Shadow of Moil in XGtE, I just hit 14th level, and it is the only 4th-level spell I still have. It also layers really well with Armor of Agathys if you are playing a bladelock or simply find yourself in melee more often than not.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Bark side up, bark side down, it really, truly does not matter.
As far as I understand the rules, it does give you advantage on your attack roles and disadvantage to attack roles against you. Being heavily obscured means that people trying to see you are effectively blinded. It is like a person sized Darkness spell.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Bark side up, bark side down, it really, truly does not matter.
Greater Invisibility is another nice Warlock spell. Unfortunately is concentration as well. Lets you attack and cast spells and remain invisible so disadvantage on targeting you and advantage on hitting them.
Before taking Shadow of Moil, check with your DM about whether s/he allows darkvision to see through the obscurement. About half of all monsters have darkvision, so this will drastically reduce the value of SoM. (Remember that 5E darkvision does not distinguish between normal and magical darkness; blocking darkvision is a special property of the Darkness spell.)
Banishment is always good, though. Put a normal enemy on time out; permanently banish an extraplanar foe; or send yourself home if you get trapped on another plane.
Before taking Shadow of Moil, check with your DM about whether s/he allows darkvision to see through the obscurement. About half of all monsters have darkvision, so this will drastically reduce the value of SoM. (Remember that 5E darkvision does not distinguish between normal and magical darkness; blocking darkvision is a special property of the Darkness spell.)
Banishment is always good, though. Put a normal enemy on time out; permanently banish an extraplanar foe; or send yourself home if you get trapped on another plane.
Then what is the use of the Invocation "Devil´s Sight"?
You can see normally in darkness, both magical and nonmagical, to a distance of 120 feet.
And heres from the race selection on the character generator:
Darkvision
Thanks to your infernal heritage, you have superior vision in dark and dim conditions. You can see in dim light within 60 feet of you as if it were bright light, and in darkness as if it were dim light. You can’t discern color in darkness, only shades of gray.
Doesnt say anything about breaching magical darkness. And if it did, that would make the Warlock invocation useless to all but a few races in the 5e setting.
I'm just about sick of Darkvision. Why is it that every single bloody race seems to have Darkvision now? It makes theming downright impossible; and makes stupid things like a lamp, or the light spell completely useless.
Considering the Players Handbook, Players Companion, and Dungeon Masters Guide there are the following races with and without Darkvision, that are currently playable.
Races with Darkvision (9, 14 if counting subraces): Dwarves (Both Hill & Mountain) Elves (All 3; High, Wood, and Drow), Gnomes (All 3; Forest, Rock & Deep), Half-Elves, Half-Orcs, Tieflings, Genasi (Fire), Eladrin, Aasimar.
Remember also that Drow and Deep Gnomes have SUPERIOR Darkvision! Which let's them see 120ft in darkness and discern colour in darkness. What the hell?!
Considering the races without darkvision are considerably rarer (except Humans), than the races with darkvision, this means darkvision is the NORM! How is that right? Magically being able to see with your eyes, light sensory organs, in the absence of light... is NORMAL!? Why? What makes Human and Halfling eyes so utterly ?
Now maybe you're thinking, "Yeah, but it's because the players want to play cool races... the cool races probably have darkvision, but it's likely not the norm for everything", which couldn't be more wrong. When it comes to monsters that get darkvision, well it's pretty much every major monster you're ever likely to use...
Is your campaign set in a forest area, traditional D&D fare... well don't bother hiding in the dark because the following traditional staples all have darkvision: Goblins, Orcs, Kobolds, Gnolls, Bugbears, Ogres, Trolls, Hobgoblins, Troglodytes, Ettin and Gargoyles... (and this is not an exhaustive list).
Is your campaign set in a swamp, jungle, at sea, or around water; a chance to use those amphibious or water based monsters. Well darkness again means nothing as the following again all have darkvision: Sahuagin, Yuan-Ti, Merrow, Kuo-Tao (Frogmen), Slaad... the only major staple I could find that doesn't are Lizardmen.
