I played a Rabbitfolk character all the way through and my main spell was MM. It was quite enjoyable and at level 20 the damage was insane. I was a Wizard 1, Hexblade Warlock 1, Fighter 2, Twilight Druid 16. First Round: Bonus Action: Hexblades Curse, Action:9th Level MM(11 darts) with Curse it hits for 1d4+7 per dart. Then use 8d10 per dart on the spell due to Harvest's Scythe ability from Twilight Circle. Action Surge for 8th level MM(10 darts) for the same damage. One turn hits an average of over 1,000 damage! The only problem is facing Spellcasters who might have Shield or Counterspell. And then there's a Damned Tarrasque, but still very fun from level 1-20.
I could see it being useful for disrupting concentration. Just depends on if the DM says you add all the damage together and then make one concentration check (the darts hit simultaneously) or if they roll for each dart. Sure a DC 10 save isn’t that hard to make but having to make three (or more if upcast) in one turn could cause a failed save.
I mean at some point your action deserves more oopmh to help your team? Big boss high CR, you actually going to shoot magic missle instead of banishing a big threat or AOE burning mobs around your team that are focusing the boss? It's value drops a lot the tougher the fights.
It's a great little starter spell or if you are the only range on your team and need to drop those archers, witches on brooms that are peppering the field. Early level only. Depends on builds and team but really shield is the only one that holds it's way to high levels. drop missile between 6-10.
Hate to say it but i've seen so many instances of something big on its last legs in a fight and a wiz/sorc tries to hit it with a save spell and it passes or a attack spell and misses where MM would of finished it off. I find it hard to just write off guaranteed damage with 120 foot range that can also hit multiple targets if needed. I find its the only lvl 1 spell I'm hanging onto as I level higher and higher.
It depends on if your DM rules every missile is a separate concentration check.
If not dump it by level 5, your cantrips will start to out damage it by then, maybe pick up mind sliver or something with a check rather than an attack roll.
If so, then keep it indefinitely for knocking out high level concentration spells if you are facing any kind of casters. If that is the case then it each bolt should also cause hex damage. If you get hex with the fey touched feat you can do a and extra d6 damage on every missile. which makes it over all a very respectable damage when you consider that it cant miss.
If you get hex with the fey touched feat you can do a and extra d6 damage on every missile. which makes it over all a very respectable damage when you consider that it cant miss.
Hex does not work with Magic Missile because it require a attack roll to trigger, thus auto hit spells and spells that require a spell save does not trigger it. Hexblade's Curse however does work because it adds damage to a damage roll. Another way to bump up MM damage is 10 levels of Evocation Wizard.
In terms of when to drop it, MM is a spell that you either love or are indifferent to so if I was playing an Evocation Wizard or dipping into Hexblade Warlock I would have MM on my spell list all the time. However if I am not trying to improve it I find myself not considering learning it the vast majority of the time.
Depends on who you're fighting. If you're facing casters without proficiency in con. saves, hold onto it. Especially if they happen to rely upon spells that require concentration. It's possible to brute force your way into having them break concentration by having them roll multiple times each time you send magic missiles their way.
I never drop Magic Missile on any character I can get it on. Once the damage stops being as useful, it's the perfect thing to use against enemy spellcasters. They have to make a separate concentration check on every missile hit.
There's only two ways they can stop it - either shield or counterspell, and you can avoid the latter if you're more than 60 ft away when you cast it. Either way it burns their reaction.
Forcing someone to make 3 or more concentration checks gives you a pretty good chance of breaking concentration.
I've also used it to wake everyone in the party up who got hit by a Sleep spell.
But the question is, does it actually force multiple concentration saves? I had thought so, but since, according to JC you roll once and each missile does that damage. And they hit simultaneously so it is only one instance of damage. So I can see a DM ruling you take the total damage and that is what the save is made against. I don’t know if there has been anything official on the matter
Firstly figure out if your GM is doing one save or multiple saves for each volley. If it's one save than the spell is pretty useless fairly early on as it just gets outstripped in regard to damage with ONE exception. If multiple saves than you'll want to keep it around for a while.
