I made this Cleric as an alternative to the typical goodie, goodie Life Cleric.
I feel it still has great heal abilities, like Circle of Mortality and ranged Spare the Dying. Keeper of Souls as a free action once per turn. Whaaaaat? He(a)ll Yeah!
Support features like Path to the Grave and Sentinel at Death's Door.
I know pretty much any cleric can heal but, I am having fun as the primary healer with this set up.
To be honest, I made this Cleric because nobody wants to play a healer. I have a Life Cleric and this Grave Cleric in their own games, both are great fun.
This subclass is basically the onlt time spare the dying is useful (in my opinion).
Right? If I have to stand over them and use my turn, I might as well use my medicine check. That provided I have no spell slots to cast a heal.
Someone who understands. People usually talk it up, but because it was (until artificer) only learnable by classes that focus on WIS, medicine checks would usually have a 75% or higher success rate. And in an emergency, 5 silver worth of heal kit even a barbarian can use gets the same job done.
I like the Grave domain, too. I feel like it has more fun story hooks built into it than the Life domain. The abilities are also useful in a way where people aren't always trying to stack more abilities on top of it just to up their kill score.
I like the Grave domain, too. I feel like it has more fun story hooks built into it than the Life domain. The abilities are also useful in a way where people aren't always trying to stack more abilities on top of it just to up their kill score.
I agree. I know all Clerics have the potential to be strong front line melee hitters with heavy armor or nuke spell casters but, I feel their support abilities and flexibility as a class are the strongest aspect of the class.
Life clerics actually bore me a little bit honestly. They focus in on needing to do those healing spells a little too much in some ways if your hooked on trying to use their abilities to maximum effect. And the only real answer they have over other kinds of clerics is "throw more healing at it" and while that is an answer. It's not always an interesting answer. Grave do basically the same thing but with a totally different flavor. And other clerics answer other issues with a bit of their own flavor while still being able to fill that healing/support role too.
It's also why I like forge Domain and the Tempest Domain as well.
Life clerics actually bore me a little bit honestly. They focus in on needing to do those healing spells a little too much in some ways if your hooked on trying to use their abilities to maximum effect. And the only real answer they have over other kinds of clerics is "throw more healing at it" and while that is an answer. It's not always an interesting answer. Grave do basically the same thing but with a totally different flavor. And other clerics answer other issues with a bit of their own flavor while still being able to fill that healing/support role too.
It's also why I like forge Domain and the Tempest Domain as well.
I think part of my issue with playing a healing-focused character is that healing is a bit too cut and dry in D&D. I understand the reason for simple and abstract hp recovery mechanics, but there's none of the thrill of pretending to be a surgeon. This is a fantasy combat-centric game, so that's fine. Given that it is combat-centric, preventing damage by pwning your foes is generally preferable to healing; prevention is more what the game system was designed for.
Quote from Song_of_Blues>>prevention is more what the game system was designed for.
I guess I feel that way too. That is why I like support mechanics more than just burning spell slots with healing spells.
The other problem I have with healing mechanics is that while some classes can continue to put out good results just taking the attack action or using cantrips to do everything from causing damage, creating illusions to reducing damage, there are no "at will" non resource heal abilites.
If you look at the damage most weapon attacks or cantrips do, it wouldn't be ridiculous to make healing word a cantrip...
If you look at the damage most weapon attacks or cantrips do, it wouldn't be ridiculous to make healing word a cantrip...
You mean other than the infinite free healing between battles? There is a whole discussion thread about how healing spirit is overpowered because it can fully heal the party out of battle. And it still takes a level 2 spell slot and some space to move in.
Healing Spirit is poorly defined.Healing Word isn't.
Free constant damage and other effects by melee or magic are OK. But the idea of constant free light heals is bad. Lol, OK then. Guess I'll just burn out all charges on healing kits with my Healer feat. Bye-bye heal spell slots, bye-bye healing kits then bye-bye characters.
Healing Spirit is poorly defined.Healing Word isn't.
Free constant damage and other effects by melee or magic are OK. But the idea of constant free light heals is bad. Lol, OK then. Guess I'll just burn out all charges on healing kits with my Healer feat. Bye-bye heal spell slots, bye-bye healing kits then bye-bye characters.
What do you mean by poorly defined?
The whole concept of encounter difficulty is based on limited resources. Hp is a resource, so it should not be able to recharge without using a different resource like spell slots, hit dice, or a long rest.
Life Clerics are good mechanically but, yeah...a little dull. I think all other domains are more interesting.