Aaah, but maybe you're going for a more magic heavy campaign, based around traveling the planes and facing magical beings. Again, darkness is incidental: Every single breed of Angel, Demon and Devil had darkvision (most have superior darkvision) or truesight; so hiding is pointless. OVER 30 different variants of being and the ALL have darkvision. Then there's Genies, all 4 variants have darkvision. Constructs? All Golems, and pretty much every construct has darkvision. So do all Elementals, and all Mephits; so pretty much every creature a Wizard might summon.
OK, but what about going into the feywild? Well, all Elves and Eladrin already have darkvision, but then there's Nymphs, Formorian, Umber Hulk and Oni who all have darkvision too... so yeah, everything there has darkvision as well it seems, except Pixies for some reason, they get screwed over...
Well, what about deep dungeons, or more obscure creatures. Well, Gryphons and Yetis both have darkvision! Why? Who the hell knows but they do. Myconids are mushroom people, really cool monsters, with darkvision. Rakshasa are tiger-people and they have darkvision. All the old "Greek Legend" monsters, such as the Medusa, Hags, Minotaur etc. all have darkvision. Hell, even the damn Stone Giant has darkvision.
Well, maybe you're playing a cleric or paladin centric campaign and face a lot of undead... Bad news, literally every single undead I could find in the entire ing monster manual has darkvision. I mean literally everything: Death Knight, Ghost, Ghast, Ghoul, Lich, Mummy, Revenant, Skeleton, Vampire, Wight, Wraith, even the damn Zombie... they ALL have Darkvision.
So then the question remains, what about all the creatures from the Underdark and similar areas (dependent on setting), your Beholders, Mind Flayers, Duergers, Drow, Quaggoths, Deep Gnomes and more... well, they all have SUPERIOR Darkvision! Because that makes sense.
Considering the Dragonborn, Aarakocra, Genasi, and Goliaths are described as being rare; and only one of them is actually in the players handbook anyway. What we've got is a situation where Humans and Halflings are effectively blind. You may as well be playing a blind character. Every other major playable race and practically every monster or antagonist race you face has darkvision. Oh, yes, and let's not forget Dragons; this is Dungeons & Dragons after all. Yes, every single type of dragon has darkvision; even the bloody Half-Dragon has darkvision.
The only major races I could find that didn't have darkvision other than the ones above, are Merfolk, Lizardmen, Lycanthrobes, Pixies and Gith. THAT'S IT! And Merfolk are one of the few races that it would make sense for them to have darkvision because it's very dark in deep water.
Now am I the only one who thinks this is just a little bit excessive? Surely others agree that giving practically every race on the planet darkvision is pretty dickish. It screws over anyone trying to stealth, it makes spells like darkness pointless because almost everything that isn't a human can see though it. It destroys the point in having candles, lanterns, the light spell, and so many more utilities. It makes me question why any civilisation would bother having light when everyone bar Humans and Halflings can see in the ing dark. Are underground Dwarven holds pitch black? Do Elven buildings lack windows and any form of artificial light, after all, why bother when you can see fine in utter darkness? This strikes me as just so utterly stupid.
So do others agree, and if so, would you house rule a change to this?
Devil's Sight is useful because a) it penetrates the Darkness spell, which has a special clause blocking darkvision, b) it does not impose a Perception penalty in total darkness, and c) it has superior range to most races' darkvision.
Nothing in the rules you quoted indicates that darkvision is blocked by magical darkness from a source other than the Darkness spell. That's from previous editions. Lots of DMs will run it like older editions, though, or allow SoM obscurement to work regardless, which is why you should ask.
After a quick web search, it seems like the prevailing opinion is that this spell also provides a disadvantage for creatures with darkvision...as you are heavily obscured by flame like spooky-a$$ shadows. It is hard to believe that a 4th level spell would be so easily defeated by EVERY monster in the dungeon! Doesn’t seem RAI to me...
Shadows of Moil and Banishment are great spells but I'd like to point out the downsides of those spells.
