects happen at start and may choose the order. It is better for them to have the Pet's effect first, so their speed is reduced by 10 ft to 20 ft (most likely had 30 ft start speed). The SC effect has them make Wis save, on fail their remaining speed is halved to 5 ft. They can no longer stand up, if so. But even without that your Commands can keep them there - as can any character that grapples them.
The groveling “command” ends when you attack them. As the groveling is now harmful to them.
This isn't correct. There is a line where if the command itself is directly harmful it ends, but "grovel" is not a harmful command and listed specifically as an example of a valid command and what it does. There is nothing to say that attacking the target stops the command from being carried out.
Bard already has Summon Construct and the AP Pet active.
Bard casts Command. Can move the SC and Pet into position, even attacking.
On Enemy Turn, they drop prone and their turn ends.
Bard next turn, can have the SC and AP Pet attack it with advantage, etc. They could also cast a spell like Command to keep them in place.
Enemy turn, they have 2 effects happen at start and may choose the order. It is better for them to have the Pet's effect first, so their speed is reduced by 10 ft to 20 ft (most likely had 30 ft start speed). The SC effect has them make Wis save, on fail their remaining speed is halved to 5 ft. They can no longer stand up, if so. But even without that your Commands can keep them there - as can any character that grapples them.
The OP's tactic is valid.
It is harmful in that they are standing still and groveling while a direct threat and danger to their life attacks them.
🤷🏼♂️
you also couldn’t expect people to grovel while an avalanche bears down on them or a tsunami either. Their lives are still in danger, it is still harmful to them.
harmful does not only mean actively hurting, It also means likely to get you hurt.
OP’s question: “can any of them stand or are they groveling until we are done with em?”
they wouldn’t be groveling via the command spell.
plain and simple answer to the question anyway you want to slice any of the other details that aren’t the direct question that was asked, and answered.
Correct. The actual command spell was only the opening volley of the combo. No other command spell would be issued.
In my mind it's not too far off playing the exact same tactic but using Slow instead of the stone construct. Big difference being that the construct can put out some damage in addition to my other pet and my team.
As to the charms not being as powerful by level 10, I get ya. It's not the only card up this chars sleeve.
Actually envisioned as 3 levels of Armorer Artificer and 17 of creation bard. So the play style is a little closer to controller/tank with a touch of infiltration (when needed), healing and damage. Closest concept char I've done that could pass as a traditional Paladin... but more neutral good.
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I've got an idea but wanted to see what others might think of it.
At level 10, you will need to take Summon Construct (stone version) and have your Animated Performance pet both up.
Round 1 you upcast command on any group you see of enemy making them grovel. You send in your Animated Performance pet in to attack on giving him inspiration (allowed on same turn as a single bonus action). It slam attacks and provides a inspiration dice role of aoe damage to boot. You can then send in your Rock Construct to hit another few times. Leave them both within 10 ft of everyone.
At the next turn of each of the baddies within 10 ft, they have to make a Wis saving throw or lose half movement and no reactions (from Construct). They also lose 10 ft of movement from your Animated pet. Since it costs half movement to stand up, can any of them stand or are they just stuck groveling till we are done with em?
The groveling “command” ends when you attack them. As the groveling is now harmful to them.
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True enough, but both pets act after my turn ends (after Bonus Action on the AP) and their slows take effect prior to any enemy turn.
The other thing of note is by 10th level, charming stuff may or may not be too effective.
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This isn't correct. There is a line where if the command itself is directly harmful it ends, but "grovel" is not a harmful command and listed specifically as an example of a valid command and what it does. There is nothing to say that attacking the target stops the command from being carried out.
The OP's tactic is valid.
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It is harmful in that they are standing still and groveling while a direct threat and danger to their life attacks them.
🤷🏼♂️
you also couldn’t expect people to grovel while an avalanche bears down on them or a tsunami either. Their lives are still in danger, it is still harmful to them.
harmful does not only mean actively hurting, It also means likely to get you hurt.
Blank
OP’s question: “can any of them stand or are they groveling until we are done with em?”
they wouldn’t be groveling via the command spell.
plain and simple answer to the question anyway you want to slice any of the other details that aren’t the direct question that was asked, and answered.
Blank
Correct. The actual command spell was only the opening volley of the combo. No other command spell would be issued.
In my mind it's not too far off playing the exact same tactic but using Slow instead of the stone construct. Big difference being that the construct can put out some damage in addition to my other pet and my team.
As to the charms not being as powerful by level 10, I get ya. It's not the only card up this chars sleeve.
Actually envisioned as 3 levels of Armorer Artificer and 17 of creation bard. So the play style is a little closer to controller/tank with a touch of infiltration (when needed), healing and damage. Closest concept char I've done that could pass as a traditional Paladin... but more neutral good.