The one exception is if you are in a PvP-heavy setting and NEED to be able to kill someone. A MM can easily knock-down and kill a very weakened foe or something similar. While this is exceedingly unlikely outside of a PvP setting it's certainly worth noting that being able to hit a foe twice quickly and jump up the number of hits to finish multiple foes and not have to worry about AC/saves/whatever either is useful in such a thing.
If it forces multiple saves... Then what class are you? There's little doubt it will stick in for a while as it's a great way to pop enemy concentration and finish off annoying foes. Attacking a save is nice but not only can enemies save, some of them will have high saves in whatever you wanna cast or some sort of damage resistance so being able to bypass that all for a quick and easy kill...
But you'll soon hit a problem. The Sorc Spell limit. The simple fact is that Sorcs don't get a lot of spells. It's not that bad early on when you know 6-9 spells + cantrips and your spell slots cap out at 4th level, but as you level it's gonna get stretched thinner and thinner and thinner. You'll likely want to capitalize on that high-level stuff, but that means you'll need to make cuts elsewhere. If you're looking to get something like Crown of Stars and have to choose between Magic Missile, which will be good only for breaking concentrations, and Polymorph, which has a wide variety of uses, then MM is gonna have to go. You might keep it around just so that those level 1 slots can be used for something other than spell point fodder, but your focus is gonna be on the more powerful stuff.
If you're multiclassing then it depends on how much you're planning to dip either way. I feel like the definitive point where it will be on the potential chopping block will be level 9 when you gain access to level 5 spells and need to start trimming every little bit of fat possible.
I generally don't ever get it. In any case I can't see keeping it past 3rd level. If I was playing a pure backline caster who does save 1st level slots for shield, I would probably have catapult as my 1st level damage spell.
Once you have a couple hundred gold catapult is generally better than Magic missile because you can use it to hurl oil, acid, alchemists fire, holy water and nets.
I don't face enemies that are making concentration checks enough to make that a deciding factor.
I also want to point out that concentration saves are not 50/50 or anything like that. Due to their low damage it will never be more than a DC10. You're basically hoping you're fighting foes who don't have solid con scores (admittedly a decent assumption for casters) so there's even a chance of them missing without a nat 1.
I generally don't ever get it. In any case I can't see keeping it past 3rd level. If I was playing a pure backline caster who does save 1st level slots for shield, I would probably have catapult as my 1st level damage spell.
Once you have a couple hundred gold catapult is generally better than Magic missile because you can use it to hurl oil, acid, alchemists fire, holy water and nets.
I don't face enemies that are making concentration checks enough to make that a deciding factor.
Hurling oil, acid, fire, water, and nets is all entirely useless unless your DM homebrews the spell to do more than it says it does. Normally, Magic Missile is radically better than Catapult.
Hurling oil, acid, fire, water, and nets is all entirely useless unless your DM homebrews the spell to do more than it says it does. Normally, Magic Missile is radically better than Catapult.
That is not true. You would actually have to homebrew for this NOT to work. This is very clearly RAW. Here is the verbiage from the catapult spell, note items underlinded:
"Choose one object weighing 1 to 5 pounds within range that isn’t being worn or carried. The object flies in a straight line up to 90 feet in a direction you choose before falling to the ground, stopping early if it impacts against a solid surface. If the object would strike a creature, that creature must make a Dexterity saving throw. On a failed save, the object strikes the target and stops moving. When the object strikes something, the object and what it strikes each take 3d8 bludgeoning damage."
Oil, Acid, Holy Water and Alchemists fire all are objects weighing 1 pound, all of them can be catapulted. RAW a bottle has 2 hit points, so it would shatter on impact from the damage. These items all have descriptions regarding what happens to a target when they hit it and shatter. In addition to the effect from the liquid, the target would also take the 3d8 from the spell.
As far as a net, it too weighs 1 pound. Note the underlined description of the net:
A Large or smaller creature hit by a net is Restrained until it is freed. A net has no Effect on creatures that are formless, or Creatures that are Huge or larger. A creature can use its Action to make a DC 10 Strength check, freeing itself or another creature within its reach on a success. Dealing 5 slashing damage to the net (AC 10) also frees the creature without harming it, Ending the Effect and destroying the net.