With Shadows of Moil, you need to remember it's an emanation spell. This means you really have to take positioning into account. If you cast it, are you catching party members in it's radius? Given it's only 10', this isn't hard but it also means you need to be surrounded to really make this spell worth it. Not all warlocks will want to be that close to the enemy. Balance this with the advantage/disadvantage effect and the fact the necrotic damage doesn't have a save.
Banishment is widely considered a boss killer or at least a spell that will drastically reduce the difficulty of an encounter. A charisma saving throw proficiency isn't as rare as you might think. Honestly, it's a good spell to take but consider the enemies you're facing. Dragons, undead and constructs usually have CHA proficiencies. A lot of 'named' enemies from adventures also have CHA proficiency. For a warlock, a target saving is much more painful than for a wizard or sorcerer. One monster saves and that's half your arsenal gone. This spell is rather high risk and high reward.
Depending on your current spell selection, I would suggest you consider Sickening Radiance. It's a CON save but if you have Repelling Blast, forcing monsters back into the hazard area will force them to save again and again. The prevention of invisibility and the level of exhaustion are also nice conditions to add. If your party's encounters are generally short of duration, you might want to reconsider, as that won't give you time to really make the best of this tactic. Dimension Door or Misty Step (if you don't have it) are also good options. Mobility or a quick escape are always nice to have.
If you can keep an opponent in it, Sickening Radiance is brutal! Banishment is a great spell too.
Like any area-effect spell, it works great if you have Repelling Blast, or Grasp of Hadar.
"Oh, he ran out of the Sickening Radiance area? Blast! Blast! Blast! Now he's back in it." Also, even if you can't keep the enemy in it, he's still got a level of Exhaustion which ain't bad.
My 4th level spells are Sickening Radiance, Banishment, Charm Monster, and Dimension Door. Most of those have been spoken for in this thread. Charm Monster I've found very useful as it fills a niche no one else in my party has covered.
Blight isn't bad but it's single target and doesn't work on constructs or undead. With undead being common in most adventures that could be problematic. It's also a CON save for half, which isn't great for a high risk/reward type spell. Sure, even halved the damage is pretty good but those limitations make it less appealing. Heck, Mind Spike (2nd level spell) can do 6d8 with a 5th level slot, is a WIS save for half and it does psychic damage. It also has a few other nice side effects. Shatter (again a 2nd level spell) also does 6d8 with a 5th level slot, with a CON save but is a 20' sphere.
I love the warlock class but for some spells, the bang isn't worth the buck.
Blight isn't bad but it's single target and doesn't work on constructs or undead. With undead being common in most adventures that could be problematic. It's also a CON save for half, which isn't great for a high risk/reward type spell. Sure, even halved the damage is pretty good but those limitations make it less appealing. Heck, Mind Spike (2nd level spell) can do 6d8 with a 5th level slot, is a WIS save for half and it does psychic damage. It also has a few other nice side effects. Shatter (again a 2nd level spell) also does 6d8 with a 5th level slot, with a CON save but is a 20' sphere.
I love the warlock class but for some spells, the bang isn't worth the buck.
What he/she said!
I dont use Blight due to the con save. To hard to get through on the ones needing a high damage spell sentered on them.
Just hit 7th level...any good suggestions for the best 4th level warlock spells?
Shadow of Moil in XGtE, I just hit 14th level, and it is the only 4th-level spell I still have. It also layers really well with Armor of Agathys if you are playing a bladelock or simply find yourself in melee more often than not.
Bark side up, bark side down, it really, truly does not matter.
Does this spell give you advantage on attack rolls and/or disadvantage to Attackers? What are the benefits of being heavy obscured?
Dimension Door is nifty and always helpfull. I keep using it alot!
If you can keep an opponent in it, Sickening Radiance is brutal! Banishment is a great spell too.
Professional computer geek
As far as I understand the rules, it does give you advantage on your attack roles and disadvantage to attack roles against you. Being heavily obscured means that people trying to see you are effectively blinded. It is like a person sized Darkness spell.
Bark side up, bark side down, it really, truly does not matter.