That's what's odd that some bring up to me. I can like and enjoy and be creative with something like the Champion. But I find Life Clerics boring for very similar reasons that the Champion gets blamed for. I think it's because I expect and use a different style with things like clerics and don't expect my martial characters to play the same.
Healing Spirit is poorly defined.Healing Word isn't.
Free constant damage and other effects by melee or magic are OK. But the idea of constant free light heals is bad. Lol, OK then. Guess I'll just burn out all charges on healing kits with my Healer feat. Bye-bye heal spell slots, bye-bye healing kits then bye-bye characters.
What do you mean by poorly defined?
The whole concept of encounter difficulty is based on limited resources. Hp is a resource, so it should not be able to recharge without using a different resource like spell slots, hit dice, or a long rest.
healing spirit is rarely as good as it's theory crafted. Even if a DM allows you to abuse it between encounters. It's high co-ordination to even get decent healing out of it and it can end up doing low healing and taking up your concentration slot. It's a spell that has potential and can be good but is massively over valued compared to real world usage. It's not a good spell to bring up in healing arguments because of it.
IMO, everyone ragging on Life Clerics as dull/boring aren't playing them right.
Just because someone is better than someone else at a particular thing doesn't mean they have to focus on that thing. Life Clerics are better at healing when they choose to heal.
My Life Cleric focuses on things that keep my party from getting in trouble in the first place (often needing to save them from themselves). Out of combat, he's a leader, strategist, diplomat, mediator, and therapist. He uses a lot of utility spells (mostly cast as rituals, but not always). A battle avoided is a battle won. In combat, he's a front-line beast. Spirit Guardians, Spiritual Weapon, and a good 'ol Warhammer & Shield are the usual go-to moves with other combat spells peppered in as appropriate.
I rarely actually use spell slots on healing unless the situation is in danger of spiraling downhill. When I need or want to use a slot on healing, I get the largest return on my investment. If one of my spell slots can heal as much as two slots from another healer, that's an extra slot for me to do whatever else I need/want to do.
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Healing Spirit is poorly defined.Healing Word isn't.
Free constant damage and other effects by melee or magic are OK. But the idea of constant free light heals is bad. Lol, OK then. Guess I'll just burn out all charges on healing kits with my Healer feat. Bye-bye heal spell slots, bye-bye healing kits then bye-bye characters.
What do you mean by poorly defined?
The whole concept of encounter difficulty is based on limited resources. Hp is a resource, so it should not be able to recharge without using a different resource like spell slots, hit dice, or a long rest.
healing spirit is rarely as good as it's theory crafted. Even if a DM allows you to abuse it between encounters. It's high co-ordination to even get decent healing out of it and it can end up doing low healing and taking up your concentration slot. It's a spell that has potential and can be good but is massively over valued compared to real world usage. It's not a good spell to bring up in healing arguments because of it.
Right, because a spell that is objectively superior to Healing Word in almost every way is somehow over-valued. 🙄
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You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
You are absolutely right Sigred. Life Clerics are really good. The only reason I said they can be boring is because Life domain is the stereotype healing cleric, picking any other domain basically tells the DM and players that you will be doing things other than healing. It's a somewhat semantical difference in most ways I guess. My Life Cleric is also a front line beast, my Grave Cleric is a caster.
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I made this Cleric as an alternative to the typical goodie, goodie Life Cleric.
I feel it still has great heal abilities, like Circle of Mortality and ranged Spare the Dying. Keeper of Souls as a free action once per turn. Whaaaaat? He(a)ll Yeah!
Support features like Path to the Grave and Sentinel at Death's Door.
I know pretty much any cleric can heal but, I am having fun as the primary healer with this set up.
This subclass is basically the onlt time spare the dying is useful (in my opinion).
Path to the grave can nuke an enemy with the right allies.
Sentinel at death's door can come in clutch to turn an instant kill into a not even downed.
Keeper of souls will only be healing 2-6 damage most of the time, but free heals is free heals.
I still prefer life domain in general, but if your party is punching above their weight class, this could be more helpful.
To be honest, I made this Cleric because nobody wants to play a healer. I have a Life Cleric and this Grave Cleric in their own games, both are great fun.
Right? If I have to stand over them and use my turn, I might as well use my medicine check. That provided I have no spell slots to cast a heal.
Someone who understands. People usually talk it up, but because it was (until artificer) only learnable by classes that focus on WIS, medicine checks would usually have a 75% or higher success rate. And in an emergency, 5 silver worth of heal kit even a barbarian can use gets the same job done.