When you catapult the net and the target fails its save it is hit by the net and thus restrained as well as taking 3d8 bludgeoning from the spell.
Now you can homebrew the spell or those items so they do not do what they say, but RAW this very clearly works and it makes catapult MUCH more effective than magic missile as long as you can afford quality items to hurl.
I played a Rabbitfolk character all the way through and my main spell was MM. It was quite enjoyable and at level 20 the damage was insane. I was a Wizard 1, Hexblade Warlock 1, Fighter 2, Twilight Druid 16. First Round: Bonus Action: Hexblades Curse, Action:9th Level MM(11 darts) with Curse it hits for 1d4+7 per dart. Then use 8d10 per dart on the spell due to Harvest's Scythe ability from Twilight Circle. Action Surge for 8th level MM(10 darts) for the same damage. One turn hits an average of over 1,000 damage! The only problem is facing Spellcasters who might have Shield or Counterspell. And then there's a Damned Tarrasque, but still very fun from level 1-20.
I could see it being useful for disrupting concentration. Just depends on if the DM says you add all the damage together and then make one concentration check (the darts hit simultaneously) or if they roll for each dart. Sure a DC 10 save isn’t that hard to make but having to make three (or more if upcast) in one turn could cause a failed save.
Hate to say it but i've seen so many instances of something big on its last legs in a fight and a wiz/sorc tries to hit it with a save spell and it passes or a attack spell and misses where MM would of finished it off. I find it hard to just write off guaranteed damage with 120 foot range that can also hit multiple targets if needed. I find its the only lvl 1 spell I'm hanging onto as I level higher and higher.
Get the wand drop the spell.
It depends on if your DM rules every missile is a separate concentration check.
If not dump it by level 5,
your cantrips will start to out damage it by then, maybe pick up mind sliver or something with a check rather than an attack roll.
If so, then keep it indefinitely for knocking out high level concentration spells if you are facing any kind of casters.
If that is the case then it each bolt should also cause hex damage. If you get hex with the fey touched feat you can do a and extra d6 damage on every missile. which makes it over all a very respectable damage when you consider that it cant miss.
Im currently level 7 and magic missile is still a good spell for me... so i suggest you keep it
Love is like the wind, you can't see it but you can feel it...
But anyway since it's your characte just drop it whenever you want
Love is like the wind, you can't see it but you can feel it...
Hex does not work with Magic Missile because it require a attack roll to trigger, thus auto hit spells and spells that require a spell save does not trigger it. Hexblade's Curse however does work because it adds damage to a damage roll. Another way to bump up MM damage is 10 levels of Evocation Wizard.
In terms of when to drop it, MM is a spell that you either love or are indifferent to so if I was playing an Evocation Wizard or dipping into Hexblade Warlock I would have MM on my spell list all the time. However if I am not trying to improve it I find myself not considering learning it the vast majority of the time.
Depends on who you're fighting. If you're facing casters without proficiency in con. saves, hold onto it. Especially if they happen to rely upon spells that require concentration. It's possible to brute force your way into having them break concentration by having them roll multiple times each time you send magic missiles their way.
Magic missile is an excellent way to force a lot of concentration checks as well.
I never drop Magic Missile on any character I can get it on. Once the damage stops being as useful, it's the perfect thing to use against enemy spellcasters. They have to make a separate concentration check on every missile hit.
There's only two ways they can stop it - either shield or counterspell, and you can avoid the latter if you're more than 60 ft away when you cast it. Either way it burns their reaction.
Forcing someone to make 3 or more concentration checks gives you a pretty good chance of breaking concentration.
I've also used it to wake everyone in the party up who got hit by a Sleep spell.
But the question is, does it actually force multiple concentration saves? I had thought so, but since, according to JC you roll once and each missile does that damage. And they hit simultaneously so it is only one instance of damage. So I can see a DM ruling you take the total damage and that is what the save is made against.
I don’t know if there has been anything official on the matter
It's a very difficult choice.
Firstly figure out if your GM is doing one save or multiple saves for each volley. If it's one save than the spell is pretty useless fairly early on as it just gets outstripped in regard to damage with ONE exception. If multiple saves than you'll want to keep it around for a while.