Alright Banishment and Shadow of Moil seem like the best options. So many freaking concentration in me spell book!
Greater Invisibility is another nice Warlock spell. Unfortunately is concentration as well. Lets you attack and cast spells and remain invisible so disadvantage on targeting you and advantage on hitting them.
Greater Invisibility isn't a warlock spell though unfortunately. I wish it was, i'd have taken it!
Professional computer geek
Only the Archfey Warlock has access to that spell...I am playing a Hexblade. Great spell though!
Before taking Shadow of Moil, check with your DM about whether s/he allows darkvision to see through the obscurement. About half of all monsters have darkvision, so this will drastically reduce the value of SoM. (Remember that 5E darkvision does not distinguish between normal and magical darkness; blocking darkvision is a special property of the Darkness spell.)
Banishment is always good, though. Put a normal enemy on time out; permanently banish an extraplanar foe; or send yourself home if you get trapped on another plane.
And heres from the race selection on the character generator:
Devil's Sight is useful because a) it penetrates the Darkness spell, which has a special clause blocking darkvision, b) it does not impose a Perception penalty in total darkness, and c) it has superior range to most races' darkvision.
Nothing in the rules you quoted indicates that darkvision is blocked by magical darkness from a source other than the Darkness spell. That's from previous editions. Lots of DMs will run it like older editions, though, or allow SoM obscurement to work regardless, which is why you should ask.
After a quick web search, it seems like the prevailing opinion is that this spell also provides a disadvantage for creatures with darkvision...as you are heavily obscured by flame like spooky-a$$ shadows. It is hard to believe that a 4th level spell would be so easily defeated by EVERY monster in the dungeon! Doesn’t seem RAI to me...
Discussed here as well. And I also tweeted Jeremy E. Crawford and asked him about it.
Shadows of Moil and Banishment are great spells but I'd like to point out the downsides of those spells.
With Shadows of Moil, you need to remember it's an emanation spell. This means you really have to take positioning into account. If you cast it, are you catching party members in it's radius? Given it's only 10', this isn't hard but it also means you need to be surrounded to really make this spell worth it. Not all warlocks will want to be that close to the enemy. Balance this with the advantage/disadvantage effect and the fact the necrotic damage doesn't have a save.
Banishment is widely considered a boss killer or at least a spell that will drastically reduce the difficulty of an encounter. A charisma saving throw proficiency isn't as rare as you might think. Honestly, it's a good spell to take but consider the enemies you're facing. Dragons, undead and constructs usually have CHA proficiencies. A lot of 'named' enemies from adventures also have CHA proficiency. For a warlock, a target saving is much more painful than for a wizard or sorcerer. One monster saves and that's half your arsenal gone. This spell is rather high risk and high reward.
Depending on your current spell selection, I would suggest you consider Sickening Radiance. It's a CON save but if you have Repelling Blast, forcing monsters back into the hazard area will force them to save again and again. The prevention of invisibility and the level of exhaustion are also nice conditions to add. If your party's encounters are generally short of duration, you might want to reconsider, as that won't give you time to really make the best of this tactic. Dimension Door or Misty Step (if you don't have it) are also good options. Mobility or a quick escape are always nice to have.
My 4th level spells are Sickening Radiance, Banishment, Charm Monster, and Dimension Door. Most of those have been spoken for in this thread. Charm Monster I've found very useful as it fills a niche no one else in my party has covered.
What about Blight? That’s 9d8 damage with a 5th level slot. Anyone high on this spell?
Blight isn't bad but it's single target and doesn't work on constructs or undead. With undead being common in most adventures that could be problematic. It's also a CON save for half, which isn't great for a high risk/reward type spell. Sure, even halved the damage is pretty good but those limitations make it less appealing. Heck, Mind Spike (2nd level spell) can do 6d8 with a 5th level slot, is a WIS save for half and it does psychic damage. It also has a few other nice side effects. Shatter (again a 2nd level spell) also does 6d8 with a 5th level slot, with a CON save but is a 20' sphere.
I love the warlock class but for some spells, the bang isn't worth the buck.