I like the Grave domain, too. I feel like it has more fun story hooks built into it than the Life domain. The abilities are also useful in a way where people aren't always trying to stack more abilities on top of it just to up their kill score.
I agree. I know all Clerics have the potential to be strong front line melee hitters with heavy armor or nuke spell casters but, I feel their support abilities and flexibility as a class are the strongest aspect of the class.
Life clerics actually bore me a little bit honestly. They focus in on needing to do those healing spells a little too much in some ways if your hooked on trying to use their abilities to maximum effect. And the only real answer they have over other kinds of clerics is "throw more healing at it" and while that is an answer. It's not always an interesting answer. Grave do basically the same thing but with a totally different flavor. And other clerics answer other issues with a bit of their own flavor while still being able to fill that healing/support role too.
It's also why I like forge Domain and the Tempest Domain as well.
Life Clerics are good mechanically but, yeah...a little dull. I think all other domains are more interesting.
I think part of my issue with playing a healing-focused character is that healing is a bit too cut and dry in D&D. I understand the reason for simple and abstract hp recovery mechanics, but there's none of the thrill of pretending to be a surgeon. This is a fantasy combat-centric game, so that's fine. Given that it is combat-centric, preventing damage by pwning your foes is generally preferable to healing; prevention is more what the game system was designed for.
I guess I feel that way too. That is why I like support mechanics more than just burning spell slots with healing spells.
The other problem I have with healing mechanics is that while some classes can continue to put out good results just taking the attack action or using cantrips to do everything from causing damage, creating illusions to reducing damage, there are no "at will" non resource heal abilites.
If you look at the damage most weapon attacks or cantrips do, it wouldn't be ridiculous to make healing word a cantrip...
Maybe, but that's a Whole 'nother kettle of fish right there.
You mean other than the infinite free healing between battles? There is a whole discussion thread about how healing spirit is overpowered because it can fully heal the party out of battle. And it still takes a level 2 spell slot and some space to move in.
Healing Spirit is poorly defined.Healing Word isn't.
Free constant damage and other effects by melee or magic are OK. But the idea of constant free light heals is bad. Lol, OK then. Guess I'll just burn out all charges on healing kits with my Healer feat. Bye-bye heal spell slots, bye-bye healing kits then bye-bye characters.
What do you mean by poorly defined?
The whole concept of encounter difficulty is based on limited resources. Hp is a resource, so it should not be able to recharge without using a different resource like spell slots, hit dice, or a long rest.
That's what's odd that some bring up to me. I can like and enjoy and be creative with something like the Champion. But I find Life Clerics boring for very similar reasons that the Champion gets blamed for. I think it's because I expect and use a different style with things like clerics and don't expect my martial characters to play the same.
healing spirit is rarely as good as it's theory crafted. Even if a DM allows you to abuse it between encounters. It's high co-ordination to even get decent healing out of it and it can end up doing low healing and taking up your concentration slot. It's a spell that has potential and can be good but is massively over valued compared to real world usage. It's not a good spell to bring up in healing arguments because of it.
IMO, everyone ragging on Life Clerics as dull/boring aren't playing them right.
Just because someone is better than someone else at a particular thing doesn't mean they have to focus on that thing. Life Clerics are better at healing when they choose to heal.
My Life Cleric focuses on things that keep my party from getting in trouble in the first place (often needing to save them from themselves). Out of combat, he's a leader, strategist, diplomat, mediator, and therapist. He uses a lot of utility spells (mostly cast as rituals, but not always). A battle avoided is a battle won. In combat, he's a front-line beast. Spirit Guardians, Spiritual Weapon, and a good 'ol Warhammer & Shield are the usual go-to moves with other combat spells peppered in as appropriate.
I rarely actually use spell slots on healing unless the situation is in danger of spiraling downhill. When I need or want to use a slot on healing, I get the largest return on my investment. If one of my spell slots can heal as much as two slots from another healer, that's an extra slot for me to do whatever else I need/want to do.
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
Right, because a spell that is objectively superior to Healing Word in almost every way is somehow over-valued. 🙄
You don't know what fear is until you've witnessed a drunk bird divebombing you while carrying a screaming Kobold throwing fire anywhere and everywhere.
You are absolutely right Sigred. Life Clerics are really good. The only reason I said they can be boring is because Life domain is the stereotype healing cleric, picking any other domain basically tells the DM and players that you will be doing things other than healing. It's a somewhat semantical difference in most ways I guess. My Life Cleric is also a front line beast, my Grave Cleric is a caster.