The one exception is if you are in a PvP-heavy setting and NEED to be able to kill someone. A MM can easily knock-down and kill a very weakened foe or something similar. While this is exceedingly unlikely outside of a PvP setting it's certainly worth noting that being able to hit a foe twice quickly and jump up the number of hits to finish multiple foes and not have to worry about AC/saves/whatever either is useful in such a thing.
If it forces multiple saves... Then what class are you? There's little doubt it will stick in for a while as it's a great way to pop enemy concentration and finish off annoying foes. Attacking a save is nice but not only can enemies save, some of them will have high saves in whatever you wanna cast or some sort of damage resistance so being able to bypass that all for a quick and easy kill...
But you'll soon hit a problem. The Sorc Spell limit. The simple fact is that Sorcs don't get a lot of spells. It's not that bad early on when you know 6-9 spells + cantrips and your spell slots cap out at 4th level, but as you level it's gonna get stretched thinner and thinner and thinner. You'll likely want to capitalize on that high-level stuff, but that means you'll need to make cuts elsewhere. If you're looking to get something like Crown of Stars and have to choose between Magic Missile, which will be good only for breaking concentrations, and Polymorph, which has a wide variety of uses, then MM is gonna have to go. You might keep it around just so that those level 1 slots can be used for something other than spell point fodder, but your focus is gonna be on the more powerful stuff.
If you're multiclassing then it depends on how much you're planning to dip either way. I feel like the definitive point where it will be on the potential chopping block will be level 9 when you gain access to level 5 spells and need to start trimming every little bit of fat possible.
I generally don't ever get it. In any case I can't see keeping it past 3rd level. If I was playing a pure backline caster who does save 1st level slots for shield, I would probably have catapult as my 1st level damage spell.
Once you have a couple hundred gold catapult is generally better than Magic missile because you can use it to hurl oil, acid, alchemists fire, holy water and nets.
I don't face enemies that are making concentration checks enough to make that a deciding factor.
I also want to point out that concentration saves are not 50/50 or anything like that. Due to their low damage it will never be more than a DC10. You're basically hoping you're fighting foes who don't have solid con scores (admittedly a decent assumption for casters) so there's even a chance of them missing without a nat 1.
Hurling oil, acid, fire, water, and nets is all entirely useless unless your DM homebrews the spell to do more than it says it does. Normally, Magic Missile is radically better than Catapult.
That is not true. You would actually have to homebrew for this NOT to work. This is very clearly RAW. Here is the verbiage from the catapult spell, note items underlinded:
"Choose one object weighing 1 to 5 pounds within range that isn’t being worn or carried. The object flies in a straight line up to 90 feet in a direction you choose before falling to the ground, stopping early if it impacts against a solid surface. If the object would strike a creature, that creature must make a Dexterity saving throw. On a failed save, the object strikes the target and stops moving. When the object strikes something, the object and what it strikes each take 3d8 bludgeoning damage."
Oil, Acid, Holy Water and Alchemists fire all are objects weighing 1 pound, all of them can be catapulted. RAW a bottle has 2 hit points, so it would shatter on impact from the damage. These items all have descriptions regarding what happens to a target when they hit it and shatter. In addition to the effect from the liquid, the target would also take the 3d8 from the spell.
As far as a net, it too weighs 1 pound. Note the underlined description of the net:
A Large or smaller creature hit by a net is Restrained until it is freed. A net has no Effect on creatures that are formless, or Creatures that are Huge or larger. A creature can use its Action to make a DC 10 Strength check, freeing itself or another creature within its reach on a success. Dealing 5 slashing damage to the net (AC 10) also frees the creature without harming it, Ending the Effect and destroying the net.
When you catapult the net and the target fails its save it is hit by the net and thus restrained as well as taking 3d8 bludgeoning from the spell.
Now you can homebrew the spell or those items so they do not do what they say, but RAW this very clearly works and it makes catapult MUCH more effective than magic missile as long as you can afford quality items to hurl.
I honestly never take it as a Sorcerer, the spells known are too tight.