Now in most of my parties there have been two rogues and the other one always claims Dib's on assassin. so I always play thief and it helps because there have been times where I have tooken more gold from a dragon's treasure spot without the dragon noticing and my friends getting less of it and they're really helps when that potion it's just a little too pricey so that's why I really like the thief not a lot of people like to use it but I do
I agree, the Thief is fun to play; as is the Assassin. The problem I have with the Assassin is he/she is too situational. Overall tho, if I had to choose a Rogue Archetype, I would choose my homebrewed Shadow Stalker every time.
Assassin gives you one thing, Assassinate, all the other abilities it has until 17 are useless, and the Mastermind has an ability at 3 that trumps its ability at 9
Assassin gives you one thing, Assassinate, all the other abilities it has until 17 are useless, and the Mastermind has an ability at 3 that trumps its ability at 9
I basically second this. Though a few arguments could be made for margional usefulness for Extra attack. Most of the class features are just not that great. Even in an RP heavy campaign.
Personally I like a few different types of rogues for different situations. But for a general all arounder I tend to prefer the thief. It's something that I can go into just about every situation a bit differently. It's kit seems a bit basic but it's all in how you use it in some respects. BA slight of hands can open up some interesting options even in the sight of guards. BA use objects can be very beneficial both inside and outside of combat(like feeding that party member that life saving potion AND attacking). And just the general ability to get around or potentially set up and take advantage of some situations on the first turn at high level can all be very nice to have.
I've actually successfully used my first action on a high level thief to convince somebody that I wasn't involved to have them turn away and use their actions only to use my second action to backstab them for big numbers because of their positioning and false sense of security.
In my opinion you have missed out the best option, 'Inquisitive'
Inquisitive rogues are usually have a high Wisdom and when paired with expertise in perception and investigation it's amazing.
I'm currently playing an inquisitive rogue and at 10th level I have passive perception of 23, and can almost always get use of my 5d6 sneak damage.
Hear, hear!!
I'm playing a wood elf Rogue (Inquisitive) and will be dipping Fighter (Battlemaster) - I think I'll be able to give Swashbuckler a run for its money as best melee rogue build!! Time (and play) will tell!
I homebrewed my own archetype called "Shadow Stalker". It's been great to play; IMHO.
Shadow Body
At 3rd level, the rogue can gather the shadows around and within him/her to become incorporeal. In this form, the shadow stalker can't be harmed by conventional means; force and radiant damage can still cause harm. Also in this form, the shadow stalker can slip through doorways and windows just as a shadow would. Shadow Body adds a +2 to stealth checks. It sales to +3 at 6th level, +4 at 11th level, and +5 at 17th. This can be done twice per day per short/long rest.
Shadow Step
At 7th level, the shadow stalker gains the ability to step from one shadow to another. When he/she is in dim light or darkness, as a bonus action, the shadow stalker can teleport up to 60ft to an unoccupied space he/she can see that is also in dim light or darkness. He/she then has advantage on the first melee attack he/she makes before the end of the turn.
Shadow Twin
At 11th level, the shadow stalker can summon his/her shadow into the prime material plane as a bonus action. The shadow twin is identical to the shadow stalker, and is corporeal. It also has identical stats but only half the shadow stalker's HP. The shadow remains for 1d4(+Intelligence Mod) rounds unless it has been reduced to zero HP, dismissed by the shadow stalker, or banished by magical means. The shadow twin has a 40ft maximum distance that it can maintain away from the shadow stalker. The shadow can make attacks, but at the cost of the shadow stalker's attack action. It does 1d4(+Intelligence Mod) necrotic damage.
Fatal Teleport
At 17th level, the shadow stalker can teleport behind a weakened enemy and land a fatal blow. When an enemy has been severely injured in combat, the shadow stalker senses it losing it's grip on life, and can teleport to a maximum of 60ft to that enemey to deliver a melee attack from behind. Upon landing that attack, the enemy must make a constitution save against a DC8(+Proficiency Bonus +Dexterity Mod) or die. On a successful save, the enemy still takes 10d10 necrotic damage. This can only be used once per day per short/long rest.
Shadow Blade
Also at 3rd level, the Shadow Stalker has gained the ability to manifest a dagger made of the stuff of shadow as a bonus action. This dagger deals 2d6 necrotic damage at 3rd level, but increases to 3d6 at 7th level, 4d6 at 11th level, and 5d6 at 17th level. The Shadow Blade remains until it is dismissed by the shadow stalker, or the the Shadow stalker is knocked unconscious. The Shadow Blade can only be manifested twice per day per short/long rest.
Devil's Sight
Beginning at 3rd level the Shadow Stalker gains Devil's Sight. This is a passive ability and not a spell.
You can see normally in darkness, both magical and nonmagical, to a distance of 120 feet.
It seems very overpowered. Shadow body seems similar to the 9th level spell invulnerability except for force and radiant. Maybe if it just gave a stealth bonus? You could make it a bonus action, lasts until end of next turn.
Thanks. I'll consider altering Shadow body slightly to bring it into balance. I'll probably just give it a duration since its not specified as to how long it lasts.
I think Swashbuckler. I'm a huge nerd and I'm very new to this game, so I built a character based on characters in books I love. I think assassin would be y second choice tho.
Some of the archetypes are only available from other online source material, but you don't have to buy the entire book to gain access to them. You can buy for less than $2 other archetypes, like swashbuckler for example. I've bought a couple of source books online like the PHB so I have more choices available when that choice comes up for me.
I am focusing entirely on skills and a bit of combat, so I’m going to definitely pick thief. I like all the features and I will definitely be using the fast hands feature a lot. I cant wait to pickpocket every enemy while I’m fighting them. Also my character is level one and has a plus seven to sleight of hand so I will most likely succeed on those checks.
Honestly, just go for the best you think will fit your character. I’m playing a tabaxi who was interested in a wizards spellbook and stole it, then killed the wizard, so I went for arcane trickster, but I could have been justified in choosing the inquisitive or the mastermind because tabaxis know things, or I could have also gone for thief or assassin, basically, most archetypes are justified if you have the right backstory.
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How so?
Now in most of my parties there have been two rogues and the other one always claims Dib's on assassin. so I always play thief and it helps because there have been times where I have tooken more gold from a dragon's treasure spot without the dragon noticing and my friends getting less of it and they're really helps when that potion it's just a little too pricey so that's why I really like the thief not a lot of people like to use it but I do
I agree, the Thief is fun to play; as is the Assassin. The problem I have with the Assassin is he/she is too situational. Overall tho, if I had to choose a Rogue Archetype, I would choose my homebrewed Shadow Stalker every time.
R. Hamilton
Assassin gives you one thing, Assassinate, all the other abilities it has until 17 are useless, and the Mastermind has an ability at 3 that trumps its ability at 9
Speaking of homebrew I'm making a sniper like class
I basically second this. Though a few arguments could be made for margional usefulness for Extra attack. Most of the class features are just not that great. Even in an RP heavy campaign.
Personally I like a few different types of rogues for different situations. But for a general all arounder I tend to prefer the thief. It's something that I can go into just about every situation a bit differently. It's kit seems a bit basic but it's all in how you use it in some respects. BA slight of hands can open up some interesting options even in the sight of guards. BA use objects can be very beneficial both inside and outside of combat(like feeding that party member that life saving potion AND attacking). And just the general ability to get around or potentially set up and take advantage of some situations on the first turn at high level can all be very nice to have.
I've actually successfully used my first action on a high level thief to convince somebody that I wasn't involved to have them turn away and use their actions only to use my second action to backstab them for big numbers because of their positioning and false sense of security.
Agreed. I think Inquisitive is probably the best archetype for dungeon delving...
I'm currently combining this with Fighter (Battlemaster) and I think it might give Swashbuckler a run for the best melee rogue build. We'll see!!
Hear, hear!!
I'm playing a wood elf Rogue (Inquisitive) and will be dipping Fighter (Battlemaster) - I think I'll be able to give Swashbuckler a run for its money as best melee rogue build!! Time (and play) will tell!
It seems very overpowered. Shadow body seems similar to the 9th level spell invulnerability except for force and radiant. Maybe if it just gave a stealth bonus? You could make it a bonus action, lasts until end of next turn.
Thanks. I'll consider altering Shadow body slightly to bring it into balance. I'll probably just give it a duration since its not specified as to how long it lasts.
R. Hamilton
I think Swashbuckler. I'm a huge nerd and I'm very new to this game, so I built a character based on characters in books I love. I think assassin would be y second choice tho.
I am confused I am 3rd level and trying to choose an archetype. When I go to that place the only choice being offered is a thief. What is going on?
Here is the link to my characters https://ddb.ac/characters/12334105/Nhr35N
Some of the archetypes are only available from other online source material, but you don't have to buy the entire book to gain access to them. You can buy for less than $2 other archetypes, like swashbuckler for example. I've bought a couple of source books online like the PHB so I have more choices available when that choice comes up for me.
How did you get access to that information?
I got bored in October last year, and after watching Critical Role with Matt Mercer and crew, I started looking around on this site.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/marketplace
If you start with the tab for market place, then go to the various books you'll find something like this:
https://www.dndbeyond.com/marketplace/source/players-handbook
You can either pick up the whole book or a single line item. The cost if you decide to pick up the whole book later is reduced when you do that.
Arcane Trickster and Assassin are part of the PHB. Swashbuckler and Mastermind are part of the Sword Coast Adventurers Guide.
I am focusing entirely on skills and a bit of combat, so I’m going to definitely pick thief. I like all the features and I will definitely be using the fast hands feature a lot. I cant wait to pickpocket every enemy while I’m fighting them. Also my character is level one and has a plus seven to sleight of hand so I will most likely succeed on those checks.
Honestly, just go for the best you think will fit your character. I’m playing a tabaxi who was interested in a wizards spellbook and stole it, then killed the wizard, so I went for arcane trickster, but I could have been justified in choosing the inquisitive or the mastermind because tabaxis know things, or I could have also gone for thief or assassin, basically, most archetypes are justified if you have the right backstory.